ESPN Mosley: Ultimate Building Blocks: NFC East

[tomson75]

Eli over Ware? Jacobs over Westbrook? Orakpo?

Good lord, I've insulted Mosley often lately, but this takes the cake. Mosley is a ****ing moron.

 

[lqmac1]

Actually when Newman is healthy, he's the better corner. Asante is the better playmaker.

disagree with ya there

 

[burmafrd]

Nnamdi is considered the best CB in the game right now by a lot of people. Guess what? He plays the same way as Newman does- he makes it a point to STOP receptions not appear on highlight films.

 

[Future]

Why would you ever want to build a team around an LT, DT, or CB?

I think QB, RB, WR, TE, DE/OLB are the only positions worth building an entire team around

 

[jterrell]

It is amazing to me how so many people think so highly of the New York Giants and Eli Manning. DId they not see what the giants did after they lost plax? Guess what? Plax is not coming back. Hakeem Nicks, while he might turn out to be a superstar WILL not be what Burress was to that team next year, PERIOD. The Giants came to Dallas last year and got AMBUSHED, nothing will change this year.

Ya know I thought exactly the same thing when reading this.

The Giants are this sexy pick but it makes zero sense to me. They were clearly the 3rd best team in the NFCE once Plax went down. I know they added some vets in the off-season and added two highly drafted WRs but they also lost their DC who was pretty darn good. They were 12-4 last year but finished with 4 losses in their last 5 games and scored 20 points only once... the OT game.

That is an indictment on Eli.

 

[Aikbach]

Is Newman the new Darrel Green of football? A quiet, unassuming professional that is top tier but often unheralded for his work?

 

[jterrell]

And yes the Orakpo pick was absolutely stupid.

Orakpo wasn't even a better DE in the Big 12 than Brandon Williams.
I like him as a player but but no rookie makes the top 10 NFCE players.

 

[jterrell]

Is Newman the new Darrel Green of football? A quiet, unassuming professional that is top tier but often unheralded for his work?

I like TNew but he is not a Darrell Green.
He isn't particularly quiet, particularly healthy or particularly unknown.


His image takes a beating because he has played some really poor games when he was out there really banged up. Unlike a lot of corners every TD TNEw gives up makes the loop on Sports Center because he is a Cowboy.

 

[jterrell]

Why would you ever want to build a team around an LT, DT, or CB?

I think QB, RB, WR, TE, DE/OLB are the only positions worth building an entire team around

Depends on the player.

Give me the best LT, CB and DT in football and I'll spot you the top guys at other spots.

Anyone who would build around a TE before a CB is silly.

The unquestioned franchise positions are CB, Pass Rusher, LT, QB. Those guys get drafted early and often.

TE and RB are often after thoughts. You can get game changers at those positions in rounds 2 and 3.

 

[Ren]

Way to pick Orakpo over Umenyiora,.. can't believe this guy gets payed to write this stuff

 

[Future]

Depends on the player.

Give me the best LT, CB and DT in football and I'll spot you the top guys at other spots.

Anyone who would build around a TE before a CB is silly.

The unquestioned franchise positions are CB, Pass Rusher, LT, QB. Those guys get drafted early and often.

TE and RB are often after thoughts. You can get game changers at those positions in rounds 2 and 3.

OK, so if you want to base your team on LT CB and DT...I'll take QB WR DE/OLB

I think my three are way more important than the other ones because they can win games on their own.

 

[Oh_Canada]

I'm guessing Mosley isn't this dumb, he just knows how to start conversation.

 

[28 Joker]

Actually when Newman is healthy, he's the better corner. Asante is the better playmaker.

Here is what the Pro Football Weekly survey said about Newman (rated 5th):

"After being bothered by groin and abdominal issues, Newman finished the 08' season with a flourish. Intercepting 4 passes in the final 7 games. Has good ball skills, elite speed and thrives in man coverage".


Here is what the publication said about Samuel (rated 3rd):

"One of the premiere zone cornerbacks with a knack for making big plays. Was able to succeed in Philly out of NE's cover 2 scheme".


One player (Newman) "thrives in man coverage" and has "elite" speed.

The other player (Samuel) is called a "premiere zone cornerback" and "has a knack for making big plays".


Newman and Samuel are two different types of players.

If you want the zone cornerback, then take Samuel.

If you want the man to man cornerback with elite speed, then take Newman. Plus, Newman is the best slot defender in the NFL and can shadow very fast, quick WRs all over the field while in man to man coverage. You can put him on big, fast WRs llike Terrell Owens (in his prime) or bigger players, too.

I agree with you. I think Newman is the better player, and I've written in detail and compared the two players and what they bring to the table. Samuel has made a name for himself by making big plays, and his play in the playoffs helped him.

Furthermore, Samuel played in a heavy zone scheme in NE while Newman has played in a heavy man to man scheme during his 6 year career. Samuel played cover 3 and cover 2 while in NE. That scheme helped him get the big plays. It allowed him to be more aggressive and jump routes from just outside the numbers to the sidelines. Plus, I do believe the Eagles played Samuel in primarily a zone role in their zone blitz scheme. Champ Bailey is another guy who benefited from an aggressive scheme.

I'm not saying Samuel or Bailey should be diminished for how they have been played, but I think it's important for the debate to recognize that the two players have been used differently. Samuel and Bailey have given up more deep and intermediate throws in their careers when compared to Newman and it shows up in their YPA and it has shown up on the scoreboard as well. Samuel, like Bailey, comes from a scheme that encouraged him to gamble. The trade off is interceptions for giving up more bigger plays.

Which player you prefer probably depends on the scheme you run and how you are going to play them.

Newman has been the master at preventing the big play during his six year career. Plus, Newman does have 20 career interceptions while letting the game or interceptions come to him. I prefer Newman's more conservative approach, and Wade Phillips' scheme has and will continue to set him up for some more opportunities for interceptions.

Newman offers extra value with his elite slot play where he has to defend the entire field in man to man coverage. Plus, Newman's elite speed, quickness, burst, agility, and leaping ability allows you deploy him in man to man coverage and bring heat. Newman's outstanding cover skills put heat on the offense. Newman shrinks the field, and if you keep throwing the ball towards him, he has shown that he will make you pay.

 

[28 Joker]

Nnamdi is considered the best CB in the game right now by a lot of people. Guess what? He plays the same way as Newman does- he makes it a point to STOP receptions not appear on highlight films.

He's really good, and you made a good point. He plays in a heavy man to man scheme just like Newman. When you play heavy man to man, your back is to the ball deep down the field. Sometimes, you just have to go for the pass breakup when you play those deeper throws. Some people don't get this.

These two guys (Newman and Asomugha) have not been living close to the sidelines (from the outer edges of the numbers to the sidelines while in zone coverage). They have not been playing in heavy zone schemes where they are allowed to constantly jump routes.

Asomugha's YPA has been higher than Newman's, but Asomugha did finish in the top 10 (#10) in Velas' study, compared to Newman's # 2 ranking. Nnamdi's success percentage has been really good or exceptional. He's definately one of the toughest guys to throw on. It should be noted, however, that the Raiders can't stop the run at all.

I saw Asomugha take care of Steve Smith last year. He had one interception. It should be noted that Jake Delholme had a dead arm, and Carolina looked terrible. Delholme threw towards Smith deep down the left sideline and Asomugha picked him off. After that, Delholme didn't even test him again. I think he threw at him only a few times.

Good point about Nnamdi preventing receptions and shrinking the field.

Plus, even though Asomugha is considered the best, he's kind of a late bloomer. Newman has been the most consistent player, because he was great from the get go, as a rookie.

 

[28 Joker]

Is Newman the new Darrel Green of football? A quiet, unassuming professional that is top tier but often unheralded for his work?

Yes.

Yes.

And

Yes.


Darrel Green had longevity.

Green could fly. He could really run.

Terence Newman can fly, too.

Terence Newman isn't your average 30 year old player. For one thing, Newman has played only 6 years. The guy runs a mid 4.3 and has a 41 inch vertical. His overall skill set is elite. Newman's chronological age is going to be just a number to him. Bill Parcells said that he was the hardest working player on the team. In fact, the team has to get on him about over working in the off season. The guy takes incrediable care of himself.

I just laughed when I saw writers and fans, two or three years ago, saying that "Newman is getting close to 30". People were lumping him in with Anthony Henry and saying that the Dallas CBs were "getting old". Henry is a 4.5 guy before he lost a step or two. Henry was never a fast guy to begin with. Now, Newman is fixing to play at 31, and "the getting old" has and will really heat up now. Let'em say it.

I look for Newman to still be playing at a very high level at ages 31, 32, 33, and 34 if he is fortunate enough to stay healthy in a physical, tough sport. Four years is an eternity in the NFL. Newman is built to last. In his mind, his age is just a number. I've known people like this, and this guy is a world class athlete.

The people who just don't like him like to label him "injury prone" now, after one major injury that had nothing to do with his birth date or chronological age. Furthermore, some try to marginalize the caliber player that he is for what ever reason. They don't know what it's like to play with plantar fascitis. Let's see them go out and have a Pro Bowl season and put up a 6.1 YPA with that nagging foot condition. Instead, of being praised for playing hurt or trying to play through the groin, he gets bashed.

I read where an Eagles fan said that Newman was "old" and "on the decline" recently on another site. I thought, hmm. He would fit right into the Cowboys Zone with those comments. There were two CBs on that list who had the decline status. They were Champ Bailey and Charles Woodson. Both players have played longer than Newman, and they can't run like him or move like him. They are not built like him.

If Newman isn't underrated in the fanbase or nationally, then why do I spend so much time having to defend him on a website called the "Cowboys Zone"?

I could be talking about one of my favorite offensive players, Felix Jones.

For all the unbelievers and for all the people who don't like this player:

If you think this player is just going to roll over and croak for Orlando Scandrick over the next 3 or 4 years, you are going to be disappointed if he stays healthy and the Cowboys are still winning.

 

[Chocolate Lab]

Don't worry, 41gy, every player that makes a lot of money will get his turn in the barrel. Look for "Ware not living up to his contract" and "Felix too fragile to ever be any good" threads in the near future.

As stupid as it is, it's as inevitable as death and taxes.

 

[JoeyBones31]

Stopped reading at Eli.

That's like owning a 70,000 dollar sports car, but you can't afford to drive it.


Eli Manning ?? Without Plaxico, or Derrick Ward, the Giants are that sports car !:laugh2:

 

[Ren]

That's like owning a 70,000 dollar sports car, but you can't afford to drive it.


Eli Manning ?? Without Plaxico, or Derrick Ward, the Giants are that sports car !:laugh2:

I don't think they'll miss Ward, with the run blocking they have they can throw pretty much anyone back there and have success, well... the could when they had a Passing game at least :laugh2:

 

[Apollo Creed]

I'm guessing Mosley isn't this dumb, he just knows how to start conversation.

A little of both.

 

[Apollo Creed]

Yes.

Yes.

And

Yes.


Darrel Green had longevity.

Green could fly. He could really run.

Terence Newman can fly, too.

Terence Newman isn't your average 30 year old player. For one thing, Newman has played only 6 years. The guy runs a mid 4.3 and has a 41 inch vertical. His overall skill set is elite. Newman's chronological age is going to be just a number to him. Bill Parcells said that he was the hardest working player on the team. In fact, the team has to get on him about over working in the off season. The guy takes incrediable care of himself.

I just laughed when I saw writers and fans, two or three years ago, saying that "Newman is getting close to 30". People were lumping him in with Anthony Henry and saying that the Dallas CBs were "getting old". Henry is a 4.5 guy before he lost a step or two. Henry was never a fast guy to begin with. Now, Newman is fixing to play at 31, and "the getting old" has and will really heat up now. Let'em say it.

I look for Newman to still be playing at a very high level at ages 31, 32, 33, and 34 if he is fortunate enough to stay healthy in a physical, tough sport. Four years is an eternity in the NFL. Newman is built to last. In his mind, his age is just a number. I've known people like this, and this guy is a world class athlete.

The people who just don't like him like to label him "injury prone" now, after one major injury that had nothing to do with his birth date or chronological age. Furthermore, some try to marginalize the caliber player that he is for what ever reason. They don't know what it's like to play with plantar fascitis. Let's see them go out and have a Pro Bowl season and put up a 6.1 YPA with that nagging foot condition. Instead, of being praised for playing hurt or trying to play through the groin, he gets bashed.

I read where an Eagles fan said that Newman was "old" and "on the decline" recently on another site. I thought, hmm. He would fit right into the Cowboys Zone with those comments. There were two CBs on that list who had the decline status. They were Champ Bailey and Charles Woodson. Both players have played longer than Newman, and they can't run like him or move like him. They are not built like him.

If Newman isn't underrated in the fanbase or nationally, then why do I spend so much time having to defend him on a website called the "Cowboys Zone"?

I could be talking about one of my favorite offensive players, Felix Jones.

For all the unbelievers and for all the people who don't like this player:

If you think this player is just going to roll over and croak for Orlando Scandrick over the next 3 or 4 years, you are going to be disappointed if he stays healthy and the Cowboys are still winning.

Your tireless defense of Newman is honorable.

He's not Champ Bailey, and he definitely isn't Darrell Green. Newman's injuries concern me because they are always of the 'nagging' variety. Groin and foot injuries are two very painful and tend to hang around. Newman hasn't been consistently 100% in several years. Granted at 70% he is still a great player, but for a top 10 pick that we are paying heaps of cash to - I certainly hope he stays on the field. I'm just worried that the trend will continue.