Garrett Detractors: A dose of reality

[khiladi]

I felt that near the end if his coaching run that Parcells had grown too conservative and therefore the game had passed him by.

Everything always had to be 'reigned in'.

I felt that stifled innovation and creativity on both sides of the ball.

I felt that near the end if his coaching run that Parcells had grown too conservative and therefore the game had passed him by.

Everything always had to be 'reigned in'.

I felt that stifled innovation and creativity on both sides of the ball.

That was his biggest problem. Parcells went with what he knew and could control, which is why he always brought in his guys. I feel he never really wanted to bench Bledsoe in the first place, but was forced to as a matter of circumstance. Bledsoe was his guy. His biggest asset for us was that he built a solid roster while playing his veterans. He left at the right time.

What destroyed this team was the Garrett pick and the return of guys like Lacewell and Garrett's father who returned after leaving in 2004.

 

[Doomsday101]

After Cleveland, do you still consider Holmgren a quality hire?

I do not.

His role in cleveland is much different than a role as a HC, In GB he worked with Wolfe to help put a poor packers team back on the map. Now do I think he is looking to return to the sideline? I don't know but I do think he has vast knowledge and ability to coach is still there.

 

[Verdict]

It's possible that we could do worse, but that does not excuse his consistent miscues in game management.

Fear of failing with another coach is not an excuse for sticking with a failing HC.




Now if you were to say that you believe in what he's doing and can see where the process is going, then that would be a good reason to stick up for ol' Red. But it just doesn't seem like that's the case for you, OP.

I just said I'm not sure Garrett is the answer. But I am saying be careful what you wish for....... If I gave you truth serum, and made you go on record ....If Garrett is fired after Sunday's game what would YOU put the odds at a better coach replacing Garrett, or a coach who turns out to be worse than Garrett. Be real about this?? I'm curious.

You also have to consider the fact that change is disruptive in that we may be retooling to fit yet another system. We have plenty of holes to fill without adding additional holes for the mere sake of changing scheme yet again.

I honestly don't know the answer. I'm not totally sold on Garrett, as a guy who can get the job done here. Likewise I'm not positive he can't get it done either. I do think he is making an effort. I also think we have been doing a very good job in the draft. I'm still not crazy about the Escobar pick either, but who knows he may be the next big thing in a couple of years from now.

I do think guys like Witten, Ware and Romo's window of opportunity is closing to some degree. So all of that has to be taken into account as well.

 

[khiladi]

I bet you if Garrett is fired, whole list of coaches will be lined up at Jerry's door. Your talking about a potential for a lot of glory being that guy who led the greatest franchise in football history back to the promised land. Jimmy Johnson has attained legendary status forever for what he did. This the Cowboys man!

 

[Verdict]

I will say this .... I think Callahan's role as offensive coordinator is holding back this team. But he has done a pretty good job as the O.L. coach..... or at least it appears so since that has turned out to be a strength of this team.

 

[Stash]

That was his biggest problem. Parcells went with what he knew and could control, which is why he always brought in his guys. I feel he never really wanted to bench Bledsoe in the first place, but was forced to as a matter of circumstance. Bledsoe was his guy. His biggest asset for us was that he built a solid roster while playing his veterans. He left at the right time.

What destroyed this team was the Garrett pick and the return of guys like Lacewell and Garrett's father who returned after leaving in 2004.

I wonder what might have been had they waited until after the Chargers fired Schottenheimer?

He had assembled a pretty good roster and staff before being ousted in San Diego.

 

[Picksix]

Gailey had far better results than Garrett and Campo had probably the worst teams in this franchises history so Garrett in my book is the worst coach to ever lead this franchise although he could change that a bit this Sunday.

Not sure what you consider "far better" results, but in two years, Gailey was a combined 18-16. He did get them into the playoffs both years, but lost both games, including a home game to Arizona. Those teams weren't loaded with talent, but I'm not sure if they had significantly less.

Point is, I get where the OP is going. He's not saying Garrett shouldn't be replaced. We just shouldn't expect getting a new coach to be a cure-all. If we get a new one, we may be better. May not be.

 

[Risen Star]

I will say this .... I think Callahan's role as offensive coordinator is holding back this team. But he has done a pretty good job as the O.L. coach..... or at least it appears so since that has turned out to be a strength of this team.

It helps getting a legitimate NFL talent at C. And of course the maturation of Tyron.

Remember those pro Phil Costa folks? Good times.

 

[khiladi]

I wonder what might have been had they waited until after the Chargers fired Schottenheimer?

He had assembled a pretty good roster and staff before being ousted in San Diego.

That guy is brilliant at building teams. Commanders set themselves back for firing him after one season. Never recovered. Surprise, surprise.. Danny boy can't get along with a strong-willed personality like him, just like Jerry. His only stigma is winning playoff games, but a guy like Romo could have easily helped him overcome that stigma. In the playoffs, you normally need brilliant QB play.

I'd take him in a heart beat. Get a bunch of these phonies out of here.

 

[snapper]

He comes from a football background. He played in the NFL. If he hasn't learned by now the odds are he probably won't.

Right. This is why I do not think he has earned another season even though he may get another chance.

 

[Stash]

His role in cleveland is much different than a role as a HC, In GB he worked with Wolfe to help put a poor packers team back on the map. Now do I think he is looking to return to the sideline? I don't know but I do think he has vast knowledge and ability to coach is still there.

I think he's another coach that the game has passed by.

And what he did in Cleveland should be his last hurrah.

 

[Doomsday101]

I think he's another coach that the game has passed by.

And what he did in Cleveland should be his last hurrah.

what he did at Cleveland? He is not coaching in cleveland, his role was not as HC but front office. I'm not claiming Holmgren to be a GM but his offensive system is still being ran in the NFL

 

[arglebargle]

What good would it do Parcells to say anything negative publicly about Jerry Jones?

Jerry took great financial care of Parcells after he lost his shirt in a divorce. And you don't bite the hand that feeds ya.

And Parcells wouldn't want to alienate himself from the league and it's owners by openly bad-mouthing one of them. There's nothing to be gained by it.

But if everything was as great as he says, why did he ever leave? And why did he take coaches away with him?

Actions speak louder than words.

Again, we can revisit this subject if and when a coaching change is made.

I would be happy to be wrong about it.

If you check out Parcells' later career, three years was about all he could hack in any one place. He hopped from team to team, and then cut out. I recall a quote from him during the Dallas stop, where he said he felt his system would probably only work for three years anyway.

Those are 'actions' as well.

 

[arglebargle]

After Cleveland, do you still consider Holmgren a quality hire?

I do not.

Well, we agree there....

All the retreads have their own problems: Holmgren is a terrible talent evaluater. Gruden is an abrasive liar who makes players want to sign elsewhere. Cowher thought 'Slash' was an NFL level QB. Etc.

 

[Nova]

I just said I'm not sure Garrett is the answer. But I am saying be careful what you wish for....... If I gave you truth serum, and made you go on record ....If Garrett is fired after Sunday's game what would YOU put the odds at a better coach replacing Garrett, or a coach who turns out to be worse than Garrett. Be real about this?? I'm curious.

You also have to consider the fact that change is disruptive in that we may be retooling to fit yet another system. We have plenty of holes to fill without adding additional holes for the mere sake of changing scheme yet again.

I honestly don't know the answer. I'm not totally sold on Garrett, as a guy who can get the job done here. Likewise I'm not positive he can't get it done either. I do think he is making an effort. I also think we have been doing a very good job in the draft. I'm still not crazy about the Escobar pick either, but who knows he may be the next big thing in a couple of years from now.

I do think guys like Witten, Ware and Romo's window of opportunity is closing to some degree. So all of that has to be taken into account as well.

Seems like a cop out, but I think it's about a 50/50 chance we could find a coach that would be better than Garrett. I think of Garrett as a middle of the road NFL coach. He's a decent personnel guy (decent: not great) but he's a lousy game manager.

The bolded part is probably the best argument anyone could make. This team cannot establish any type of identity because we're always abandoning things too early. I agree with that. This is one of the only legitimate reasons I'm reluctant to can Garrett. I'm always harping on Jones for not riding things out a bit and seeing where it goes.

And I agree with you. I'm not totally sold on Garrett and I'm not 100% against him. I'm actually rooting for the guy because of his ties to the team. But I think that's one of the reasons I'm inclined to want to stick with him, honestly. It's more of an emotional/reactive decision largely because I don't want to rue the situation later like we all rue the day Sean Payton left.

But if I'm being honest and making an actual assessment about Garrett? I just don't see it with this guy. His playbook is tired and was figured out December 16th, 2007 when the late, great Jim Johnson put the clamps on our offense and showed the rest of the league how to beat Jason Garrett. He has no real feel for the game, makes counter intuitive decisions at times, and just looks completely caught off guard at times in crucial game situations.

And his one saving grace[bringing in talent] is in question. He had the great 2011 draft, but 2012 looks pitiful right now, and 2013 looks relatively average. And now that I think of it, 2011 doesn't look that great anymore now that Carter has fallen off a bit.

 

[TrailBlazer]

Many of you are calling for Garrett's head on a stick. I'm not defending him. I'm not even sure he is the right man for the job. I am sick and tired about hearing his "process" bull**** like many other posters on the website. But those of you calling for his head should take a step back and be realistic just for a second. We could do worse......

In fact we have done worse. Think Chan Gailey. Think "The Mad Poodle" Dave Campo. Many would argue Garrett would be an upgrade over Barry Switzer (But Barry Switzer had a much better feel for when to take a risk than any other Cowboys Coach not named Landry or Johnson.)

Fire Garrett, and find the next Jimmy Johnson? That could happen. But would the smart money be on the fact that the next coach would be more like Jimmy Johnson, or Dave Campo? Be honest with yourself. If you really think Jerry Jones and Company suck as bad as a GM as you think he is what makes you think he is going to hire a better coach than Garrett.

This isn't really my position on the matter .... to the Cowboys' detractors ... I'm just sayin'......

So your defense of JG is that we could do worse? Okay. We could also do much better. I would rather try someone else than stick with someone that I know will fail.

 

[Hoofbite]

This is what reality looks like, guys.

 

[khiladi]

We've had stability in this offense for six years. The only place where we had no identity was defense, where we changed our system and coaches. The only constant in identity with this team system wise is what is affiliated with Garrett and it's our downfall. Everything has been his scapegoat.

 

[Tractor1]

It's an entirely different NFL.

It was indeed. Expansion or not, it took five years for the first Cowboys to have a non-losing season. The sixth was an Eastern conference championship. I would rather the Cowboys not blow things up. Add pieces and get better.

 

[Cowboysfan1975]

The difference between Gailey/Campo and Red is that those teams had absolutely 0 talent on the offensive side of the football, and never had serious playmakers on defense.

Gailey actually took Dallas to the playoffs both years he was HC, JG has still hasn't done it.

JG really doesn't have more talent than Wade Phillips or the last couple years of the Tuna. So at some point you stop pointing to the HC and look at the rest of the franchise. JG probably wasn't ready for a head coaching job, but I also don't think any head coach will be successful here.