ESPN Audio: Jared Allen on Flozell Adams and Doug Free

[Eskimo]

I don't think that I said that I hated Free or that he would never challenge for a starting role.I think he has shown enough to challenge for a starting spot but I don't think that he's a lock to be a starter.As of right now I think Free has shown that he's an adequate swing tackle that could challenge for a starting role.

Craig

Well considering he has graded out as our best OL over the last stretch of the season, I suppose you could say our whole line is bad and there may be some truth to that anyways.

Nevertheless, since he is our youngest and currently best performing OL we might as well put him out there.

The rest of the OL needs to be upgraded ASAP as it is holding us back.

 

[jterrell]

Really didn't talk about it too much - maybe 20 seconds. Basically said Flo was a good player with size, long arms and good athletic ability and recovery ability. He didn't know much about Free coming into the game other than he had mostly played RT and was the backup the week of the game.

He basically said when Free came in he was in a tough spot. There was no way he wanted the backup to block him so he said he was going after the QB full force.

My commentary on this:

Of course, the irony is that he got no sacks against Free at all. The sack he got was when he got a 1-on-1 matchup against Witten on that first play. I don't know if Free made a mistake there in the moment or if that was a case of the Vikings exposing a flaw in our blocking scheme in that situation. Regardless, Free held Allen without a sack.

Most of the damage was on Kosier and Colombo but Davis and Gurode had their share of breakdowns blocking some of the stunts.

Free was supposed to fall back and pick up Allen but he didn't.

Free did do a solid job most of the day but he seldom had Allen 1v1.

One of the reasons the middle of our line looked so bad was in trying to shift Jared's way and help Free.

We flat stunk across the line but that stinking came about when Flo went out.

Free wasn't horrible but he hardly replaced Adams and did the same job.

 

[jterrell]

Not my opinion, you can check out profootballfocus.com where they chart and rank performance of each player for each game. While there may be systemic bias against one team, it would be hard to see why they would be biased against certain players on a team.

Anyway, their analysis of the Vikings game was pretty clear:

Flo was pretty bad - (mediocre run blocking, 4 pressures in just over a quarter)

Colombo was horrific. (mediocre run blocking, 2 sacks, 2 QB hits, 6 pressures)

Free was okay. (below average run blocking, 2 pressures)

Kosier was bad. (good run blocking, 5 pressures, 1 penalty)

Gurode was bad. (mediocre run blocking, 4 pressures)

Davis was very bad. (bad run blocking, 2 pressures)

It's not that it is biased it's that it is ignorant. For instance they will give the Jared Allen sack to Witten when Witten was merely supposed to chip him letting Free drop back. Garrett didn't intend to man up Jared Allen on Witten.

Free had a good season and it gives me hope that he can really develop but anyone with eyes could see the difference in blocking schemes when Flo went out. PFF needs a separate line in their metrics for assists. Scoring out Flozell and Columbo on the year at a level with Roy Williams proves their grading is wholly inaccurate.

 

[craig71]

Well considering he has graded out as our best OL over the last stretch of the season, I suppose you could say our whole line is bad and there may be some truth to that anyways.

Nevertheless, since he is our youngest and currently best performing OL we might as well put him out there.

The rest of the OL needs to be upgraded ASAP as it is holding us back.

I think Free will get a shot in TC.I think that shot will be against Columbo.

I do agree that an infusion of youth is needed along the o-line but I don't know that Free is the answer.I guess TC will go a long ways in determining if Free is a legitimate player or not.

I also think that part of the problem with the o-line is that the individual players grade out better than the unit.I think that they need to add more power at LG or that they need to go to more athletic lineman.Right now they have a mix of power and finesse that doesn't mesh all that well at times.

Craig

 

[Eskimo]

It's not that it is biased it's that it is ignorant. For instance they will give the Jared Allen sack to Witten when Witten was merely supposed to chip him letting Free drop back. Garrett didn't intend to man up Jared Allen on Witten.

Free had a good season and it gives me hope that he can really develop but anyone with eyes could see the difference in blocking schemes when Flo went out. PFF needs a separate line in their metrics for assists. Scoring out Flozell and Columbo on the year at a level with Roy Williams proves their grading is wholly inaccurate.

Their metrics don't allow direct comparisons between different positions but you can see how a player ranks at his position in the league.

I agree their metrics are quite incomplete as they don't have coaches film to get different views and they don't definitely know who was supposed to do what on any given play.

As for the Allen vs. Witten sack I too suspect Free made a mistake there as he seemed to give Kosier a double-team assist which probably wasn't needed and then tries to come over and help Witten. But I also think Witten was supposed to re-direct Allen to Free but he hardly even tried to throw a block out there at all. That was just a bad play. Free would have and did do better on his own.

One thing I'll say about Witten is that he is a good run blocker but he is a terrible pass blocker. The number of times I've seen him get totally manhandled pass blocking just irritates the heck out of me. Bennett is a much better pass blocker and if you wanted to give Free help from a TE, then that is the guy who should have been out there.

 

[Eskimo]

I think Free will get a shot in TC.I think that shot will be against Columbo.

I do agree that an infusion of youth is needed along the o-line but I don't know that Free is the answer.I guess TC will go a long ways in determining if Free is a legitimate player or not.

I also think that part of the problem with the o-line is that the individual players grade out better than the unit.I think that they need to add more power at LG or that they need to go to more athletic lineman.Right now they have a mix of power and finesse that doesn't mesh all that well at times.

Craig

You're right about mish-mash of styles. I do think the fellow who really doesn't fit is Kosier who is a true finesse player whereas the other guys are power players. However, Flo and Colombo aren't very good drive blockers anymore. Davis is an incredible drive blocker except when he totally whiffs. Gurode is okay at both styles.

I do think we are best to go with more of a finesse line. We still may as well use Davis as a grader POA type player since we are stuck with that gargantuan of a contract.

If you look at the skill players, they probably fit more of a finesse type of line scheme. If we put in Free and draft a new athletic RT then we probably have a capable line. At some point, probably all the old guys need to go in the next 3-5 years. Kosier is probably the next to go. Gurode and Davis still seem to have quite a bit of gas in the tank.

I think Felix could be electric with a finesse OL and the two blocking TEs. Miles, Ogletree, Felix and Choice all look like they are excellent at running screens.

 

[jterrell]

You're right about mish-mash of styles. I do think the fellow who really doesn't fit is Kosier who is a true finesse player whereas the other guys are power players. However, Flo and Colombo aren't very good drive blockers anymore. Davis is an incredible drive blocker except when he totally whiffs. Gurode is okay at both styles.

I do think we are best to go with more of a finesse line. We still may as well use Davis as a grader POA type player since we are stuck with that gargantuan of a contract.

If you look at the skill players, they probably fit more of a finesse type of line scheme. If we put in Free and draft a new athletic RT then we probably have a capable line. At some point, probably all the old guys need to go in the next 3-5 years. Kosier is probably the next to go. Gurode and Davis still seem to have quite a bit of gas in the tank.

I think Felix could be electric with a finesse OL and the two blocking TEs. Miles, Ogletree, Felix and Choice all look like they are excellent at running screens.

Bro, Flo graded out the 3rd best run blocking LT in football by PFF.

We can't replace 4 Power OL if we want to. We don't have the finesse guys to replace them with. We have two finesse OL on the entire team in Free/Kosier.

Dallas just drafted Brewster last draft and he is 325 pounds so I'd say finesse is not the way they are going along the OL. Until we replace the OL coach you can be sure it's more hogs.

Kosier gives them a guy who can trap. pull and play on the move but it does cause issues when they line up a couple of 325 pound DTs against us.

 

[craig71]

You're right about mish-mash of styles. I do think the fellow who really doesn't fit is Kosier who is a true finesse player whereas the other guys are power players. However, Flo and Colombo aren't very good drive blockers anymore. Davis is an incredible drive blocker except when he totally whiffs. Gurode is okay at both styles.

I do think we are best to go with more of a finesse line. We still may as well use Davis as a grader POA type player since we are stuck with that gargantuan of a contract.

If you look at the skill players, they probably fit more of a finesse type of line scheme. If we put in Free and draft a new athletic RT then we probably have a capable line. At some point, probably all the old guys need to go in the next 3-5 years. Kosier is probably the next to go. Gurode and Davis still seem to have quite a bit of gas in the tank.

I think Felix could be electric with a finesse OL and the two blocking TEs. Miles, Ogletree, Felix and Choice all look like they are excellent at running screens.

I would think that Kosier would be the most likely starter replaced on the line followed by Columbo(2010).I'm still a fan of the big/powerful o-line as compared to the finesse blockers.There are some athletic big guys out there,you just have to find them.I also think that Felix will be electric regardless of the blocking scheme.It will be interesting to see how they draft.The draft could offer some clues as to what direction they see this team going in the future.

Craig

 

[Eskimo]

Bro, Flo graded out the 3rd best run blocking LT in football by PFF.

We can't replace 4 Power OL if we want to. We don't have the finesse guys to replace them with. We have two finesse OL on the entire team in Free/Kosier.

Dallas just drafted Brewster last draft and he is 325 pounds so I'd say finesse is not the way they are going along the OL. Until we replace the OL coach you can be sure it's more hogs.

Kosier gives them a guy who can trap. pull and play on the move but it does cause issues when they line up a couple of 325 pound DTs against us.

But Colombo and Flo are probably not part of our long-term planning. Flo is not going to last and Colombo isn't good enough. I also think Kosier is wearing down so he may not be able to play too much longer.

So now you have Davis, Free and Gurode with two spots up in the air.

When I say I want a more athletic line, that doesn't mean I want a line that gets driven 5 yards back into the backfield. It means I want guys who can run and keep their balance and hit moving targets in space. People always talk about Free as some lightweight but I think he is 315 pounds so he isn't exactly small. You can also see that most of that is muscle unlike Gurode who carries a fair bit of blubber on him.

With Brewster, I think they are grooming him for RT so 325 pounds is probably just league average for that spot these days. I don't know what kind of an athlete he is.

That leaves the LG spot a bit in the air if they hit on Free and Brewster. I would like a guy who is great at pulling and running out on screens so we can send Free and him out there to destroy people. I'd also like to pull him like we do to run behind Davis who is probably the best drive blocking Guard in the league. When he locks onto someone, he pretty much moves them wherever he wants to. That's how we got so much yardage against Philly - running behind Davis who was mauling everyone, and Free was winning the battle by outquicking and then walling off his guy - it was a thing of beauty.

At this point, we can go either way. I don't think we need to be too concerned with Flo and Colombo who look like they are on their last legs to me. I want guys who can run so we can use Felix ability to run in the open field - when you have a talent like that, you build your team around it.