Fisher tweet on Kafka - what is this even supposed to mean?

[OmerV]

I don’t disagree with you there. I’m mostly reacting to Helman’s mischaracterization of what NFL teams find valuable (the stuff they look for in a “resume”) as part of his daily routine to hype up any and everyone in the Cowboys organization.

Right now, there’s a gold rush for offensive coaches who are familiar with a particular scheme or have had success with particular organizations that they want to emulate. THAT’S what teams are looking for in a resume, not how long someone has been coaching a certain position.

Mike Kafka’s value is in the success he has had as QB coach for the Chiefs and the fact that he has two years of first-hand experience in how that offense is run. Kellen Moore does not have that. Two completely different resumes.

No, Kafka’s perceived value is in the success his QB and team has had, which isn’t necessarily the same as the success he has been responsible for. Again the same head coach and system resulted in a career year for Alex Smith last year, so the success this season can’t just be attributed to a change at QB coach. And, realistically, how does a fan even quantify the impact of a QB coach? Is he a great QB coach when the QB has a quality season, and a bad QB coach when the same QB has an off season?

But even aside from all that, even if we were to ignore all other variables that affect how well a QB does in a given year and assume Moore and Kafka were working under identical conditions with no difference in the quality of the offensive scheme, or play calling or head coach or OC or talent of the QB, and assumed that the only difference was the quality of the QB coach, at the end of the day it still just means Kafka has one year over Moore - a single year - and that’s not much history to support the notion they have a “completely different” resume.

 

[Common Sense]

No, Kafka’s perceived value is in the success his QB and team has had, which isn’t necessarily the same as the success he has been responsible for. Again the same head coach and system resulted in a career year for Alex Smith last year, so the success this season can’t just be attributed to a change at QB coach. And, realistically, how does a fan even quantify the impact of a QB coach? Is he a great QB coach when the QB has a quality season, and a bad QB coach when the same QB has an off season?

But even aside from all that, even if we were to ignore all other variables that affect how well a QB does in a given year and assume Moore and Kafka were working under identical conditions with no difference in the quality of the offensive scheme, or play calling or head coach or OC or talent of the QB, and assumed that the only difference was the quality of the QB coach, at the end of the day it still just means Kafka has one year over Moore - a single year - and that’s not much history to support the notion they have a “completely different” resume.

Dude, you’re completely missing the point. If a team wants to copy the Patriots’ scheme, they don’t hire a coach from the Dolphins. Coaching the same position is not having the same resume.

 

[OmerV]

Dude, you’re completely missing the point. If a team wants to copy the Patriots’ scheme, they don’t hire a coach from the Dolphins. Coaching the same position is not having the same resume.

Lol - you’re missing the point. Kafka isn’t a creator of the scheme, he isn’t the brains behind the scheme, and he doesn’t call the plays, so that’s not part of his resume. He’s just the QB coach that works with the QB within the scheme and game plan others tell him to. And, again it is still only a single year at QB coach with that scheme, so it’s not as if he has a long standing history with it.

In any case, I never said the resumes were identical - that there were no differences at all - I merely said they were very similar, which they are. Besides, what you are talking about is mostly perception and the bandwagon nature of the profession. Just because a team is hot at the moment doesn’t necessarily mean all associated with that team are superior at their jobs, it just st means that whatever level they are, the way they are perceived gets a shot in the arm simply by being associated with a hot team. Some coaches go on to prove that the perception was deserved, while others go on to prove it was a false perception, but either way, the fact is that perception and reality aren’t necessarily the same thing.

 

[Common Sense]

Lol - you’re missing the point. Kafka isn’t a creator of the scheme, he isn’t the brains behind the scheme, and he doesn’t call the plays, so that’s not part of his resume. He’s just the QB coach that works with the QB within the scheme and game plan others tell him to. And, again it is still only a single year at QB coach with that scheme, so it’s not as if he has a long standing history with it.

In any case, I never said the resumes were identical - that there were no differences at all - I merely said they were very similar, which they are. Besides, what you are talking about is mostly perception and the bandwagon nature of the profession. Just because a team is hot at the moment doesn’t necessarily mean all associated with that team are superior at their jobs, it just st means that whatever level they are, the way they are perceived gets a shot in the arm simply by being associated with a hot team. Some coaches go on to prove that the perception was deserved, while others go on to prove it was a false perception, but either way, the fact is that perception and reality aren’t necessarily the same thing.

I’m not missing your point, I’m just calling BS on it. This started because you defended Helman saying that Moore and Kafka have — and I quote — “the exact same resume.” Now you’re backtracking because you’re starting to realize how silly that argument is.

 

[OmerV]

I’m not missing your point, I’m just calling BS on it. This started because you defended Helman saying that Moore and Kafka have — and I quote — “the exact same resume.” Now you’re backtracking because you’re starting to realize how silly that argument is.

This is a fabricated and false argument. If you are going to argue about what I have said and supported you have to quote me, and my words, not make up whatever suits you even if it requires ignoring the truth. The truth is, and it’s verifiable from my posts, my original response to you was that Helman’s comment was not laughable, as you claimed, because the resumes actually are “very close to the same” (my exact words), and in fact along with pointing out the similarities I also specifically pointed out that there were a couple of differences.

 

[KingintheNorth]

"exact same resume"

Kafka

• Northwestern (2016)
  Graduate assistant
• Kansas City Chiefs (2017)
  Offensive quality control coach
• Kansas City Chiefs (2018–present)
  Quarterbacks coach

Moore

• Immediately appointed to QB coach with zero coaching background

Also, Kafka - 2 years under offensive guru Andy Reid.
Moore - 1 year under recently fired Scott Linehan.

Exact. Same. Resume.

 

[OmerV]

"exact same resume"

Kafka

• Northwestern (2016)
  Graduate assistant
• Kansas City Chiefs (2017)
  Offensive quality control coach
• Kansas City Chiefs (2018–present)
  Quarterbacks coach

Moore

• Immediately appointed to QB coach with zero coaching background

Also, Kafka - 2 years under offensive guru Andy Reid.
Moore - 1 year under recently fired Scott Linehan.

Exact. Same. Resume.

Exact same isn’t accurate, but there isn’t a dramatic difference. A graduate assistant is nothing more than a coaching intern, while an offensive quality control coach is simply a research assistant who gathers the materials and information other coaches use to make decisions. Accordingly, his coaching experience is slightly, but not significantly greater than Moore, although I think it’s fair to believe that much or all of that would be offset by the fact that Moore got a lot more practical experience with the QB position by being a highly successful 4 year starter in college, while Kafka only got one year worth of playing experience.

I do agree that coaching under Reid is a bonus for Kafka, but the bottom line is neither Moore or Kafka have the resume to be an OC in the NFL.

 

[Common Sense]

Exact same isn’t accurate, but there isn’t a dramatic difference. A graduate assistant is nothing more than a coaching intern, while an offensive quality control coach is simply a research assistant who gathers the materials and information other coaches use to make decisions. Accordingly, his coaching experience is slightly, but not significantly greater than Moore, although I think it’s fair to believe that much or all of that would be offset by the fact that Moore got a lot more practical experience with the QB position by being a highly successful 4 year starter in college, while Kafka only got one year worth of playing experience.

I do agree that coaching under Reid is a bonus for Kafka, but the bottom line is neither Moore or Kafka have the resume to be an OC in the NFL.

I didn’t say I would want to hire Kafka as my OC, but being the QB coach in the most revered offensive scheme in the league puts in you consideration for a promotion, which is an OC position. Being the QB coach for an offense that performed poorly enough for the OC to be fired does not. Those are not similar resumes. This isn’t brain surgery.

I’m not going to waste any more time arguing over this, because at this point we may as well be arguing over whether water is wet.

 

[Fritsch_the_cat]

If they name Moore as OC I'm going to have a conniption.

 

[OmerV]

I didn’t say I would want to hire Kafka as my OC, but being the QB coach in the most revered offensive scheme in the league puts in you consideration for a promotion, which is an OC position. Being the QB coach for an offense that performed poorly enough for the OC to be fired does not. Those are not similar resumes. This isn’t brain surgery.

I’m not going to waste any more time arguing over this, because at this point we may as well be arguing over whether water is wet.

The OC getting fired is a situation, not a resume. His resume shows his job history, not the job history of people he worked under. Apparently you think “similar resumes” means “absolutely identical history, situations, circumstances etc..”. Do their birthdays and hometowns have to be the same too?

 

[Alexander]

not sure I believe fisher really knows anything.
sounds like HE wanted Kafka....and got soul crushed when told he isnt a candidate.

That is what it sounds like to me.

The guy so desperately wants to be in the know. He might have got drunk with Jerry Jones a few times, but that is about the extent of his insider status.

 

[glimmerman]

Moore should have his bags packed. He will be replaced.

 

[Alexander]

Moore should have his bags packed. He will be replaced.

No, he is going to continue as QB coach.

He apparently brought enough coffee, fetched enough donuts and retrieved enough dry cleaning to secure his spot.

 

[glimmerman]

No, he is going to continue as QB coach.

He apparently brought enough coffee, fetched enough donuts and retrieved enough dry cleaning to secure his spot.

Lol. But remember that Linehan was staying also.

 

[Asklesko]

Wait, was this supposed to be a Franz Kafka joke?

Either way this is shaping up to be a Kafkaesque situation

 

[Common Sense]

The OC getting fired is a situation, not a resume. His resume shows his job history, not the job history of people he worked under. Apparently you think “similar resumes” means “absolutely identical history, situations, circumstances etc..”. Do their birthdays and hometowns have to be the same too?

Now you’re trying to accuse me of making the same dumb arguments you started off with.

Do you really think that all an NFL GM is going to look at is “2018 - Present: Quarterbacks Coach, Team X” and stop there, or do they want to know where you coached, how successful your offense was, which coaching tree you stem from, how your quarterback performed, etc.?

This entire time, you have argued that because Moore and Kafka are both former NFL QBs in their early 30s who held the title of QB Coach this year, that they are the basically the same. NO ONE WHO HIRES COACHES IN THE NFL THINKS THAT WAY.

You are wrong. Full stop. It’s time to move on.

 

[Beaker42]

Yeah, the idea that Kafka and Moore have the “same resume” is laughable at best.

You might want to edit your post.

 

[Common Sense]

You might want to edit your post.

Oh, god. Another one of you?

 

[Beaker42]

Dude, you’re completely missing the point. If a team wants to copy the Patriots’ scheme, they don’t hire a coach from the Dolphins. Coaching the same position is not having the same resume.

Unless one of the two has already been an OC or HC, their resumes are pretty much the same. You’re arguing brunette vs blonde and it’s not working.

 

[Beaker42]

Oh, god. Another one of you?

LOL, yep. I KIND of see your point but you’re splitting hairs. Their time in the NFL and what they’ve done is pretty much like for like.