Interesting Nuggets of Info on Offensive Scheme Last Season

[Longboysfan]

Like many have said. Asking Dak to stand in the pocket and make a play (traditional QB) is asking for failure. He's not that guy.

He needs to have many options available to play at his best.

 

[Kolemmitt]

Yay! I read the article and was worried that the discussion would be about Moore and how he could improve the offense, but I'm so relieved to find out that the same Dak arguments from 50 other threads made their way here. Yay!

Well, if anyone wants to talk offensive scheme, I live in the Boise area and I'm friends with a few people that played under Petersen and they always talk about how the pre-snap motion was a really big key to that offense. It did seem there were always one or two guys that were open.

I'm excited to see how well that will work in the pros, especially combined with a dominant run game that forces defenses to put extra guys in the box. Could put a lot of stress on D coordinators.

Also, be ready for at least one gadget play per game. The value of those plays is that if forces teams to use up practice time preparing to counter those plays. And, the more gadget plays you show, the more practice time that has to be used.

 

[Kevinicus]

Most of these thing go way back before Linehan...it's Garrett's offense.

As for the RPO...Prescott's obvious strengths in RPO scheme? They then mention his athleticism which leads me to believe the author doesn't quite know what RPO is.

 

[percyhoward]

Another tidbit if you like this info, is the 4th quarter trends where it looks like we didn't really bother to implement an offense until the 4th quarter. It was weird. We basically played conservative, predictable football for 3 quarters, then realized we were in a real game and actually started attacking.

That, and the fact that the offense was among the league's best (post-Cooper trade) from outside the red zone were both overlooked by the author of the article. Which is still full of good information.

 

[doomsday9084]

Yay! I read the article and was worried that the discussion would be about Moore and how he could improve the offense, but I'm so relieved to find out that the same Dak arguments from 50 other threads made their way here. Yay!

Well, if anyone wants to talk offensive scheme, I live in the Boise area and I'm friends with a few people that played under Petersen and they always talk about how the pre-snap motion was a really big key to that offense. It did seem there were always one or two guys that were open.

I'm excited to see how well that will work in the pros, especially combined with a dominant run game that forces defenses to put extra guys in the box. Could put a lot of stress on D coordinators.

Also, be ready for at least one gadget play per game. The value of those plays is that if forces teams to use up practice time preparing to counter those plays. And, the more gadget plays you show, the more practice time that has to be used.

I think the fundamental issue is that everyone agrees that Linehan was not particularly inventive and generally a poor OC. I think just about everyone agrees that the offense needs more motion in it, needs to disguise itself better and needs to get more inventive with pass routes. When everyone agrees about something, it doesn't get much discussion.

Dak bleeds into every thread because people really disagree about him and his play and salary affect everything.

 

[Stash]

Fans have been saying these exact same things for more than a year well into Daks second season and its embarrassing jerry didnt dump Linehan far sooner.

Even worse, after an abysmal 2017 season, Jones decided to give Linehan even MORE control and influence over the offense!

Didn't get along with Dez? Gone, replaced by a WHO?!?!?'s who of journeymen receiver by committee crap. With the expected results (awful).

Didn't get along with Dooley, Pollard, and several other assistant coaches, (see a pattern here?) and all of them are replaced. Which ushers in the round peg-square hole hiring of O-line coach Paul Alexander, ruining the best line in the league.

Has anyone else hired Linehan? No? Shocker there!

How about Paul Alexander? I hear him blathering on Sisius XM radio, but I know he's not coaching in the NFL any longer (in fact, he might actually be working in Europe?).

Tells you all you need to know when your coordinator and line coach can't even get jobs in the league anymore, doesn't it.

 

[Stash]

https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/...their-chances-of-reaching-super-bowl-liv/amp/

The first subtitle is where the info is.

Yes this is some of the stuff we already know but it’s May and interesting to get some numbers and data behind it. Gives us an idea of how Linehan has held Dak back.

“Far too many of the Cowboys' passing-down snaps last year involved them spreading the field with three receivers and a tight end, all of whom ran identical comeback routes to the sticks. It was predictable and incredibly easy for defenses to cover. Linehan's lack of creativity most often manifested itself in Prescott having to throw into tight coverage far too often. Last year, 17.7 percent of his passes were thrown into tight coverage, per NFL.com's NextGen Stats, a figure that ranked 29th out of 38 qualified quarterbacks. Prescott also threw short of the sticks by an average of 1.5 yards per pass, which ranked 28th out of the same group of 38 players.

The Cowboys also had Prescott throw just 11 passes on RPO (run-pass option) plays last season, per Sports Info Solutions, a figure that is frankly embarrassing given Prescott's obvious strength with RPO schemes. He averaged 9.5 yards per pass on those throws, which allow him to combine his skill at play-fakes, quickly reading defenses, and using his legs and athleticism to make plays on the perimeter if necessary. The Cowboys don't need to do this on every snap, but a considerable increase is certainly called for.

Prescott should also just be throwing after a play-action fake more often in general. Given the strength of the Cowboys' run game and opposing defenses' obvious inclination to stop Ezekiel Elliott, it should not be surprising that Prescott has been a far more efficient passer on play-action plays (where he is one of the best in the league) than on straight drop backs (where he is merely average) throughout his three-year career. Consider the following figures, per Pro Football Focus.

Prescott PA No PA
Comp 238 737
Att 349 1,178
Comp % 68.2% 62.6%
Yds 3,090 7,786
YPA 8.85 6.61
TD 19 48
INT 2 23
Rtg 111.6 87.2
% Passes 22.9% 77.1%

Again, the Cowboys don't need to be calling a play-action pass on every drop back, but 23 percent is far too low. They should be among the league leaders in play-action rate, up near teams like the Rams, who like the Cowboys base their entire offense around the versatile contributions of a star running back.”

More nuggets past this point like using more pre-snap motion (only used 36% of the time, tied for 24th in the league), but I’m not going to copy and past the whole article haha

 

[Fletch]

What does that tell you???? Linehan didn't trust Prescott's accuracy....and I don't blame him. How many times have we seen Dak miss wide open people?

Now your asking Dak to hit timing patterns down the field???? Good luck with that.

Everyone but you knows Linehan was an idiot, and a cast off from the Detroit Lions and Rams.

 

[percyhoward]

“It would be nice if "making sure defenses have to worry about defending more areas of the field" extended to allowing Prescott to throw deep more often -- or perhaps pressuring him into doing so, if the reason he hasn't been so far is due to his own reluctance rather than just the scheme.

Sounds like Jerry thinks it's due to Dak's own reluctance, at least in the first three quarters of a game:

"We love the way that he, I'm going to use the word 'logically' progresses through a game. You see that when the going gets tough or he's got to come from behind, he kind of turns it loose a little bit and makes plays."​

Game situation and field position weren't covered in the article you posted, but the quality of the offense's performance depended heavily on both in 2018. The Cowboys were much more aggressive -- and had much more success -- late in close games. Also, after the Cooper trade, Dallas was a Top 5 offense outside the red zone, but continued to be bottom 5 inside the red zone.

Game Situation
15+yd targets by quarter
(as a percentage of total attempts)
1st Dal 12.8% NFL 17.2%
2nd Dal 14.6% NFL 18.3%
3rd Dal 9.2% NFL 17.4%
4th/OT Dal 18.9% NFL 18.6%
Late & Close Dal 25.7% NFL 20.0%

points per drive (NFL rank)
1st qtr 1.77 (14th)
2nd qtr 1.67 (23rd)
3rd qtr 1.47 (22nd)
4th qtr 2.25 (6th)

Field Position (after wk 8)
% of drives ending in TD
drive ended in red zone
Dallas 54.5% (29th)
NFL avg 63.6%

drive ended outside red zone
Dallas 28.6% (2nd)
NFL avg 16.6%

When the last play of the drive was in the red zone, only three teams were worse than Dallas at scoring TD. When the last play was outside the red zone, only one team (Falcons) was better. The two previous years (same OC, QB, RB, but different WR, TE, OL)...

2016-17
% of drives ending in TD
drive ended in red zone
Dallas 64.3% (6th)
NFL avg 57.3%

drive ended outside red zone
Dallas 16.7% (15th)
NFL avg 16.2%

It will be interesting to find out how much of the conservative play in quarters 1-3 was due to the scheme and how much was Dak. The red zone will tell us more about how much of 2016-17's success depended on scheme and how much on personnel.

 

[Idgit]

That’s a sad tale. Consoling yourself? Not man enough to admit you were dead wrong about Garrett?

Shall I quote his boss Jerry jones for you?

So when the boss brings in a 29 year old first time qb coach to run the offense and tells Garrett to stay out of the way.........do u think that is a compliment to your hero Garrett? Lol

Do you think “the need for new ideas” means your hero is evolving with the times? Lol

And that lingering contract........such a show of confidence by the boss. Lol

No need to quote Jerry on the topic. I happen to have his most recent quote handy:

"It's obvious to the world that Jason, as [former Cowboys coach] Bill Parcells used to say, might have a place in the family portrait," Jones said, "Jason is outstanding today, relative to where he was when he joined as a coach, offensive coordinator, then became the head coach. On our dime so to speak ... Jason has become outstanding. ... We've won a lot of ballgames. Actually, I think he's the second winningest percentage coach in the history of the Dallas Cowboys.

My point is, I'm satisfied with where we are with his contract right now. It is to be negotiated at some point in the future. We all know that we need to get out here and win ballgames."

Woof-woof.

 

[CowboyRoy]

No need to quote Jerry on the topic. I happen to have his most recent quote handy:

"It's obvious to the world that Jason, as [former Cowboys coach] Bill Parcells used to say, might have a place in the family portrait," Jones said, "Jason is outstanding today, relative to where he was when he joined as a coach, offensive coordinator, then became the head coach. On our dime so to speak ... Jason has become outstanding. ... We've won a lot of ballgames. Actually, I think he's the second winningest percentage coach in the history of the Dallas Cowboys.

My point is, I'm satisfied with where we are with his contract right now. It is to be negotiated at some point in the future. We all know that we need to get out here and win ballgames."

Woof-woof.

LOL...…...No, thank you for pulling it up. Of course he will champion his coach, but he also insults him in the same breath. All but making the point of EVERY fan that thinks Garrett has been a joke here in Dallas.

relative to where he was when he joined as a coach, offensive coordinator, then became the head coach. On our dime so to speak ..

Translation: Garrett sucked when he got here. And we as fans, owner, players all suffered while he screwed up year after year bumbling his job.


"on our dime"...……LOL

What do you think that means exactly? It means a lot of wasted years genius.

But lets look at the current facts and what Jones REALLY thinks of Garrett:

-playing as a lame duck coach with no new contract
-Jones just kicked him to the curb AGAIN!!! with the offense and brought in a 29 year old greenhorn to fix the offense.

Once again where you see a compliment, its really a backhanded admission that Garrett has been screwing up here for a long time.

"we all know we need to win ballgames" LOL

Its means Garrett isnt doing a good enough job doing that.

Woof-woof, Jones slaps your hero down again.

 

[Idgit]

LOL...…...No, thank you for pulling it up. Of course he will champion his coach, but he also insults him in the same breath. All but making the point of EVERY fan that thinks Garrett has been a joke here in Dallas.

relative to where he was when he joined as a coach, offensive coordinator, then became the head coach. On our dime so to speak ..

Translation: Garrett sucked when he got here. And we as fans, owner, players all suffered while he screwed up year after year bumbling his job.


"on our dime"...……LOL

What do you think that means exactly? It means a lot of wasted years genius.

But lets look at the current facts and what Jones REALLY thinks of Garrett:

-playing as a lame duck coach with no new contract
-Jones just kicked him to the curb AGAIN!!! with the offense and brought in a 29 year old greenhorn to fix the offense.

Once again where you see a compliment, its really a backhanded admission that Garrett has been screwing up here for a long time.

"we all know we need to win ballgames" LOL

Its means Garrett isnt doing a good enough job doing that.

Woof-woof, Jones slaps your hero down again.

Bark, bark, bark, bark, bark. Lol.

 

[817Gill]

The fact this guy said one of Dak’s skills is ‘quickly reading defenses’ makes him lose all credibility.

You know there could be another reason for this dumbed-doen offense? Linehan was hamstrung by Dak. They basically spread everybody out to make it easy for Dak and even lined the WRs our farther wide.

Also, Dak hardly threw into tight coverages. He was incredibly late with the ball plenty of times. Another nonsensical claim, putting it all on Linehan.

Further, this is just nonsensical use of stats. Dallas nowhere near three as much as the Rams so comparing PERCENTAGES is just dumb. Also, Linehan used plenty of play action for Dak, in fact more than doubled in in Dak’s first year from Romo’s highest usage rate.

Further, people blaming Linehan clearly had no problems when Garrett was bottom of the league in play action usage when he was in control of the offense.

When Garrett was OC, everybody blamed Romo. Now they blame the OC, when the QB is mediocre.

Wow ok man I’m just not going to read past your first line lmao. The article references his skill in quickly reading defenses from the RPO/Spread/Playaction plays that Dak is so good at, because the nature of those plays by design force the defense to tip their hand quickly so the qb knows what he’s getting.

This was a huge reason for Dak’s success in 2016, as the team was an avid play action user, and allowed him to read the safety and LB quickly and make quick throws or runs depending on the situation. RPO’s make it super simple to diagnose a defense, they were a huge part of Wentz success his 2017 season.

It’s when Scott Linehan decided to try to traditionalize and conserve the offense that Dak was forced to read defenses in the most challenging way; when they already know what you’re doing.

How many times could fans call out the play by formation and personnel before the snap? In circumstances like that, it does become more difficult on a young QB to read and react.

But when used to his strengths, Dak is able to be a quick decision maker.

 

[khiladi]

Wow ok man I’m just not going to read past your first line lmao. The article references his skill in quickly reading defenses from the RPO/Spread/Playaction plays that Dak is so good at, because the nature of those plays by design force the defense to tip their hand quickly so the qb knows what he’s getting.

This was a huge reason for Dak’s success in 2016, as the team was an avid play action user, and allowed him to read the safety and LB quickly and make quick throws or runs depending on the situation. RPO’s make it super simple to diagnose a defense, they were a huge part of Wentz success his 2017 season.

It’s when Scott Linehan decided to try to traditionalize and conserve the offense that Dak was forced to read defenses in the most challenging way; when they already know what you’re doing.

How many times could fans call out the play by formation and personnel before the snap? In circumstances like that, it does become more difficult on a young QB to read and react.

But when used to his strengths, Dak is able to be a quick decision maker.

No, what actually happened is teams started doubling Beasley and dropping DL back, to take away the underneath, which is why he started struggling and continued to struggle. Linehan tried given Dak more responsibility in year 2, but he played awfully, particularly the Denver game, which made him dumb down the offense again.

The reality is you have to be able to grow in the NFL and running a heavy RPO offense isn’t going to cut it in the NFL where the defenders are fast. Also, Linehan went more spread and shotgun because that’s what Dak ran in college.

As even Percy quoted above, even Jerry admits it was in large part due to Dak’s own reluctance.

 

[Roadtrip635]

Sounds like Jerry thinks it's due to Dak's own reluctance, at least in the first three quarters of a game:

"We love the way that he, I'm going to use the word 'logically' progresses through a game. You see that when the going gets tough or he's got to come from behind, he kind of turns it loose a little bit and makes plays."​

Game situation and field position weren't covered in the article you posted, but the quality of the offense's performance depended heavily on both in 2018. The Cowboys were much more aggressive -- and had much more success -- late in close games. Also, after the Cooper trade, Dallas was a Top 5 offense outside the red zone, but continued to be bottom 5 inside the red zone.

Game Situation
15+yd targets by quarter
(as a percentage of total attempts)
1st Dal 12.8% NFL 17.2%
2nd Dal 14.6% NFL 18.3%
3rd Dal 9.2% NFL 17.4%
4th/OT Dal 18.9% NFL 18.6%
Late & Close Dal 25.7% NFL 20.0%

points per drive (NFL rank)
1st qtr 1.77 (14th)
2nd qtr 1.67 (23rd)
3rd qtr 1.47 (22nd)
4th qtr 2.25 (6th)

Field Position (after wk 8)
% of drives ending in TD
drive ended in red zone
Dallas 54.5% (29th)
NFL avg 63.6%

drive ended outside red zone
Dallas 28.6% (2nd)
NFL avg 16.6%

When the last play of the drive was in the red zone, only three teams were worse than Dallas at scoring TD. When the last play was outside the red zone, only one team (Falcons) was better. The two previous years (same OC, QB, RB, but different WR, TE, OL)...

2016-17
% of drives ending in TD
drive ended in red zone
Dallas 64.3% (6th)
NFL avg 57.3%

drive ended outside red zone
Dallas 16.7% (15th)
NFL avg 16.2%

It will be interesting to find out how much of the conservative play in quarters 1-3 was due to the scheme and how much was Dak. The red zone will tell us more about how much of 2016-17's success depended on scheme and how much on personnel.

I think the conservative nature is on both, a conservative coach and a conservative QB leads to a more conservative approach. I think it would benefit Dak more to be less conservative but he also needs a coach/scheme to unlock that ability. A QB like Romo needed a conservative coach to reign in some of his gunslinger ways, but Dak needs a coach more willing to open up and find ways to do it. There's other factors involved too, like how faith do you have in your defense?

 

[817Gill]

No, what actually happened is teams started doubling Beasley and dropping DL back, to take away the underneath, which is why he started struggling and continued to struggle. Linehan tried given Dak more responsibility in year 2, but he played awfully, particularly the Denver game, which made him dumb down the offense again.

The reality is you have to be able to grow in the NFL and running a heavy RPO offense isn’t going to cut it in the NFL where the defenders are fast. Also, Linehan went more spread and shotgun because that’s what Dak ran in college.

As even Percy quoted above, even Jerry admits it was in large part due to Dak’s own reluctance.

Dude what are you saying. You had an issue with the article saying one of Daks strength was reading the defense quickly. I am simply informing you that you’re taking that phrase outs of context. The whole article was about how the offense could improve with Moore if he addressed the fundamental issues that were present under Linehan.

The segment relating to a lack of RPO and play action passing emphasized how Dak should be used in these ways more often because he’s been his best when doing so (statistics backed).

The nature of play action and RPO style plays allow the quarterback to get a quick read on the DE, S, LB and are in a position to make a quick decision. This is the context that the author illustrated Dak’s quick reading of the defense. NOT in the the traditional drop back way.

Also, can people stop using that freakin Denver game week 2 of his sophomore year as a tell-all of his game?

It was literally the only bad game he had the first half of the season, and by the way, the whole team had a bad game. Everyone was flat, it wasn’t like the team was playing great and Dak was holding us back. It was a bad game as a team and after that Dak had the gutsy Cardinals game and then three straight 3 passing td games. Just a bad game for a young Qb and team not some pivot in schematics. In fact, there’s NEVER a pivot in schematics, let alone a change after the Broncos game. And oh my god man do you watch this team? Dak is at his best in the spread, Linehan never only used it in the final 2 minutes and 4th quarter. Witten has said this multiple times. We all say this all the time on game threads.

And LMAOO the Eagles won a SB running RPO are you ok? The Rams run an offense heavily predicated on play action and RPO. Do you even know what an RPO is? If you think it’s read option QB running stuff then you’re confused, and mistaken.

The stats on the article show you how good Dak is on RPO and how little Linehan used them, what a smart guy he was.

You were off base a lot there man

 

[CowboyRoy]

Only that Garrett was trying to let Linehan find another job at Senior Bowl week, which is a pretty normal thing to do.

So what do you think of the fact that Jones brought in a 29 year old, one year QB coach to fix the offense? And was quoted as saying that his new ideas need to be implemented and to " let me know if they are not"?

Do you think this is a boost of confidence in the abilities of you hero Garrett?

Anyone with common sense would see this as message by Jones that he is fed up with Garrett and his boring, predictable, lack of innovation offense.

Its all but admitting publicly that Garrett has completely out lived his usefulness in regards to running the offense.

But at least we wasted many years of Garrett "on our dime" so to speak as Jones put it.

 

[CyberB0b]

Fans have been saying these exact same things for more than a year well into Daks second season and its embarrassing jerry didnt dump Linehan far sooner.

Predictability has been a staple of the Garrett offense since 2008.

 

[CowboyRoy]

I think the conservative nature is on both, a conservative coach and a conservative QB leads to a more conservative approach. I think it would benefit Dak more to be less conservative but he also needs a coach/scheme to unlock that ability. A QB like Romo needed a conservative coach to reign in some of his gunslinger ways, but Dak needs a coach more willing to open up and find ways to do it. There's other factors involved too, like how faith do you have in your defense?

The fact that Dak has been "conservative" as you put it has been a huge factor in the fact that the Cowboys have been so successful under his leadership. Not throwing the game losing pick is every bit as important as throwing the winning TD pass.

Which according to the facts...…………….Dak has lead his team to more late victories then anyone in the NFL since he has been here.

But certainly Dak could benefit from a more wide open, spread offense. Which its obvious to me, that he thrives in. He seems to blossom in the hurry up, spread formations where he is in full command. Not sure why the blunt minded Garrett fails to see this obvious trait.

 

[Haimerej]

Took a 65 pound Chinook on a 10 wt. Fly rod this year. Took an hour to land it. Wore my butt out. I was using scientific anglers fly line.

Of course.