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ESPN: Debunking the Dak contract debate

Discussion in 'Fan Zone' started by Nav22, Jun 1, 2020.

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  1. DFWJC

    DFWJC Well-Known Member

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    Eventually, they'll install a rule that says no player can make more than certain percentage of the salary cap. It takes no money away from the players in aggregate, but adds sanity to single salaries on a team roster that has 40-50 other players.
    If cap continues to rise, then all boats rise, including the top dogs'.
    NotForLong and Dhragon like this.
  2. DFWJC

    DFWJC Well-Known Member

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    Debatable if he's better than Wentz.
    If you did a poll league-wide it would be interesting.
    But most think he's passed up the overpaid Goff.
    jjktkk likes this.
  3. CouchCoach

    CouchCoach Well-Known Member

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    Could happen, the QB's are outnumbered and they did address the rookie deals when they were totally out of hand.
    NotForLong likes this.
  4. glimmerman

    glimmerman Well-Known Member

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    What QB does not have a hard time against great teams. Here is what I don’t understand, people expect 1 player to beat a whole team.

    So he has to throw the passes make the blocks catch the ball and tackle the opposing teams QB and kick the FG. It’s a team game.

    Most QB stats are lower against great teams. Very few QB can take a team and carry them on there backs. What we have is a good QB that’s improving every year. Who knows where his ceiling is. I don’t think he has reached it yet. He is a gamer. May not practice well but one thing people used to say about him was he plays well when the spot light is on him. Now all the sudden he don’t play well against great teams. Then you see stats where he ranks right up there with other top 10 QB’s against top 10 defenses.

    People cherry picks stats to fit there narrative.

    JJ and SJ say he is our guy so pay him and let’s move on. Then we can talk about how good or bad he is playing and if he is over paid. This is just like Romo when he was here and about to get a huge contract. Ya know Marino never got a ring but has all these nice stats. He got paid well back then. Same as a list of other QB. It’s a team game.
  5. SackMaster

    SackMaster Well-Known Member

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    While I have absolutely no complaints about this criticism, I think this was an issue with the Cowboys even before Dak was playing college football.

    I am waiting in anticipation to see if moving on from a Head Coach that was lost more often than not in "big games" does not show significant difference in the Top Team / Top Defense games.

    Again, it was not all on the coach, but we have had two really good QBs that have had issues with better teams / defenses. Then add that the previous Coach could RARELY win without one of those two QBs in the lineup. I would not expect winning records with backup QBs, but he was something like 3-18 (didn't double check) without Romo or Dak starting, and that is really, really bad.
    darthseinfeld and 817Gill like this.
  6. Nav22

    Nav22 Benched

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    If they’re both on the field, it’s somewhat debatable but the numbers still favor Dak.

    But the reality is that Wentz has ended his last 3 seasons with an injury, and the last 2 of those injuries weren’t SO severe that he had no choice but to sit out.

    Wentz is soft. He’s also been trashed anonymously by teammates multiple times.

    So it appears that Dak destroys him in durability and leadership as well.
    Hennessy_King likes this.
  7. CouchCoach

    CouchCoach Well-Known Member

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    Until Wentz can prove he can stay on the field, I've got Prescott ahead of him but the gist of this seems to be being satisfied with what they've got. And with their track record getting QB's, hard to argue that.

    The one thing I will argue with the Dakaters is that he's not the reason the team hasn't done better. He's good enough to get the job done. One thing Goff and Wentz have had, better D's to support the QB. So did Mahomes and Rodgers and Brady has had that most of his career.

    With what the Cowboys have committed to so few players, they're going to have to hit some homers with more affordable talent. No team in the cap era has ever had the QB-RB-WR at the top in their salaries before.
    glimmerman and Streetwise like this.
  8. DFWJC

    DFWJC Well-Known Member

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    Dak definitely wins the durability contest so far.
    No doubt
    NotForLong, jjktkk and Nav22 like this.

    PAPPYDOG "It was a catchable pass" Zone Supporter

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    Better be sure.....as you've been wrong 2 years running....:muttley:

    P.S.Dak-Zoids as of July 16th....

  10. 817Gill

    817Gill Well-Known Member

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    This is a very fair and factually backed criticism. I do think with better game planning and coaching in-game decision making that can be improved and closer to where it needs to be. He does have to make strides here though for sure.
    jjktkk and SackMaster like this.
  11. DFWJC

    DFWJC Well-Known Member

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    I think Dak has the better offensive weapons over Wentz...especially last year.
    But I've always stayed out of the Dak vs Wentz debates. I just don't feel strongly either way.
    Dak will get paid and we'll see long term.
    Hopefully he helps us get a Lombardi some day.
    NotForLong likes this.
  12. charron

    charron Well-Known Member

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    "It’s full of facts and stats... which means the anti-Dak crew either won’t be smart enough to grasp it or they won’t have the integrity to give it an honest read."
  13. CalPolyTechnique

    CalPolyTechnique Well-Known Member

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    I’m not following the argument...

    What does bringing up Garrett’s record as a coach playing with backup QBs have to do with Dak playing against good defenses?

    Also, if Garrett is being assigned blame then logically he should be assigned credit for Dak’s supposed stellar individual “QB W/L record.”

    I am no fan of Garrett, but we can’t heap praise on Dak and point to his supposed “QB W/L record“ and ignore Garrett, but then turn around and blame Garrett when Dak struggles and the team loses.

    The blame and the credit being assigned is disproportionate.
    NotForLong, jjktkk and WillieBeamen like this.
  14. CouchCoach

    CouchCoach Well-Known Member

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    There are only two QB's that are uncontrollable and discombobulate a DC, Mahomes and Jackson. They will key their D on them and can't stop them, they have to count on them having a bad game as Jackson did in the playoffs and Mahomes was off in the early going. Russell Wilson is 3rd in that area. And that kid in AZ might be the next one like that, he didn't get much coverage last season.

    The Dakaters have yet to offer a suitable replacement and Dalton ain't it. Hoping for Lawrence ain't it. Sometimes a team just has to admit this is the best they can do and go with it.
    glimmerman likes this.
  15. DFWJC

    DFWJC Well-Known Member

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  16. Verdict

    Verdict Well-Known Member

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    Do the 4 year deal, don’t give up tag rights and you have control over him for 6 years, if you want it. If it’s the number of years that is the issue, and not the amount per year, pay him and move on. If he wants an untenable amount per year then make him play on the tag and start looking for a QB.

    This should be a business decision on both ends, not an emotional exercise. I think Dak should not underestimate the value to him outside of football that being the QB of the Cowboys brings to the table. Winning also brings value. There aren’t 5 teams in football that are close to the Cowboys in both.
    glimmerman likes this.
  17. Future

    Future Intramural Legend

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    It doesn't matter if they are "worth what they're getting." No team or player is in the business of offering lowball contracts to correct other teams' overpayments.

    They're comps b/c they got contracts at around the same time and are close to the same age. It's dumb to compare his contract to the likes of Brees, Brady and Rodgers.
    DakPresgoat likes this.
  18. CouchCoach

    CouchCoach Well-Known Member

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    They didn't have a shot at him, had he fallen to 17th, they probably would have taken him.

    And he has the same durability issue as Wentz.
  19. Hardline

    Hardline Well-Known Member

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    Greatly improved production doesn't equal cap busting contract.
  20. CowboysFaninHouston

    CowboysFaninHouston CowboysFaninDC

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    couple of things that explain the stand on each side.

    Projections suggest the league could double its TV rights fees from $7.5 billion to $15 billion.

    In the process, the salary cap could skyrocket. The cap stands at $198.6 million and has jumped by an average of about 6% over the past seven seasons. After the league renegotiates the deals, the cap could jump dramatically. As was the case in the NBA, when players who came free at the right time ended up signing massive deals, NFL players will want to time their free agency for the moment after those rights fees hit if the cap rises by 15-20%.

    The best-case scenario would be for him to strike some middle ground where he signs a deal now and gets to free agency as quickly as possible, which is what we saw from lots of free agents who signed two- and three-year deals this offseason

    that explains why the cowboys want a 5 year deal and dak wants a 4 year deal. that one year could see a 20-25% jump in salaries on average, so the cowboys want to have leverage and Dak wants to hit the market sooner. that also explains why Goff and Wentz were willing to sign extensions earlier than the 4th year so that they could get to FA sooner....


    also, we are not in a position to cycle through QBs. one we have committed a lot of money to a lot of top players, the team as many say has a lot of talent, thus we will probably be drafting in the bottom half of the first round, where finding the right QB is a huge huge gamble.....unless injury bug hits like it did with Romo and couple of other injuries and we end up with 4-12 record and pick in the top 5....otherwise we have set up to make a run over the next 3-4 years, before "tanking", "dumping" and "trading" players to try and reload through the draft. so best case scenario is to sign Dak, make a run with McCarthy, in 4 years, if things didn't work out, you dump and not resign players (lose them to FA perhaps and pick up lots of mid round picks) and you end up with a couple of bad years, couple of years of high draft picks and you hope to find the right QB or cycle through QBs....
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