Hill: Jones Unfraid Of NFC East Improvement, Says Cowboys Better Too

[Pants]

my only concern at this point is depth....I see this team like a bunch of 16-year olds that can play hockey REALLY well, they are out on the lake and kicking butt and taking names, the other kinda in the neighborhood can't beat them...but, it only takes that one spot of thin ice to crack and for your best player(s) to fall through the ice (see: Romo, '15)....then you are left with little 12-year old jimmy, who never gets to play, so he isn't any good....then your team gets bullied and loses regularly

 

[GhostOfPelluer]

my only concern at this point is depth....I see this team like a bunch of 16-year olds that can play hockey REALLY well, they are out on the lake and kicking butt and taking names, the other kinda in the neighborhood can't beat them...but, it only takes that one spot of thin ice to crack and for your best player(s) to fall through the ice (see: Romo, '15)....then you are left with little 12-year old jimmy, who never gets to play, so he isn't any good....then your team gets bullied and loses regularly

That's the weirdest analogy I've ever read on this site.

 

[Oh_Canada]

Yea and you watched them play on other teams not the team that will take the field next season for the Cowboys.

They wouldn't be the first free agents to underperform when getting here.

Maybe. Maybe not, but it's not like Darrelle Revis 2008 walking out that door.

 

[Bullflop]

Pass that bottle of Wild Turkey around!!

Yep -- it's Jerry with a buzz, putting on his rose-colored glasses and morphing into sales pitch mode.

 

[Bullflop]

It's not like they have a track record of such and are in their physical primes.

Sayest ye, with a sly grin and tongue planted firmly in cheek . . .

 

[big dog cowboy]

my only concern at this point is depth....I see this team like a bunch of 16-year olds that can play hockey REALLY well, they are out on the lake and kicking butt and taking names, the other kinda in the neighborhood can't beat them...but, it only takes that one spot of thin ice to crack and for your best player(s) to fall through the ice (see: Romo, '15)....then you are left with little 12-year old jimmy, who never gets to play, so he isn't any good....then your team gets bullied and loses regularly

http://i899.***BLOCKED***/albums/ac195/pew_pew/General/Fillioncanttalk.gif

 

[xwalker]

Jones can spin it however he wants, but we've done nothing to get better. We simply haven't lost the type of players who should make us much worse. If we do a good job in the draft, we do have a chance to be better than we were last year, but so should the teams who have done more in free agency to improve.

He probably sees the offense as being even better with Dak and Zeke in their 2nd year and Dez potentially healthy all season.

On defense:
DT Collins was a starter as a rookie after missing most of training camp with a broken foot. He should be even better.
CB Brown played a significant role as a rookie and should be even better.
Claiborne was out in the 2nd half of the season and not good in the playoffs.
Carr might not have been a starter this year in 2 CB sets if he stayed, with Brown in his 2nd year and Scandrick further removed from his knee injury.
Heath/Frazier replace Church/Wilcox. Is this good or bad?
DLaw won't be suspended for 4 games and might be healthy.
Irving still has room to improve.
DT McClain was good early, but faded late in the season.
Paea/Thorton should be steady veterans at DT.
LB Wilson looked good at SLB. If no Jaylon, he might be the new MLB.
Jaylon has the potential to be great.
Mayowa improved as the season progressed and his knee got healthier.
Tapper has potential that was not available last season.

I see the defense as potentially better, even without the 2017 draft picks.

 

[xwalker]

Both Carr and McClain signed bigger deals, which only tells us that teams thought more highly of them than Carroll and Paea. That doesn't mean Carroll and Paea can't be upgrades, but I don't think we should exactly being expecting it.

They have a lot of options at DT. The rookie Collins was the starting 3-tech DT last season. They just need to figure out who is the other starter.
Collins
Thorton
Paea
Irving
Crawford

 

[kevm3]

I think people are going to learn to appreciate the secondary we had once we put a bunch of rookies in the backfield with no kind of pass rush.

 

[Verdict]

I prefer building through the draft. From last year we got Zeke, Dak, M. Collins, and Brown that saw major playing time. Frazier got a few reps and should be better this year. IF Tapper and Smith can contribute that will help as well. David Irving is young and hopefully improving. We still have Lee. Hopefully B. Jones continue to grow in year 3. Crawford, Thornton, and Paea are good rotational guys. Now IF we draft well we could be ok.

Mo was solid but stayed hurt, Carr was solid but is Carroll a drop off? McClain stayed hurt most of the time he was here.

Of course. Everyone including the team would rather build through the draft. But we were drafting 4th overall last year. This year we are drafting near the bottom.

You you could cross off Zeke off of last year's draft class and add an udfa in his place and that would be last year's draft class this year.

That's still not bad. But the class would look a lot different with Smith as your top pick. Granted we would still have Collins, Dak and Brown as solid contributors and two great potential picks in Jaylon and Tapper but it wouldn't be a draft of a lifetime discussion at this point like it is now.

 

[big dog cowboy]

I think people are going to learn to appreciate the secondary we had once we put a bunch of rookies in the backfield

Heath and Carroll are rookies?

 

[LocimusPrime]

my only concern at this point is depth....I see this team like a bunch of 16-year olds that can play hockey REALLY well, they are out on the lake and kicking butt and taking names, the other kinda in the neighborhood can't beat them...but, it only takes that one spot of thin ice to crack and for your best player(s) to fall through the ice (see: Romo, '15)....then you are left with little 12-year old jimmy, who never gets to play, so he isn't any good....then your team gets bullied and loses regularly

I've seen that happen before.

 

[gimmesix]

He probably sees the offense as being even better with Dak and Zeke in their 2nd year and Dez potentially healthy all season.

On defense:
DT Collins was a starter as a rookie after missing most of training camp with a broken foot. He should be even better.
CB Brown played a significant role as a rookie and should be even better.
Claiborne was out in the 2nd half of the season and not good in the playoffs.
Carr might not have been a starter this year in 2 CB sets if he stayed, with Brown in his 2nd year and Scandrick further removed from his knee injury.
Heath/Frazier replace Church/Wilcox. Is this good or bad?
DLaw won't be suspended for 4 games and might be healthy.
Irving still has room to improve.
DT McClain was good early, but faded late in the season.
Paea/Thorton should be steady veterans at DT.
LB Wilson looked good at SLB. If no Jaylon, he might be the new MLB.
Jaylon has the potential to be great.
Mayowa improved as the season progressed and his knee got healthier.
Tapper has potential that was not available last season.

I see the defense as potentially better, even without the 2017 draft picks.

I think the defense could go either way, but yes, it is potentially better if young players experience growth and players being counted out for bigger roles pan out.

I'm not big on counting on potential or players succeeding in bigger roles when they have not proven they can. I believe you are what you are until you prove differently. This is why I would have preferred that we picked up a couple of proven quality veterans at positions where there are question marks.

If some here believe Carroll and Moore and proven quality vets, then so be it. I don't see it that way. I don't mind having them as depth, but IMO there are still holes at corner, defensive end and safety we need to fill, and we're putting all our eggs in the draft basket to fill them.

Now, I do see corner as the lesser need because we do have Scandrick and Brown looked like at least an OK starter in an extended look, but we've put ourselves in a position where we absolutely need to hit on a stud DE and starting strong safety IMO.

 

[big dog cowboy]

Heath and Carroll are rookies?

Not to mention Scandrick and Brown.

 

[xwalker]

I think the defense could go either way, but yes, it is potentially better if young players experience growth and players being counted out for bigger roles pan out.

I'm not big on counting on potential or players succeeding in bigger roles when they have not proven they can. I believe you are what you are until you prove differently. This is why I would have preferred that we picked up a couple of proven quality veterans at positions where there are question marks.

If some here believe Carroll and Moore and proven quality vets, then so be it. I don't see it that way. I don't mind having them as depth, but IMO there are still holes at corner, defensive end and safety we need to fill, and we're putting all our eggs in the draft basket to fill them.

Now, I do see corner as the lesser need because we do have Scandrick and Brown looked like at least an OK starter in an extended look, but we've put ourselves in a position where we absolutely need to hit on a stud DE and starting strong safety IMO.

In regards to comparing this defense to the 2016 defense, my primary concern is probably Strong Safety. I terms of coverage, I think Heath might be better than either Church or Wilcox; however, I'm concerned about him playing as an in-the-box Safety. Most draft analysts thought Frazier would be great in run defense, but questioned his coverage ability. Maybe between those 2 they can be good enough if they don't draft a Safety.

DE should be at least a little better. Tapper is now an option. Mayowa played through a knee issue last season. DLaw might be healthier. Moore is a bonus if he does anything.

They lost depth at CB, but Brown, Scandrick and Carroll might be better than Carr, Scandrick (coming off injury) and Brown (rookie).

Collins started at DT last season as a rookie. McClain was good but faded at the end of the season. They still have Thorton, added Paea and one of Irving or Crawford will take a lot of snaps at DT.

Last year was Byron Jones first year starting at FS. That's a difficult position mentally. He should be more comfortable there this season.

I'm not even really counting on Jaylon at MLB. I think Wilson could upgrade the Hitchens/Durant role if Jaylon can't play.

Yep, the more I think about it, I'm not really worried about the defense being worse than last year. They could be a little better before they add in the 2017 picks. If they hit on a couple of defensive players in the draft, then they could be a lot better than last year.

 

[noshame]

Well we played a lot of teams last year that had either horrible quarterbacks or they're good quarterback was injured in some fashion I don't think we'll be that lucky this year
I'm just hoping for the best

 

[xwalker]

I think people are going to learn to appreciate the secondary we had once we put a bunch of rookies in the backfield with no kind of pass rush.

The secondary projects to be:
Brown: Looked like the best CB in some games last year as a rookie.
Scandrick: He will be another year removed from his knee surgery.
Carroll: He'll be the 3rd CB unless a rookie beats him out.
Heath/Frazier: Replaces Church/Wilcox. Some concerns, but Heath has looked better than Church/Wilcox in some games the past couple of years.
Jones: Last year was his 1st year playing Safety in the NFL.

There will only be a rookie DB playing if he proves to be better than the above projected starters.

 

[gimmesix]

In regards to comparing this defense to the 2016 defense, my primary concern is probably Strong Safety. I terms of coverage, I think Heath might be better than either Church or Wilcox; however, I'm concerned about him playing as an in-the-box Safety. Most draft analysts thought Frazier would be great in run defense, but questioned his coverage ability. Maybe between those 2 they can be good enough if they don't draft a Safety.

DE should be at least a little better. Tapper is now an option. Mayowa played through a knee issue last season. DLaw might be healthier. Moore is a bonus if he does anything.

They lost depth at CB, but Brown, Scandrick and Carroll might be better than Carr, Scandrick (coming off injury) and Brown (rookie).

Collins started at DT last season as a rookie. McClain was good but faded at the end of the season. They still have Thorton, added Paea and one of Irving or Crawford will take a lot of snaps at DT.

Last year was Byron Jones first year starting at FS. That's a difficult position mentally. He should be more comfortable there this season.

I'm not even really counting on Jaylon at MLB. I think Wilson could upgrade the Hitchens/Durant role if Jaylon can't play.

Yep, the more I think about it, I'm not really worried about the defense being worse than last year. They could be a little better before they add in the 2017 picks. If they hit on a couple of defensive players in the draft, then they could be a lot better than last year.

I don't share your outlook. I don't see any reason to believe that this defense will show significant improvement over last year's.

In fact, I think many have been singing this same tune about the defense for years (we'll be better because the young players will improve while some other players will finally be healthy) and so far it's remained offkey.

We'll be better when we add some difference makers to this defense because we've only got one.

 

[Rockdoc]

I think Heath maybe fine
we run our safety assignments weird
Jones is "FS" but covers the TE
we want Heath to cover deep but he is taking over for Wilcox/Church?
idk but as long as it works.

 

[gimmesix]

Of course. Everyone including the team would rather build through the draft. But we were drafting 4th overall last year. This year we are drafting near the bottom.

You you could cross off Zeke off of last year's draft class and add an udfa in his place and that would be last year's draft class this year.

That's still not bad. But the class would look a lot different with Smith as your top pick. Granted we would still have Collins, Dak and Brown as solid contributors and two great potential picks in Jaylon and Tapper but it wouldn't be a draft of a lifetime discussion at this point like it is now.

If we were drafting where we are this year, it's likely either we would have traded up for Lynch or taken a DE like Ogbah.

Other than Smith, who might have been gone by the time we picked next, the rest of the draft could have been the same, although our fourth-round picks possibly would have changed depending on who we got in the first.

It could have looked like this: Ogbah, Collins, Connor Cook, Jordan Howard (I'm being nice and giving him to us in the late fourth), Brown, Frazier, Jackson, Gathers.