How many current Cowboys OL would've started during the 'Great Wall' era?

[dallasdave]

you have truly creative eyesight if you think Free is either nasty or all that important.

Free is not a "bad man". He is the guy that is known for being offsides

 

[dallasdave]

That's picture Tyron, Martin, Frederick, Larry Allen, and Erik Williams as the Cowboys offensive line today all playing today . There is only one way to describe that "Oh What a Rush"!!!!!!!!!!!!

This OL = Super Bowl win.

 

[joseephuss]

Emmitt smith made that 90's line. People forget that same line sucked before enmity got there and almost got Aikman killed

It really wasn't the same line in 1989.

LT Mark Tuinei
LG Nate Newton
C Tom Rafferty(8 games) Mark Stepnoski(rookie 4 games) Bob White (4 games)
RG Crawford Ker
RT Kevin Gogan

That isn't the same line Emmitt ran behind, nor the same line(s) that played in the Superbowl seasons.

Which 90s OL are we talking about because we never had the same 5 starting in our 3 superbowls.

Great point. The line up even changed during each Superbowl season due to injuries.

 

[erod]

Stepnoski couldn't be replaced. He supplied the weed.

 

[xwalker]

Well, this discussion just cements my thoughts/visions of this OL ever since we drafted Martin. Of course I never would have imagined Martin becoming an All-Pro his rookie season, but I'll gladly admit I was wrong. As soon as my prayers were answered and we passed up Manziel to pick Martin, I had a visions of Dallas resurrecting the "Great Wall". So much so, that my friends laughed at me when I picked Murray in the first round of my fantasy league.(guess who had the last laugh The mere fact that this discussion exist confirms the "Great Wall II".

Second thought, Doug Free is very under estimated.. And I believe the FO thinks so too. The OL was noticeably different when he wasn't playing. Maturity, attitude, and 'Skins on the Great Wall' are hard to measure. He brought a nastiness that trickled down the right side of the line that Parnell just couldn't match. Now, I'm not saying he would replace anyone on the original Great Wall, but he's definitely worth mentioning and better than most give him credit for. And I'll add this nugget.. a few people will remember a fellow by the name of Kevin Gogan. He played on the earlier version of the 90's Cowboys OL. He's nickname was the 'Big Nasty'. My opinion, Free and Gogan could have been interchangeable.

Murray has the same average per carry with both Free and Parnell starting. The team allowed slightly less sacks with Parnell starting (1.8 sack per game with Parnell, 1.9 sacks per game with Free).

 

[xwalker]

In your opinion does this line have the potential to be better then the Great Wall?

It was very close in 2014, but it will always be limited as long as Doug Free is one of the five. Free wouldn't make the 53 man roster in 1993.

The nineties OLs usually had at least 1 just average player. Keep in mind that the Pre Car Wreck Erik Williams didn't really play together. LA because a starter after EW's car crash. I think LA started 1 game together with EW in 1994.

Guys like Gesek, Gogan, and Kennard were never what I would call elite players. They were probably all on the level of Ron Leary.

The Starting Lineups as I recall:
1992 and 1993
Mark Tuinei
Nate Newton
Mark Stepnoski
Kevin Gogan / John Gesek
Erik Williams

1994
Mark Tuinei
Nate Newton
Mark Stepnoski
Derek Kennard
Erik Williams / Larry Allen

1995
Mark Tuinei
Nate Newton
Mark Stepnoski
Larry Allen
Erik Williams (after car wreck)

 

[Hostile]

It is an interesting question. I think Tyron Smith has the ability to be better than Mark Tuinei was. Right now, I'd say they are about even. I like Travis Frederick better than anyone we have ever started at Center, and I would take him over Mark Stepnoski. No way is Zack Martin better than Larry Allen, comparing LG to LG, but is he better than Nate Newton? Martin is versatile and could move to the Left side quite easily. I think potentially he could end up being better than Nate, but he's not there yet, and he's not in a virtual tie with Nate like Smith and Tuinei are. I think Nate is a little under appreciated because LA was so amazingly dominant.

 

[KB1122]

What's the Great Wall era? Nobody ever called it that.

 

[joseephuss]

It was very close in 2014, but it will always be limited as long as Doug Free is one of the five. Free wouldn't make the 53 man roster in 1993.

The nineties OLs usually had at least 1 just average player. Keep in mind that the Pre Car Wreck Erik Williams didn't really play together. LA because a starter after EW's car crash. I think LA started 1 game together with EW in 1994.

Guys like Gesek, Gogan, and Kennard were never what I would call elite players. They were probably all on the level of Ron Leary.

The Starting Lineups as I recall:
1992 and 1993
Mark Tuinei
Nate Newton
Mark Stepnoski
Kevin Gogan / John Gesek
Erik Williams

1994
Mark Tuinei
Nate Newton
Mark Stepnoski
Derek Kennard
Erik Williams / Larry Allen

1995
Mark Tuinei
Nate Newton
Mark Stepnoski
Larry Allen
Erik Williams (after car wreck)

Pretty close. Stepnoski was gone in 1995. Ray Donaldson started until getting injured late in the season then Derek Kennard took over at center.

 

[BAT]

SOME people have this theory all you need is to be mean> Sorry but that is BS. Tyron is just so much better the athlete that in a head to head Tui would lose the job battle.

Then I would not be some people. Tui's nastiness combined with his short area power gives him the advantage over Tyron's athleticism in the scheme that Cowboys played in the 90s. Tyron is a move player who excels in zone. Tuinei was a very good athlete too in addition to his powerful punch, he was a DT when he originally came into the league.

 

[dreghorn2]

Tuinei, was good, very good, just ask the premier defensive end from that era Bruce Smith, he'll tell you.

 

[BAT]

Yeah Tui was a great scrappy player but Tyron is just so much a better athlete that in the end he would be the starter.

Either you did not watch him play or you have clearly forgotten. Tuinei absolutely erased Bruce Smith in 2 consecutive SBs. Bruce Smith is top 3 ever. Many say only Reggie White was better. Tyron may get to that level, he's not there yet.

 

[Hardline]

Tyron
Allen
Fredrick
Martin
Williams

 

[Proximo]

This cross era speculation is horse crap.
Sorry, but jmo.

It's fun speculation for fans, especially this time of year. The free agency boom is over and one can only read so many mock drafts.

As long as these fantasy/hypothetical discussions don't get taken too seriously it's all good.

 

[burmafrd]

Either you did not watch him play or you have clearly forgotten. Tuinei absolutely erased Bruce Smith in 2 consecutive SBs. Bruce Smith is top 3 ever. Many say only Reggie White was better. Tyron may get to that level, he's not there yet.

I watched him play his entire career and unlike You with the creative eyesight. Tui was so scrappy and so competitive that he really accomplished more than his physical ability should have allowed. BUT unlike SOME I realize that even THAT has its limits. Tyron is sneaky strong and so quick. And that wingspan. So YES if both were at their peak (And Tyron is not there yet) Tui would lose.

 

[burmafrd]

Tuinei, was good, very good, just ask the premier defensive end from that era Bruce Smith, he'll tell you.

there is always one player that is another players kryptonite. So that means very little.

 

[fweegy]

Smith, Larry, Step (pre knee injury, Fred after), Martin, Erik. Run the wing T, we'd never heard of two guys named Aikman or Irvin.

 

[Tractor1]

Stepnoski couldn't even be a backup in today's NFL. Too small.

That opinion is bull....Step was considered too small even during his era, but was the master of leverage. Fred might win the battle, but not because Step is too small.

 

[Nirvana]

What's the Great Wall era? Nobody ever called it that.

NFLN had an episode of "A football life" last night with that name. Good watch.

 

[BAT]

I watched him play his entire career and unlike You with the creative eyesight. Tui was so scrappy and so competitive that he really accomplished more than his physical ability should have allowed. BUT unlike SOME I realize that even THAT has its limits. Tyron is sneaky strong and so quick. And that wingspan. So YES if both were at their peak (And Tyron is not there yet) Tui would lose.

So you are saying Tyron WILL be better or at the very least SHOULD be better? And it is this future Tyron who beats Tui? LOL. Okay Nostradamus. You know what they say about counting chickens especially when anything can happen between now and THEN. Just ask Erik Williams. What Tui has accomplished and what Tyron has accomplished is not even close looking at their careers right now. The comparison is right now since I don't have your ability to read tea leaves.