Twitter: Greg Hardy will consult with NFLPA whether to take his suspension to federal court

[casmith07]

I think he should fight to give back 2-4 game checks while on the exempt list and then have the suspension lifted. That would seem to be fair for both sides.

This is a creative remedy and one I would like to see happen.

 

[LandryFan]

This is a creative remedy and one I would like to see happen.

Will never happen...too sensible.

 

[GroundZero1970]

IIRC, Goodell suspended him for "Conduct Detrimental to the League" rather than Player Misconduct. If that's the case, I don't recall any precedent for that (players suspended for similar misconduct in the past were always suspended for player misconduct rather than conduct detrimental to the league). If what I stated is correct, then that could work for or against Hardy, depending on whether a Judge buys him being rightfully suspended for conduct detrimental to the league. If a Judge calls BS on that, then he/she might throw out the suspension altogether...am I off base here, or does my thought process have merit?

The problem is he was convicted of nothing because it was overturned so I ask then how is being guilty of nothing detrimental to the league?

 

[erod]

He was on the exempt lost while with the Panthers

I know. But why would that be fair to Jerry here. He wasn't even in the picture when this occurred.

Besides, they're not reinstituting the exempt list on Hardy.

 

[BringBackThatOleTimeBoys]

If Hardy's defense is lack of due process, the NFL and specifically Goodell is vulnerable.

The outcome of the Brady case may not be the only thing for Goodell to worry about.

 

[slick325]

I think he should fight to give back 2-4 game checks while on the exempt list and then have the suspension lifted. That would seem to be fair for both sides.

First, love the screen name! Everson was one of my favorite players growing up. Second, I think this is a good idea. Hardy pays a hefty fine of two game checks from last season. But, for public perception, not sure the League will accept it. The League is taking its lumps right now and can't appear to be allowing Hardy to skate by paying a fine instead of being suspended. It will look soft on DV. They would much rather the Courts appear to be the bad guy.

 

[erod]

At this point, after all these appeals court losses, the NFL has lost control of its league, its rules, and its players. It's a free for all now.

They should just remove all rules regarding off-the-field behavior, substance abuse, PEDs, everything. Let the legal system handle everything.

 

[LandryFan]

The problem is he was convicted of nothing because it was overturned so I ask then how is being guilty of nothing detrimental to the league?

The league doesn't have to have a "guilty" verdict in court to suspend a player. Hardy's legal team could use the fact that the case never reached a jury trial as part of the basis to lessen/vacate the suspension, but an actual conviction isn't a requirement for the commish to be able to suspend a player.

 

[slick325]

At this point, after all these appeals court losses, the NFL has lost control of its league, its rules, and its players. It's a free for all now.

They should just remove all rules regarding off-the-field behavior, substance abuse, PEDs, everything. Let the legal system handle everything.

The League hasn't lost control at all Erod. The League needs to make a concerted effort to codify and make uniform its penalties. Make it clear what a first offense for deflating a football will be, second offense, third offense etc. Then do this will all legal matters (DV, Gun possession, Burglary, Larceny, Assault, etc.). No different than what each State does with its laws. Or how our Federal Laws give notice of what is illegal and the punishment for violations. Just common sense for them to do so.

Get together with the NFLPA and both sides pay someone to come up with the notice necessary. That is the true spirit of "collective bargaining".

 

[erod]

The League hasn't lost control at all Erod. The League needs to make a concerted effort to codify and make uniform its penalties. Make it clear what a first offense for deflating a football will be, second offense, third offense etc. Then do this will all legal matters (DV, Gun possession, Burglary, Larceny, Assault, etc.). No different than what each State does with its laws. Or how our Federal Laws give notice of what is illegal and the punishment for violations. Just common sense for them to do so.

Get together with the NFLPA and both sides pay someone to come up with the notice necessary. That is the true spirit of "collective bargaining".

How do you make a rule for deflated footballs? Was that even considered? What's the penalty for secretly filming another team's practices?

What's the penalty for sharpening your spikes, or putting titanium in your elbow pads? What's the penalty for telling your official timer to pad the clock?

What is the penalty for beating your son's scrotum with a switch? Where does that fall in the ole rule book?

At a company, any of these things could get you fired. Period. These activist courts are not going to rule in the NFL's favor on these because it's not spelled out verbatim for these odd types of offenses.

 

[casmith07]

The league doesn't have to have a "guilty" verdict in court to suspend a player. Hardy's legal team could use the fact that the case never reached a jury trial as part of the basis to lessen/vacate the suspension, but an actual conviction isn't a requirement for the commish to be able to suspend a player.

The lack of a conviction will play better in court, though, particularly when arguing matters of process.

 

[casmith07]

The League hasn't lost control at all Erod. The League needs to make a concerted effort to codify and make uniform its penalties. Make it clear what a first offense for deflating a football will be, second offense, third offense etc. Then do this will all legal matters (DV, Gun possession, Burglary, Larceny, Assault, etc.). No different than what each State does with its laws. Or how our Federal Laws give notice of what is illegal and the punishment for violations. Just common sense for them to do so.

Get together with the NFLPA and both sides pay someone to come up with the notice necessary. That is the true spirit of "collective bargaining".

They actually don't need to even go that far, in my opinion. What they need is a very clear administrative process. It shouldn't be buried in the CBA - I don't know why they don't have actual policy letters or manuals that spell out exactly what they're supposed to do and exactly what everyone's rights and responsibilities are.

This whole thing could've been avoided if they followed a simple step by step process:

1. Notify player in writing that he is under investigation for allegations. Require player to acknowledge receipt of notification in writing. Notifcation should include a statement that "findings could result in suspension, fines, etc. to be determined based on severity of the allegations" or words to that effect. ----- CHECK, you have met the notice requirement.
2. Conduct investigation, come up with findings. Notify player of the disciplinary action is coming and that they have a right to present matters of mitigation or extenuation for why any disciplinary action should be lenient. Require acknowledgement in writing. ----- CHECK, notice further met, player afforded basic due process.

You do those two things and this case never happens. All they would have had to do is notify, and say that "if you are found to have committed an act or been a significant part of an act found to be to the detriment of the league, you could be disciplined by fines, suspension of games and pay, or both."

That's it. Notice met. No court case.

 

[slick325]

How do you make a rule for deflated footballs? Was that even considered? What's the penalty for secretly filming another team's practices?

What's the penalty for sharpening your spikes, or putting titanium in your elbow pads? What's the penalty for telling your official timer to pad the clock?

What is the penalty for beating your son's scrotum with a switch? Where does that fall in the ole rule book?

At a company, any of these things could get you fired. Period. These activist courts are not going to rule in the NFL's favor on these because it's not spelled out verbatim for these odd types of offenses.

Not everything will be covered but certain things like deflated footballs, sharpening your spikes or putting titanium in your elbow pads can all be grouped together equaling a 1 game fine and suspension. Not as difficult as you think. Lawyers have been doing it since the beginning of civilized societies. The Conduct Policy just as the Constitution should be considered a "living document" so as new matters pop up, the NFL and NFLPA can collectively bargain the punishment.

 

[slick325]

They actually don't need to even go that far, in my opinion. What they need is a very clear administrative process. It shouldn't be buried in the CBA - I don't know why they don't have actual policy letters or manuals that spell out exactly what they're supposed to do and exactly what everyone's rights and responsibilities are.

This whole thing could've been avoided if they followed a simple step by step process:

1. Notify player in writing that he is under investigation for allegations. Require player to acknowledge receipt of notification in writing. Notifcation should include a statement that "findings could result in suspension, fines, etc. to be determined based on severity of the allegations" or words to that effect. ----- CHECK, you have met the notice requirement.
2. Conduct investigation, come up with findings. Notify player of the disciplinary action is coming and that they have a right to present matters of mitigation or extenuation for why any disciplinary action should be lenient. Require acknowledgement in writing. ----- CHECK, notice further met, player afforded basic due process.

You do those two things and this case never happens. All they would have had to do is notify, and say that "if you are found to have committed an act or been a significant part of an act found to be to the detriment of the league, you could be disciplined by fines, suspension of games and pay, or both."

That's it. Notice met. No court case.

I can live with that....

 

[Hoofbite]

Has Goodell removed Hardy from the exempt list yet?

 

[EST_1986]

At this point, after all these appeals court losses, the NFL has lost control of its league, its rules, and its players. It's a free for all now.

They should just remove all rules regarding off-the-field behavior, substance abuse, PEDs, everything. Let the legal system handle everything.

You just went off the deep end

 

[BotchedLobotomy]

Don't you think that if the NFLPA thought there was a good chance that his suspension would be reduced even further that they would have went ahead with taking it to court already?

 

[robjay04]

This is a creative remedy and one I would like to see happen.

Before the recent Rolando McClain suspension, he was scheduled to play the first 4 games without pay until he failed another drug test. That goes to show that it is a possibility worked into the CBA. Hardy could potentially have his pay suspended the first two games but still be allowed to play.

 

[LandryFan]

The lack of a conviction will play better in court, though, particularly when arguing matters of process.

I agree, I was just stating to the other guy that a guilty verdict isn't a requirement for the commish to be able to suspend. The fact that you're stating what I thought...that the lack of a verdict could help Hardy get a suspension reduced/overturned...gives me a stronger sense that he would be successful should he appeal and he should do so quickly.

 

[links18]

How do you make a rule for deflated footballs? Was that even considered?
.

You make a rule against tampering with game equipment? That would probably be specific enough as to give constructive notice.....