Discussion in 'Fan Zone' started by Bobhaze, Jul 12, 2019.
Sorry buddy, that was a joke
Speaking of... Just saw this today. In addition to the infamous Ice Ice Bailey game, look at how Garrett totally botches this clock management after the Giants get down to the one. Jerry, Stephen and even Charlotte all realize we needed to call time out immediately... Everyone but Princeton Red. With those 14 seconds back, we might have gotten close enough to win. Instead we missed the playoffs and the Giants went on to win the Superbowl.
2:24:00 because I don't think the time copy is going to work on the link.
There's a lot of homers who didn't think he'd win more games than any other coach in the NFC over the last three seasons. Especially doing it without a QB most would consider to be elite. 3 of 5 NFCE titles. NFL CotY. All with a team almost nobody would consider one of the most talented rosters in the conference up until this season.
At some point, people are going to have to wake up and recognize.
10 years I’ve recognized he’s not a championship coach and it doesn’t take championship caliber coaches 10 years after they get hired to win a championship.
Garrett has always been a sham.
...Bob, I think Garrett is just unlucky. Is there such thing? Of course. Lets say in Quantum terms, he's been on a streak of all the other numbers, except 7's when they counted. When the chips are down, the guy cant catch a break. I dont know what else he can do, that will make him a Maverick of a coach.
Which of the teams prior to 2014 did you consider “championship teams” in terms of their rosters?
After this many seasons what you see is what you get.
Very spot on observations by the way!
What hurts is that with the salary cap, the only way to get a competative advantage is with the coaching staff, yet we refuse to take advantage of this !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
It doesn’t really matter.
I don’t consider the Eagles team with Nick Foles throwing passes to be a championship team but they did it anyways. Good coaches find a way. Garrett doesn’t have it.
A decade coaching with this team and not a single Super Bowl or even conference championship.
On top of all that.. He’s just boring. This is an entertainment sport and after 10 years he is just a buzzkill .
Bob, we're going to be done before championship Sunday and the failed experiment that is grooming Jason to be the next Tom or Bill will finally end.
He is afraid of losing. That is why he can't win. There are things he does well. But he brings nothing to the field of play. He's Omar Bradley. But not George Patton.
That’s where we disagree then. I considered that Eagles team the best team in the NFC in 2017. I believe Roseman did a phenomenal job improving a good roster that offseason, and they demonstrated they had the depth at QB when Foles came in and played almost as good for Pederson as he did in 2013 for Chip Kelly. I don’t believe a good coach can magic a roster to a Superbowl. Maybe a great coach can do it, but those guys come around every couple of generations, and they don’t hit the market.
I also believe the ‘not a single Superbowl’ mentality is what gets so many fans off on the completely wrong track about what building a championship team is all about. You get there by consistently doing almost everything right...and then by getting a little bit of luck. It doesn’t just happen automatically when enough time elapses because of the color of the laundry or the expectation of the fans. This organization hasn’t been doing enough things right as a whole in the period since Jimmy was fired. It goes way beyond coaching. They’ve improved in that regard a lot in recent years and under Garrett. I honestly don’t understand how so many fans fail to get it.
I agree with maybe half your post
the other half, well, you seem to have extreme notions where JG is concerned
for example, over the last 3 years, with a young QB ... JG has won more closes games than any coach in the NFL
but you consider his clock management to be bad - by what measure?
my big issue with JG is most of those games never should have been close
just trying to be "fair"
you eluded JG is too predictable, no adjustments, too conservative
may I remind you he didn't want to hire an OC ... Scott was his choice, not his idea
also, to this day we don't know how much power and influence JG has
BTW, did you call JG too conservative or predictable or run happy pre-Scott (or rather pre-Zach Martin)?
Jerry world is a strange place. I'm not sure anyone else could have played the hands dealt much better than JG.
He’s won 2 playoff games in 10 years.
Please save the big picture stuff. 10 years is a big enough picture. He’s not a championship coach. 10 years proves that.
It doesn’t take this league now days to build championship teams. He’s just not good enough.
The standard of this team couldn’t be any lower at this point if 10 years of this is acceptable.
Winning in the post season is all that matters and we don’t do it nearly enough and this coach has had 10 years which is a lifetime in NFL years.
He’s not a championship caliber coach and he needs to be removed after he fails to do anything again this year.
Time has exposed him. Maybe he’d be a great hire for the Bengals but Dallas needs to do better.
Why would I save the big picture stuff?!? The big picture stuff is what matters.
We both know for a fact the Cowboys teams from 2010-2013 were not remotely close to talented enough to win an NFL championship. Expecting any HC to win a title those seasons is foolishness. From 2014 on we’ve had a contending team. Three division titles. Two different staring QBs. Most wins in the NFC since Dak took over...Dak, who most of us admit is not really an elite QB. An NFL CotY award. And probably his best team yet heading into 2019. Time hasn’t exposed Jason Garrett. Time has proven he actually knows what he’s doing.
I think it was @DanA that put it the best way I've ever heard with Garrett - he's more like a position coach than a head coach. Everything with him is about repetition, grind, and sticking to the basics. He wants to run a simple offense and defense and coach up his players until they can out-execute you at it. It's a process.
The positives with this approach is that that consistency has built an identify for this team - we're going to run the ball and limit turnovers on offense, and we're going to fly to the ball on defense. There's no coordinators jumping in and out and installing a new system every 2 years, that needs new players, and needs everyone on the team to learn new playcalls and techniques. We know what we're going to do.
That consistency and grind has also created an environment where young players often tend to develop here. We draft guys to fit our system and then let them keep practicing and playing in the same roles, so they tend to steadily improve with time. D-Law, Hitchens, Chido, Maliek Collins, Xavier Woods, Blake Jarwin, Gallup... we've seen a ton of players struggle early on and then get better, while we rarely see young guys struggle and then just completely fail or stall out (i.e. Taco).
On top of that, the owner and team both buy in to Garrett. The players have called out Garrett's schemes in the past, but I can't remember hearing anyone call out Jason Garrett as a man, and the team doesn't quit on him. He also manages Jerry's ego very well and makes a difficult task look easy there. Bill Parcells and Jimmy Johnson are Hall of Fame coaches, but they lost their jobs while Garrett has kept his because he figured out what they never did.
The problem with Garrett's approach is that he's not very flexible and he's not very creative. We've all seen how stale our gameplans can get from week to week. Chaz Green being abandoned against Atlanta is one of the worst coaching decisions I can remember seeing. Modern passing plays like picks, bubble screens and RPOs almost seemed to have passed him and Linehan by. He will keep grinding and try to force a square peg like Byron Jones into a round hole, rather than fitting his scheme to the available talent.
I think we've seen the ceiling from Garrett at this point. He can grind and execute well enough, and he can make the playoffs with a talented roster, but the best teams in the NFL can be both creative and execute cleanly (Patriots, Saints, Chiefs, Rams, Eagles, etc), and so if the talent is equal, that puts us behind. It's going to be hard to beat the NFL's big dogs with Garrett in charge.
What I think we need is someone like a Kris Richard to come in on offense. Marinelli had done the grindgrindgrind thing for several years and had got bad defenses to punch above their weight, but wasn't doing anything special with a good defense. Richard joined the staff and kept probably 90% of Marinelli's scheme, but he started using the DBs more aggressively and calling a few more blitzes. It wasn't just "sit 10 yards off the line of scrimmage, BBDB", it was zone defense on the attack like Seattle. And the players seemed to buy in once the governor was taken off and they played with an intensity that we hadn't seen in a decade. That's when the unit really took a step forwards to the elite.
Same deal on the other side of the ball. The foundation Garrett has built isn't wrong - have Dak bus drive behind an elite OL and feed a ton of touches to Zeke and Cooper - but it's just implemented in a really stale way. I really don't think we need that many tweaks for the offense to really start tearing, just some pick plays here and less cuteness in the red zone there. But Garrett's not going to be the guy to change that.
Realistically, I think Jason Garrett is best suited a John Fox type turnaround coach. You throw him into a toxic situation for 3 or 4 seasons, let him add in some RKGs, then he'll get started on the process. By the end of it, I bet you'll have an 8-8 type club with stability and an identify. I think he would do great in Cincinnati or Miami, fixing dumpster fire ready-to-tank teams marred by meddlesome ownership. But he's not the guy who is going to take a 10-13 win Cowboys team deep into the playoffs.
Because 10 years is the big picture. We know what he is. 2 playoff wins in 10 years. Exposed.
Team shows up for games like a box of chocolates . You never know what you're going to get
50% of the time ready to play.
25% a gaffe fest.
Every team has a stinker at times but Garrett excels at showing up not ready to play.