Has Linehan done a good job here?

[big dog cowboy]

Garrett has been with the team 9 years. Yes sir. Nine years
During these 9 years as an offensive coordinator and head coach, he has wielded great influence over the offensive scheme, but yet it is still predictable and unimaginative.

Offensive ranking under Garrett by points scored:

2015 - 31
2014 - 5
2013 - 5
2012 - 15
2011 - 15
2010 - 7
2009 - 14
2008 - 18
2007 - 2

 

[Idgit]

No. It is called inability to tailor your playbook to the talent thats available. Weeden said he was told to constantly check down here. I dont think much of Weeden but I do think more of O Brien than anybody on this staff. This staff has show zero ability to make adjustments over the years.

Still, it's easier to tailor your playbook to Brandon Weeden when you defense chips in 4 takeaways and starts the game with a fumble and a defensive score in the first two minutes.

 

[RS12]

Add to that the fact that the Texans have evolved into a system that's mkre conducive to a quarterback carousel (as opposed to Dallas). Cowboys are stuck on Romo and he makes up for the coaching staffs short comings.

Not hard to figure out if you watch for 5 minutes and have an ounce of impartiality.

 

[LocimusPrime]

Offensive ranking under Garrett by points scored:

2015 - 31
2014 - 5
2013 - 5
2012 - 15
2011 - 15
2010 - 7
2009 - 14
2008 - 18
2007 - 2

Thanks that saves me a little research

• That averages to 12.44
• The receiving routes are not creative, no extended use of rub routes, and lack of movement oof receivers ( moving dez and twill around). Terrible use of the second tight end ect.

 

[Doomsday101]

No. Look no further than not being able to win with a backup QB. Weeden goes Houston and wins two games. Coincidence?

No coincidence had nothing to do with it at, all Houston had a defense who got the ball back into the hands of the QB in Dallas weeden was under pressure to score and score often because the defense could not stop jack. hell Weeden put up points and his number in Houston if you look at really not much different He was over 60% completion in Dallas. His avg per pass in Dallas was 8.4 and in Houston 7.05. He avg 152 yards per game in Houston and 184 in Dallas

Houston managed to get things like turnover the Cowboys did not.

 

[LocimusPrime]

No coincidence had nothing to do with it at, all Houston had a defense who got the ball back into the hands of the QB in Dallas weeden was under pressure to score and score often because the defense could not stop jack. hell Weeden put up points and his number in Houston if you look at really not much different He was over 60% completion in Dallas. His avg per pass in Dallas was 8.4 and in Houston 7.05. He avg 152 yards per game in Houston and 184 in Dallas

Houston managed to get things like turnover the Cowboys did not.

I'm on the other side of this discussion, but you make compelling points. Very interesting. It should also be noted that Weeden is the third string qb for Houston now as well.

 

[Idgit]

Offensive ranking under Garrett by points scored:

2015 - 31
2014 - 5
2013 - 5
2012 - 15
2011 - 15
2010 - 7
2009 - 14
2008 - 18
2007 - 2

Same data, by points/offensive series. So it adjusts for defensive/ST scoring (yours might have that adjustment as well) and for games where the number of possessions varies for whatever reason.

2015 - 27
2014 - 2
2013 - 4
2012 - 10
2011 - 8
2010 - 11
2009 - 13
2008 - 14
2007 - 4

Pretty consistent lower-top-half of the league until he took over HC and completed the OL overhaul, then a bump until last season where we know what happened. That's, what, 5 top-10 finishes and 3 top-5 finishes in terms of points in 9 seasons with an unimaginative offense with no adjustments and bad play calling and two offensive coordinators, three play callers, and OL overhaul and no legit WR2 to work with. Not too shabby.

Meanwhile, on defense....oh, nevermind that. The defense has probably been pretty good at stopping opposing QBs and taking the ball away consistently during that time. Otherwise, Garett doesn't suck so much as an offensive coach.

 

[Doomsday101]

I'm on the other side of this discussion, but you make compelling points. Very interesting. It should also be noted that Weeden is the third string qb for Houston now as well.

It helps any QB and offense when defense can shut down the opponent and get turnovers. Weeden big day in Houston his defense created 3 turnovers in the game and shut Tenn down holding them to 6 points. How many times did the Cowboys hold anyone to 6 points last season? And in terms of turnovers Dallas defense managed 11 for the year

 

[LocimusPrime]

It helps any QB and offense when defense can shut down the opponent and get turnovers. Weeden big day in Houston his defense created 3 turnovers in the game and shut Tenn down holding them to 6 points. How many times did the Cowboys hold anyone to 6 points last season? And in terms of turnovers Dallas defense managed 11 for the year

Again, those are very valid points. I especially agree with the turnovers issue

 

[Idgit]

No coincidence had nothing to do with it at, all Houston had a defense who got the ball back into the hands of the QB in Dallas weeden was under pressure to score and score often because the defense could not stop jack. hell Weeden put up points and his number in Houston if you look at really not much different He was over 60% completion in Dallas. His avg per pass in Dallas was 8.4 and in Houston 7.05. He avg 152 yards per game in Houston and 184 in Dallas

Houston managed to get things like turnover the Cowboys did not.

I was getting hammered saying this in-season, but Weeden got a bum rap as a QB2 in Dallas. Yes, he wasn't winning us games with all the check downs, but no, those games should not really have been on the QB2. And even the NO game he engineered a beautiful drive to get that game into OT where it was almost wasted at the end of regulation if not for a doinked kick and then *was* wasted by a blown coverage on the first defensive series.

Considering he had no Dez, some craziness going on at RB, and then lost Dunbar and even Butler in that NOLA game, overall Weeden was pretty average for a backup QB in a league were backup QBs aren't all that good and starters are hard for many teams to find.

 

[Doomsday101]

Again, those are very valid points. I especially agree with the turnovers issue

Linehan offense in Det put up points and in 2014 his offense put up points. Granted in Det he ran mostly passing offense but given he had megatron why not use your best weapon. In Dallas he came in and took advantage of a very good OL and a quality RB in Murray and Dallas ran a balanced offense heck we ran more than we threw and the results showed. Last season Romo going down and Dez being hampered for all of the season hurt as well as losing a power back like Murray. Add to that the defense in 2014 was 2nd in the NFL in getting turnovers which puts the ball back into the hands of offense and as mentioned 2015 saw a total of 11 worst in the NFL.

 

[Doomsday101]

I was getting hammered saying this in-season, but Weeden got a bum rap as a QB2 in Dallas. Yes, he wasn't winning us games with all the check downs, but no, those games should not really have been on the QB2. And even the NO game he engineered a beautiful drive to get that game into OT where it was almost wasted at the end of regulation if not for a doinked kick and then *was* wasted by a blown coverage on the first defensive series.

Considering he had no Dez, some craziness going on at RB, and then lost Dunbar and even Butler in that NOLA game, overall Weeden was pretty average for a backup QB in a league were backup QBs aren't all that good and starters are hard for many teams to find.

I agree Weeden took the blame as most QB do by fans but Football is not a QB alone, winning still takes a team and given the poor play of the defense and big injury to star players Dallas was going to struggle.

 

[Idgit]

It helps any QB and offense when defense can shut down the opponent and get turnovers. Weeden big day in Houston his defense created 3 turnovers in the game and shut Tenn down holding them to 6 points. How many times did the Cowboys hold anyone to 6 points last season? And in terms of turnovers Dallas defense managed 11 for the year

Four takeaways, actually (though only three are shown in the highlights for some reason). And a defensive score. 17 total points off of turnovers and 6 points allowed, total.

Here's the game if anybody is interested. Looks like the exact same Weeden we grew to know and love to me. Strong line-of-sight throws high into the corners of he end zone, and his WRs when up strong and grabbed them for him. He had a nice rushing TD, too, just the sort of thing we saw him do in Dallas.

Texans vs. Titans highlights 

There's no doubt, this game they won on defense.

 

[jobberone]

No. It is called inability to tailor your playbook to the talent thats available. Weeden said he was told to constantly check down here. I dont think much of Weeden but I do think more of O Brien than anybody on this staff. This staff has show zero ability to make adjustments over the years.

If you think you can make a silk purse from a sow's ear then you're right. Teams draft QBs every year and over 50% fail but you think you can drag a player off the trash heap and win games. Now if you want to blame the FO for going into the year with a QB who can't deliver then OK. You could also blame the defense for putting it all on the offense. Coaches coach and players play. You can only coach'em up so much.

 

[Jstopper]

Linehan offense in Det put up points and in 2014 his offense put up points. Granted in Det he ran mostly passing offense but given he had megatron why not use your best weapon. In Dallas he came in and took advantage of a very good OL and a quality RB in Murray and Dallas ran a balanced offense heck we ran more than we threw and the results showed. Last season Romo going down and Dez being hampered for all of the season hurt as well as losing a power back like Murray. Add to that the defense in 2014 was 2nd in the NFL in getting turnovers which puts the ball back into the hands of offense and as mentioned 2015 saw a total of 11 worst in the NFL.

I agree with your premise but technically we passed 50.5% of the time and ran 49.5% of the time. But that's splitting hairs

 

[Frosty]

What is Linehans specialty, brilliant game manager, play caller, motivator, player development. What is his identity as a coach?
Has he ever taken a team to the playoffs, been known as a offensive guru.....St Louis Rams, Dolphins, Detroit and now Dallas....nothing special been a jag everywhere he has been. Not sure what his specialty is....not sure he is a difference maker?

 

[RS12]

If you think you can make a silk purse from a sow's ear then you're right. Teams draft QBs every year and over 50% fail but you think you can drag a player off the trash heap and win games. Now if you want to blame the FO for going into the year with a QB who can't deliver then OK. You could also blame the defense for putting it all on the offense. Coaches coach and players play. You can only coach'em up so much.

Take a look at what O Brien did with Hackenberg at Penn St and Weeden last year. Take a look at what David Lee did with Tyrod Taylor in Buffalo last year. Those would be some examples of coaching them up. Checking down constantly isnt my idea of coaching em up.

 

[Idgit]

Take a look at what O Brien did with Hackenberg at Penn St and Weeden last year. Take a look at what David Lee did with Tyrod Taylor in Buffalo last year. Those would be some examples of coaching them up. Checking down constantly isnt my idea of coaching em up.

What are you seeing in O'Brien coaching Brandon Weeden up that nobody else is able to point to? The numbers on the defensive support are pretty clear. The game highlights show you the exact same player we had here. I know it's important to believe he was coached up in the month or so he spent on their roster as the QB3, but it'd be great if somebody could illustrate how he did it and why it somehow looked like the exact same Brandon Weeden on the field.

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

I think we are going to learn a lot about how good or bad he might be this year. This, of course, assumes that Tony is healthy. If Tony goes down, then it's a built in excess again. However, it's hard to evaluate anybody on the Coaching Staff (Offense) because Tony has the freedom to audible into anything at any time. Let's say we see a game where Tony is throwing 70% of the time and he ends up getting injured again. I think you can place blame on the Coaching Staff because they need to limit that in order to try and keep Tony healthy. You have to take some of that freedom away and start making calls that prevent that IMO. You might lose some games here and there but honestly, our OL is so good that we should be able to win most games if we just stay balanced, keep Tony clean and allow him to make throws we know he can make. If we don't do that, then it's on the Coaches IMO but will Jerry do anything about that? I'm not sure he will or he wont.

 

[jobberone]

Thanks that saves me a little research

• That averages to 12.44
• The receiving routes are not creative, no extended use of rub routes, and lack of movement oof receivers ( moving dez and twill around). Terrible use of the second tight end ect.

And what years did Romo play most of the snaps?

1. Routes are run by WRs not the QB or the WR coach and esp not the OC or HC. We have had some problems getting guys to know where to line up correct much less run routes well. And if you think that's all on the coaches you'd be wrong. You can fault talent acquisition though.

2. We don't use rub routes well. How much of that is on the coaches I don't know but you can bet answer 1 comes into play some.

3. Again Dez has had trouble lining up and running routes although I'd say that is mostly rectified presently. You have to understand the difference between the X and Z WR and why they are the X and Z. You can't move Dez around if he's the X unless you cover the tackle and move him off the line making him not the X. You also have to understand who you are playing, how they have played receivers in the past and how well they play certain players in certain coverages. I will say they should be able to move Dez around a little bit. Consider also moving him around a lot will not just change your offense but also how the defense defends that, what player, etc. You can't line up T Will at the X a lot with some teams who can rub him off the LOS.

4. They need to get creative with the other TEs. I don't know how much of that is on Romo, how much on play calling or how much on each TE. You'd have to be way closer to the situation than we are to know. You'd also have to know the game much better than the average fan.

5. RBs need to be more involved in the passing game and Garrett and Linehan have tried to get that rocking. Injuries to Dunbar hurt that this and last year and to Elliott this year isn't helping. That's a player acquisition and talent problem same as no screens.

This game is just not as simple as you're making it out to be.