If we do sell the farm for Wentz...

[Yakuza Rich]

I agree that you do whatever it takes to get a franchise QB. I won't get into whether or not I think Wentz is supremely better than Goff or Lynch to justify mortgaging the short-term to get him. For the sake of this thread, let's just assume we did trade away a lot to move up to get Wentz. The asking price will probably be similar to what the Skins gave up to get RG3. Let's just say we trade away multiple early picks from multiple future years.

Then the question is, now that we've found our future franchise QB, how do we build a quality team around him? We've seen with Romo that a QB can't do it all by himself. Our best chance at a Super Bowl is still with Romo, but if we don't have any draft picks or money to sign free agents for the remainder of Romo's career, how do we give him a chance to compete for a Super Bowl before he retires? And how do we build a quality team around Wentz for time when he takes over?

So, we won't have any high draft picks for the remainder of Romo's career and possibly the beginning of Wentz's career. We also won't have any money to sign any quality free agents since 1) we've been wary ever since signing guys to bad deals (see Carr), and 2) we need to save all the money we can to resign a bunch of young guys who play expensive positions like OL Frederick, OL Martin, OL Collins, DE Lawrence, DB Jones, and QB Wentz (he'll be needing a new contract around the time he takes over).

And that's assuming Wentz is worth it. I'm not even considering if he's a bust. You need an elite QB in today's NFL, but you also need to build a quality team around them. How do we build a quality team around Romo and Wentz with no draft picks for the next few years and no money for free agents?

I think we have the offensive pieces. I would probably question the RB and TE position for the future, but I do believe we can find a really good RB in the 3rd round (where we found DeMarco) and with this O-Line we can open up running lanes and protect the QB. We have Dez and Beasley locked up and I think we really just need a fast WR who is good at catching deep passes at the #2 WR spot. I think those players pop up in every draft in the mid rounds.

I'd like to see what Hanna can do as Witten will eventually retire. The problem with the TE position is that it's in a down period across the league. Most of these guys were tall WR's in high school and moved over to TE in college and never really learned how to block. So while we could miss our TE...that's a league wide problem.

Defensively is where we need to support our QB.

The big difference between Wentz and RG3 is that I doubt Wentz would start right away. And Wentz also has a body that is ready for the NFL. RG3 started right away which was a bad idea. It allowed the Skins to win the division for that year, but it forever killed his progress. And the injuries didn't help either. I think with Wentz sitting a year he can better adjust to the league. Get his mechanics down pat. Understand his offense and read NFL defenses. Get slowly adjusted to the speed of the game.

Personally, I'm still a Paxton Lynch guy. I think he has more upside than Wentz and we could possibly trade down and still get him. But the same applies as far as what we need to support him.









YR

 

[Idgit]

How many rookies come in and have a big impact? Dallas will take a DE at 4 since there is a huge hole there. He'll get 2 sacks if he's lucky. Rbs and wrs and ol we can have huge impacts but not usually defensive players.

A lot of rookies come in and have a big impact. What did you think of La'el Collins this year? Or Byron Jones? Do you think the Vikes considered 3rd-round pick Danielle Hunter's impact to be big? How about the Chiefs Marcus Peters?

The whole point of the draft is to add talent to your team. You're confusing the fact that players generally get better over time in the NFL with the impact that a rookie can have on a team in his first year.

 

[ElGatoGrande]

The draft charts aren't perfect but they are about 95% accurate on average
so

3000 for 1st overall

1800 = our 1st
560 = our 2nd
245 = our 3rd
420 = next year's 1st (usually valued at mid 2nd rounder for present year)

that equals 3025...so maybe we get them to throw in a 6th

yikes,,, it doesn't seem right that the #1 is worth twice as much as the #4.

 

[DFWJC]

yikes,,, it doesn't seem right that the #1 is worth twice as much as the #4.

yeah
It gets really extreme near the top. Some would say a bit too extreme.
It seems like lately, those trading up (unless it's for a QB) have been getting a slightly better deal than those trading down. Even then, it's only by 5% or so.

 

[Nirvana]

I think what this comes down to is how much chemistry did the coaching staff feel with Wentz at the Senior Bowl. If he is "the guy" they will have confidence to do what it takes to get him.

 

[jnday]

Just a few current NFL starters

Rodgers was drafted 24th
Brees was drafted 31st
Wilson was drafted 75th
Roethlisberger was drafted 11th
Brady was drafted 199th
Romo was undrafted
Flacco was drafted 18th
Carr was drafted 36th
Bridgewater was drafted 32nd
Dalton was drafted 35th

and so on

Now there there are plenty of early (top 5) 1st rounders starting (Palmer, Eli, Luck, etc) but there are several (the majority?) of very good to great ones that were taken much later.

Any argument that they must be in the top 5 and that this is our only or best chance to get one is uninformed.

Common sense says that you get the best talent the higher you pick in the draft. That applies to any position . There was some stats posted on this board that showed the huge difference in success rates of first round QBs verses QBs drafted in all the other rounds combined. It showed why spending a high pick at QB is worth it. There is a big difference in success rates and it shows that hitting on a decent QB after the first is rare.

 

[DFWJC]

Common sense says that you get the best talent the higher you pick in the draft. That applies to any position . There was some stats posted on this board that showed the huge difference in success rates of first round QBs verses QBs drafted in all the other rounds combined. It showed why spending a high pick at QB is worth it. There is a big difference in success rates and it shows that hitting on a decent QB after the first is rare.

I wasn't at all arguing not to use a 1st rounder--sometime--to get a QB. We were discussing the value of burning an entire draft to trade up to 1st overall. I was pointing out that it seems like overkill given that most of those on that list are either elite or at least average currently starting QBs. None were taken in the top 5--which is what I was really referring to.

 

[BigStar]

The bigger question is what will it cost in the future to get the top QB? The cost is high from 4 but would be much higher from the middle of the round. At some point very soon we have to get a QB and the cost, while high, may never be cheaper

This seconded! At most, it would take our 2nd, 3rd, and next year's 1st. Not multiple future 1's. This is also w/o Leary in play with a trade to recoup a lost pick (3rd hopefully). A healthy Romo and Dez will give us a low 1st pick; middle 1st in worst case scenario (bad bounces/luck, etc.) Next season or beyond, trading into the top 5 yet alone 1 from the middle or lower end of the 1st round would definitely cost you multiple 1st rd picks, but not when initially starting @ 4th overall as we are this year.

http://www.ourlads.com/nfldraftvalue/

Just wanted to clear up the trade up ammo needed. If the team sits @ 4 for Goff/Lynch, I wouldn't hate that if they deem that player the better heir to Romo. That said, this FO/coaching staff hasn't been stellar in QB evaluation of young and back up QBs so keep that variable in mind too. They can't develop lesser talented QBs to fit this "scheme", so you better get the best one available.

 

[BigStar]

I don't see what Wentz has accomplished for us to sell the farm for him. If Romo goes out, we'll likely be right in another position to draft a qb high, so there's no reason to go crazy and give up all of these picks to get a qb this time around.

BC we don't have to waste another year on the true rebuild; finding a Franchise QB to takeover for Romo when ready. Betting on tanking isn't any better than getting a top QB this year while Romo is highly functional (when healthy). No 2nd or 3rd round pick would get Romo his SB either

 

[BigStar]

We need to keep that 2nd Rounder in this Draft that's a Starter on the DL or Secondary. There's no way in hell
I would give anybody my #34 picks. Its almost like having 2 1st Rounders this year we really need to 2 to 3 new
Starters to plug and play.

This is where I would be okay with sitting @ 4 for Goff/Lynch and Sampson (S) in the first 2 rds.

 

[BigStar]

The draft charts aren't perfect but they are about 95% accurate on average
so

3000 for 1st overall

1800 = our 1st
560 = our 2nd
245 = our 3rd
420 = next year's 1st (usually valued at mid 2nd rounder for present year)

that equals 3025...so maybe we get them to throw in a 6th

Leary instead of that 3rd? Then variables, would it help TEN or another team willing to cough up a 3rd for Leary, etc.

 

[Fla Cowpoke]

As far as I am concerned there is no reason to move up for Wentz. I think he and Goff are close enough as prospects that you settle for whichever one is there if you are going to take a QB. The fact is that even the best QB doesn't win the Super Bowl each year. Consider that Manning has been rated in the top 2-3 his entire career and only has two Super Bowl trophies, the last one of which he barely contributed to. Aaron Rodgers only has one.

 

[DFWJC]

As far as I am concerned there is no reason to move up for Wentz. I think he and Goff are close enough as prospects that you settle for whichever one is there if you are going to take a QB. The fact is that even the best QB doesn't win the Super Bowl each year. Consider that Manning has been rated in the top 2-3 his entire career and only has two Super Bowl trophies, the last one of which he barely contributed to. Aaron Rodgers only has one.

True.
And also consider that other than the Mannings, it has been a VERY long time since a SB winning QB was selected in the top 5.
Trading up is really pushing it, IMO.
If one is there at 4 that you think is a legit top 5 player, then that's fine.

Bree's, Rodgers, Brady, Wilson, Roethlisberger, Flacco...somewhat recent Super Bowl winning QBs not only not taken in the top 5, but none were even the 1st QB taken in their draft.

I'm just very wary about selling our souls to trade up for one player when he may not even be the best QB in the draft...let alone worth all of the extra picks and dollars

 

[Cowboys1fan]

We will NOT move up for Wentz... Period
Just doesn't seem at all like something we'd be open to at this point

Agreed. Not a chance this happens. You guys act like romo retired. If he did I could see this maybe happening. But it will not!