Hurts' salary numbers over the 4 years

[Aerolithe_Lion]

I really like Hurts. Good story and a good role model for anyone that wants to make it in this world. Do you think Hurts could have passed like Dak did against the Eagles top ranked pass defense? I have never seen Hurts having to make those types of reads before.

Who knows? A main reason we were a top ranked pass defense was because of our pass rush, something your and KC’s Olines mitigated. We got thrashed by Fields’ running ability, as well as Dak’s passing… so if there was a guy who could run AND throw to beat us that may cause some issues.

 

[Aerolithe_Lion]

Dak has 3 seasons in the top 5 of deep passing accuracy.

Dak was 4th in 2021 and 2016 and Jalen didn't even make the list before last year.
https://www.statmuse.com/nfl/ask/most-accurate-deep-ball-qb-2021

Last year Jalen made the list for the first time and was 11th.
Dak was 14th without a deep threat on the team other than CeeDee.

What Jalen does well is keep plays alive and provide a legit rush threat.
But he has made MAJOR improvement each year and could be quite special if this is the level he sets as standard.

Yeah, I’m not comparing before he became 2022 Jalen Hurts. Dak was definitely better as a rookie

 

[Jimbo123]

I'm not sure I like that a whole lot better. Hurts didn't win a SB with the consensus best roster in the league around him and he will have neither that OL nor that defense in 2023. They've lost a bunch of good players despite Roseman's can kicking and they aren't gonna be able to replace them all through the draft. For all his wizardry, Roesman is not great at acquiring players via the Annual NFL Player Selection Meeting.

Dallas will be better. The Gints will be better. Washington will be better. SF beat Philly in the NFC championship game and then took one of the Eagles' best defensive players. SF's boy wonder QB will be in his second season. SF is damn sure going to be better. I'm not sure Philly is, and it remains to be if they'll be any better in the future if they continue to rent players and struggle in the draft.

When was the last time SF beat Philly in the NFC championship game? I do remember SF beating Dallas. The demise of the Philadelphia Eagles is greatly exaggerated.

 

[baltcowboy]

Who knows? A main reason we were a top ranked pass defense was because of our pass rush, something your and KC’s Olines mitigated. We got thrashed by Fields’ running ability, as well as Dak’s passing… so if there was a guy who could run AND throw to beat us that may cause some issues.

This season he will be tested. Hurts will get the Lamar MVP treatment this season. Teams are going to come for him.

 

[VACowboy]

When was the last time SF beat Philly in the NFC championship game? I do remember SF beating Dallas. The demise of the Philadelphia Eagles is greatly exaggerated.

I got stupid for a second and remembered SF in the SB for some reason. My sincere apologies.

It depends how you define "demise." I don't know how anyone looks at the players they've lost and predicts the Philadelphia Eagles to be as good as they were last year.

 

[Aerolithe_Lion]

This season he will be tested. Hurts will get the Lamar MVP treatment this season. Teams are going to come for him.

A major difference in Lamar and Jalen is Lamar never had these weapons. The QBs who see single high safety the most: Lamar, Fields, Malik Willis, Jalen Hurts. They bring an additional guy down to the box to prevent the scrambling.

But with Jalen you have to make a choice; are you comfortable guarding AJ Brown single coverage on every go route?

 

[Aerolithe_Lion]

I got stupid for a second and remembered SF in the SB for some reason. My sincere apologies.

It depends how you define "demise." I don't know how anyone looks at the players they've lost and predicts the Philadelphia Eagles to be as good as they were last year.

The offseason isn’t over yet, but the only one who’s going to have a noticeable impact is Javon Hargrave. Running backs are a dime a dozen, Miles’ backup with Rashaad Oenny and [insert rookie name here] will cover most of his yards behind this oline; Isaac Seumalo was easily our fifth best Olineman, and we already had his replacement on the roster in 2021’s second round pick; none of the linebackers were more than JAGs; and CJGJ was a nice player for our secondary, but we’ll see was we do at safety between now and training camp…

But I would trade Sean Desai for Javon Hargrave every day of the week

 

[baltcowboy]

A major difference in Lamar and Jalen is Lamar never had these weapons. The QBs who see single high safety the most: Lamar, Fields, Malik Willis, Jalen Hurts. They bring an additional guy down to the box to prevent the scrambling.

But with Jalen you have to make a choice; are you comfortable guarding AJ Brown single coverage on every go route?

We will see. Teams make adjustments. I remember what happened to Cowboys after 2014 and 2016.

 

[jujoboys]

Great breakdown.

I guess where I'm annoyed is the philosophy difference after the deal is done.

Granted, I may just projecting from a frustrated place. I'm grading the Joneses after the fact, and I'm projecting what I think Howie will do, which isn't exactly fair.

I think Roseman will take advantage of the low cap hits and continue making significant free agent moves to throw a few haymakers at winning another super bowl. And if it doesn't work, he'll eat the massive dead money cap while they rebuild and be right back in it later.

The Jones duo has proven that they're too concerned with retaining their own guys to do this.

We will see. Like you said, we can't predict what Howie will do going forward. He did take a different approach this offseason by signing cheap external free agents, retaining some of their older players with tread still left on their tires, and allowing half a dozen key players to walk out of the door via free agency. I wonder if he would have taken a different free agent approach if he knew that the Hurts contract was going to get done and structured like it got structured. One thing we know about Roseman is that he is not afraid to gamble and Lurie has no problem giving him the freedom to gamble..

 

[Spottswoode]

3) Dallas signed Dak to a 4 year deal and allowed the cap hits to be normal or front loaded knowing they would just turn around and restructure every year. The Eagles signed Hurts to a 5 year back loaded contract and went ahead and factored the restructures into the contract which is basically the same result.

I’m no cap expert and am trying to understand team motivations for different structures. Is this ultimately just an exercise in risk tolerance? It sounds like front loading and restructuring as needed while eating more each year but lowering the final bill due could be a preferred structure if you weren’t confident of where things stand X years down the road (I.e. Daniel Jones).

I’m also confused on how extension dollars work. When you restructure a contract and add years, I assume the player will want more money above what they previously agreed to? Does that move even more money from the existing back loaded years to the added extended years? Is it just paying down some of your existing card but applying for and maxing out a new one?

 

[jujoboys]

I’m no cap expert and am trying to understand team motivations for different structures. Is this ultimately just an exercise in risk tolerance? It sounds like front loading and restructuring as needed while eating more each year but lowering the final bill due could be a preferred structure if you weren’t confident of where things stand X years down the road (I.e. Daniel Jones).

I’m also confused on how extension dollars work. When you restructure a contract and add years, I assume the player will want more money above what they previously agreed to? Does that move even more money from the existing back loaded years to the added extended years? Is it just applying for a new card because your existing card is maxed?

I won't claim to be an expert but I will take a stab at it.

Seems like a team would have to be more confident their guy is a stud to set up a contract like Jalen Hurts got. Of course I am saying this without seeing the full details of the contract. We willhave to wait and see if the contract has points in it where you can get out of it early. Howie is great at creating team friendly contracts. Daniel Jones contract is basically a 2 year contract. They could cut him after 2 years with only $18 million dead cap space. Do a June 1st cut and split it between years. However, if they start restructuring his contract next year when he has a base salary of $35 million then they will tie themselves to him longer. This gives them 2023 to do another test drive with him.. If they really like what they see then they convert the $35 million in salary to bonus in 2024 and add voidable years to the contract. If they are just so so with his play then they leave his salary as is and use 2024 as another test year. If they don't really like him after 2024 then cut him and take the small hit.

Hurts had 2023 left on his rookie deal at $4 million. So the Eagles gave him a 5 year extension for $255 million,. Extension was for years 2024 -2028. So actually his deal turns out to be a 6 year deal for $259 million.

Dak was coming off a year where he was franchised the year before. He didn't have a contract. He was set to be a free agent. So his contract was your basic 4 year $160 million dollars covering years 2021-2024. Had we done the same thing with Dak prior to his 4th year in the league we would have been looking at 2019 as Dak's 4th year. He had $2 million on his deal from 2019. His 4 year extension of 4 years $160 million would have gone through 2020-2023. Of course it probably would have been cheaper than 4 years and $160 million because eh would be signing that deal 2 years earlier. Next year Dak would be a free agent.

 

[Spottswoode]

I appreciate the response. So take the Jones case, you decide to restructure for 2 years and convert the 2024 salary of $35M to bonus, does the $35M just get spread across the life of the new extension? Does the team now control Jones for the added 2 years? If yes, does a new salary have to be negotiated for the 2 extended years?

 

[CowboysLakerBamaFan]

How is this possible? Please answer.......anyone (lol)

You may have forgotten to carry the 2.

Or maybe pie has something to do with it?

 

[Nemesis4u]

Yes the cap doesnt exist its BS you can push all the money years and years down the road where the salary cap just keeps going up and up the only way it will ever matter is if the economy crashes and no new TV money comes in. Teams can sign anyone they want ANYONE.

 

[GMO415]

iggles suck.

 

[DandyDon52]

Ok so example the cap hit for 2024 can be small like 13 million, how does that work. Does the bonus money affect the cap or is it just the base salary

it is complicated lol, try doing a search on how cap hit is calculated. They do different things to lower the cap hit , and I dont know all of that,
that is why I call it cap math.
all I know is dak makes 40 mil a year, but with all the cap math, he will never make exactly 40 mil a year. it could be anywhere from 5 to 60 mil

 

[DandyDon52]

Why would our 'greedy diva' take a discount for a franchise that franchised him ? He would have taken a sweetheart deal if we had signed him around the time Goff and others got that contract. Could have had him for around 32 million.

no the jones boys offered him deals and dak turned them down. Jones boys wanted a longer 6 year contract, dak would not do more than 4 years.
He wanted a lot of guaranteed money and a no trade clause.
That is why they had to franchise him, he bet on himself doing good that year, and broke his leg on a non safe run.
They should have cut him after that if he didnt take a 6-7 year deal for way less money, like cousins $, and get rid of the trade clause.

But yes dak turned down all the offers, until they gave him the deal he wanted.

 

[LocoBates]

Coogi it is all "Cap Math" there are a lot of loopholes, and manipulations that go on in big deals like this.
The longer the contract the better it is for the team, as they can move $ to back end, and then either extend or deal with it.

Jones boys wanted dak to take a 6 year deal last time, but dak was greedy and wanted a 4 year deal so he could then get a raise
with the 2nd contract. His deal was not team friendly at all with the length of contract.

mahomes contract was 10 years, so they can do a lot of manipulation, very team friendly.

As you can see , Hurts cap hits will be cheap, so they can spend $ the next 4 years on the players around hurts.
They want to take advantage of the current team and window, and get some rings. I suspect hurt wants to win
more than make a few extra millions, unlike our greedy diva.

The eagles are now all in on hurts, and in winning the nfc for the next 3 years at least, only question is can they beat KC in SB? and
maybe they get lucky and KC doesn't win the afc.

Not too bad considering the next 4 years should be the best years of J Hurts, we have seen what happens to 7yr QBs with similar type of contracts.

 

[DandyDon52]

Dak's been doing the same thing, the Joneses got y'all where they want y'all, thinking Dak cost 40 million against the cap. They cry poor and y'all believe them.

It is 40 mil x4 , no qb gets the exact avg pay each year. but the guaranteed $ will have to be payed at some point, even after player is gone.
in 24 dak is owed 64 mil lol, and they cant pay that so have to extend him or cut him and tank that year. All the $ pushed forward, comes due at some point.

 

[Rockport]

https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id...had-surgery-remove-hardware-ankle-sources-say