Is Dak an elite Top 5 Quarterback?

Yobwocs said:
This is an argument..... just sayin'. He's disspelling some narratives today. Becoming the all time Cowboys passing leader and getting the win against a team considered the best in the NFL by lots of people. What a time to break the all time record.

And the idea that he can't come from behind. I know just one game doesn't erase a career, but it's a good start of things heading in the right direction.

He's the only one .500 or below that is getting a heap of praise. Mahomes, Allen, Maye, Stafford,.... and maybe Jackson are all above .500.... he's gonna get a mountain of praise by the media this week. Better get your curls ready.... it's happening whether you like it or not.
Click to expand...
He has grown into a top five.
 
Dorsett33 said:
You still need a QB to get them the ball. And...he's done well with less. If he was such a bad QB that some of you think, it wouldn't matter what receivers you threw out there...right?
Click to expand...
Never said he was bad. And the last 2 games he's come through. That's not been typical in his career. He's never been one of the QBs that giving him the ball last would likely cost you the game. Hopefully something has changed, and for the better.
 
RonnieT24 said:
Good and bad is fair game.. however false is not cool no matter which direction it leans. Dak should have eaten the ball instead trying to get it off with that blitzer closing in on him against the Chiefs. He should have led CeeDee to the corner of the end zone on the pick against the Eagles. Like all QBs he makes some bad decisions, gets fooled by the coverage or just doesn't place the ball where it needs to be. But he just hung 675 yards and 4 TDs while completing > 65% of his passes against two Super Bowl defenses. The Eagles defense held the great Caleb Williams to 47.4% completion rate and 154 yards. As opposed to Dak's 354 yards and 63.%. The Chiefs held Daniel Jones to 181 yards on 19 for 31 (61%) passing. Then got strafed for 320 and 27 of 39 (69.2 %) . The Packers are #4 in the NFL in yards and points.. Yet Dak and the Cowboys offense hung 319 passing yards and 38 points on them. It's like these defenses magically forget how to play when Dak shows up. Dak and his mates are messing up the rankings for all them!
Click to expand...
IMO, and I think with most people, those guys aren't elite. Most people don't think Purdy is elite and he's had far more success. But you think Dak isn't elite and you're a hater.
 
Yobwocs said:
This is an argument..... just sayin'. He's disspelling some narratives today. Becoming the all time Cowboys passing leader and getting the win against a team considered the best in the NFL by lots of people. What a time to break the all time record.

And the idea that he can't come from behind. I know just one game doesn't erase a career, but it's a good start of things heading in the right direction.

He's the only one .500 or below that is getting a heap of praise. Mahomes, Allen, Maye, Stafford,.... and maybe Jackson are all above .500.... he's gonna get a mountain of praise by the media this week. Better get your curls ready.... it's happening whether you like it or not.
Click to expand...
I think Dak is good enough to win B+/A- QB who can be very productive with the right weapons. He has that right now and should be producing among the top 5. All things being equal there are several QBs I would take first, but i also think we are fortunate to have him.
 
Relayer said:
IMO, and I think with most people, those guys aren't elite. Most people don't think Purdy is elite and he's had far more success. But you think Dak isn't elite and you're a hater.
Click to expand...
That is only from one troll.
 
G7GCxCzWgAAHvoT
 
Relayer said:
IMO, and I think with most people, those guys aren't elite. Most people don't think Purdy is elite and he's had far more success. But you think Dak isn't elite and you're a hater.
Click to expand...
The problem with "Elite" is there isnt a set line for it... Elite compared to whom? Mahomes is Elite and in saying that im gonna say there are no other Elite QB's in the league right now because non are as good or better... most people go with who they like "So and so is elite but so and so is not" and to me it brings no real meaning because its all subjective...
 
CowboyFrog said:
The problem with "Elite" is there isnt a set line for it... Elite compared to whom? Mahomes is Elite and in saying that im gonna say there are no other Elite QB's in the league right now because non are as good or better... most people go with who they like "So and so is elite but so and so is not" and to me it brings no real meaning because its all subjective...
Click to expand...
My definition of elite has never changed.. It is being in the 90th percentile at what you do. So in the NFL if there are 64 QBs (starters and backups) then a guy has to be in the top 6 for me to consider him elite with a stretch to 7 if someone is close. In most years Dak hovers just outside that line of demarcation IMHO. In 2023 and most of this season he has been firmly INSIDE that line.. again IMHO. But not JUST MHO. The numbers bear it out. Top 5 in TDs, completions, attempts, yards, completion percentage, 4th quarter comebacks, game winning drives. Here are some other interesting numbers that say Dak is elite. He is #1 in bad throw percentage. Not top 5, not top 2 or 3... Numero UNO! He is also number 1 in yards and in QBR. He is #1 in the NFL against blitz pressure. This is high level QB play no matter how you slice it. People can argue whether he has the arm talent of a Mahomes, Stafford, Rodgers or whoever you choose.. but they cannot argue the results on the field. He puts the ball where it needs to be and he helps his team win games as long as the defense at least manages to show up. Oh and a certain wide receiver doesn't forget how to catch when seeing green jerseys. Will it translate into playoff wins? Who knows!?! But I don't see how anyone could watch Dak operate this offense this season and not feel good about our chances.. again providing the defense gets off the bus.

There will not be any defense in the playoffs better than the Packers, Eagles and Chiefs.. and Dak has done just fine against all three to the tune of 20, 38, 24 and 31 points. And there is no denying that the 20 and 24 against the Eagles would easily be 27 and 31 if CeeDee catches the ball. Meaning the Cowboys offense, with Dak at the helm would have averaged over 30 ppg against three of the best defenses in the league. I feel like that's one thing that we can point to as different about THIS version of the Cowboys offense. Their ability to strafe even elite defenses. I feel like in years past they would struggle against better defenses. This year they really only struggled with Denver.. but that's at Denver in that thin air which has been a house of horrors for us for decades. As long as we don't have to go to Denver I feel good about our playoff prospects against anybody.
 
RonnieT24 said:
My definition of elite has never changed.. It is being in the 90th percentile at what you do. So in the NFL if there are 64 QBs (starters and backups) then a guy has to be in the top 6 for me to consider him elite with a stretch to 7 if someone is close. In most years Dak hovers just outside that line of demarcation IMHO. In 2023 and most of this season he has been firmly INSIDE that line.. again IMHO. But not JUST MHO. The numbers bear it out. Top 5 in TDs, completions, attempts, yards, completion percentage, 4th quarter comebacks, game winning drives. Here are some other interesting numbers that say Dak is elite. He is #1 in bad throw percentage. Not top 5, not top 2 or 3... Numero UNO! He is also number 1 in yards and in QBR. He is #1 in the NFL against blitz pressure. This is high level QB play no matter how you slice it. People can argue whether he has the arm talent of a Mahomes, Stafford, Rodgers or whoever you choose.. but they cannot argue the results on the field. He puts the ball where it needs to be and he helps his team win games as long as the defense at least manages to show up. Oh and a certain wide receiver doesn't forget how to catch when seeing green jerseys. Will it translate into playoff wins? Who knows!?! But I don't see how anyone could watch Dak operate this offense this season and not feel good about our chances.. again providing the defense gets off the bus.

There will not be any defense in the playoffs better than the Packers, Eagles and Chiefs.. and Dak has done just fine against all three to the tune of 20, 38, 24 and 31 points. And there is no denying that the 20 and 24 against the Eagles would easily be 27 and 31 if CeeDee catches the ball. Meaning the Cowboys offense, with Dak at the helm would have averaged over 30 ppg against three of the best defenses in the league. I feel like that's one thing that we can point to as different about THIS version of the Cowboys offense. Their ability to strafe even elite defenses. I feel like in years past they would struggle against better defenses. This year they really only struggled with Denver.. but that's at Denver in that thin air which has been a house of horrors for us for decades. As long as we don't have to go to Denver I feel good about our playoff prospects against anybody.
Click to expand...
I would rethink that to 32 players and you need to be in the top 3 or 4 to be an elite QB. Backup QB's who rarely play should not be considered.

You could even argue the bottom 3rd of starting QB's are not even any good.
 
RonnieT24 said:
My definition of elite has never changed.. It is being in the 90th percentile at what you do. So in the NFL if there are 64 QBs (starters and backups) then a guy has to be in the top 6 for me to consider him elite with a stretch to 7 if someone is close. In most years Dak hovers just outside that line of demarcation IMHO. In 2023 and most of this season he has been firmly INSIDE that line.. again IMHO. But not JUST MHO. The numbers bear it out. Top 5 in TDs, completions, attempts, yards, completion percentage, 4th quarter comebacks, game winning drives. Here are some other interesting numbers that say Dak is elite. He is #1 in bad throw percentage. Not top 5, not top 2 or 3... Numero UNO! He is also number 1 in yards and in QBR. He is #1 in the NFL against blitz pressure. This is high level QB play no matter how you slice it. People can argue whether he has the arm talent of a Mahomes, Stafford, Rodgers or whoever you choose.. but they cannot argue the results on the field. He puts the ball where it needs to be and he helps his team win games as long as the defense at least manages to show up. Oh and a certain wide receiver doesn't forget how to catch when seeing green jerseys. Will it translate into playoff wins? Who knows!?! But I don't see how anyone could watch Dak operate this offense this season and not feel good about our chances.. again providing the defense gets off the bus.

There will not be any defense in the playoffs better than the Packers, Eagles and Chiefs.. and Dak has done just fine against all three to the tune of 20, 38, 24 and 31 points. And there is no denying that the 20 and 24 against the Eagles would easily be 27 and 31 if CeeDee catches the ball. Meaning the Cowboys offense, with Dak at the helm would have averaged over 30 ppg against three of the best defenses in the league. I feel like that's one thing that we can point to as different about THIS version of the Cowboys offense. Their ability to strafe even elite defenses. I feel like in years past they would struggle against better defenses. This year they really only struggled with Denver.. but that's at Denver in that thin air which has been a house of horrors for us for decades. As long as we don't have to go to Denver I feel good about our playoff prospects against anybody.
Click to expand...
I agree, and really because thats your definition of elite it cant be argued. I know we as posters here go at this argument alot and thats why i said because there is no real line for "Elite" going at anyones idea of it is kinda a waste of time.. its just an opinion and everyone has one so why not just say "Ok i see your point" and tell yours..to me Elite would be the best of the best and right now thats Mahomes to me.. thats not a knock on Dak as i think he is playing outstanding.
 
CowboyFrog said:
I agree, and really because thats your definition of elite it cant be argued. I know we as posters here go at this argument alot and thats why i said because there is no real line for "Elite" going at anyones idea of it is kinda a waste of time.. its just an opinion and everyone has one so why not just say "Ok i see your point" and tell yours..to me Elite would be the best of the best and right now thats Mahomes to me.. thats not a knock on Dak as i think he is playing outstanding.
Click to expand...
What separates good QB's from elite QB's, is their supporting cast.
 
RonnieT24 said:
My definition of elite has never changed.. It is being in the 90th percentile at what you do. So in the NFL if there are 64 QBs (starters and backups) then a guy has to be in the top 6 for me to consider him elite with a stretch to 7 if someone is close. In most years Dak hovers just outside that line of demarcation IMHO. In 2023 and most of this season he has been firmly INSIDE that line.. again IMHO. But not JUST MHO. The numbers bear it out. Top 5 in TDs, completions, attempts, yards, completion percentage, 4th quarter comebacks, game winning drives. Here are some other interesting numbers that say Dak is elite. He is #1 in bad throw percentage. Not top 5, not top 2 or 3... Numero UNO! He is also number 1 in yards and in QBR. He is #1 in the NFL against blitz pressure. This is high level QB play no matter how you slice it. People can argue whether he has the arm talent of a Mahomes, Stafford, Rodgers or whoever you choose.. but they cannot argue the results on the field. He puts the ball where it needs to be and he helps his team win games as long as the defense at least manages to show up. Oh and a certain wide receiver doesn't forget how to catch when seeing green jerseys. Will it translate into playoff wins? Who knows!?! But I don't see how anyone could watch Dak operate this offense this season and not feel good about our chances.. again providing the defense gets off the bus.

There will not be any defense in the playoffs better than the Packers, Eagles and Chiefs.. and Dak has done just fine against all three to the tune of 20, 38, 24 and 31 points. And there is no denying that the 20 and 24 against the Eagles would easily be 27 and 31 if CeeDee catches the ball. Meaning the Cowboys offense, with Dak at the helm would have averaged over 30 ppg against three of the best defenses in the league. I feel like that's one thing that we can point to as different about THIS version of the Cowboys offense. Their ability to strafe even elite defenses. I feel like in years past they would struggle against better defenses. This year they really only struggled with Denver.. but that's at Denver in that thin air which has been a house of horrors for us for decades. As long as we don't have to go to Denver I feel good about our playoff prospects against anybody.
Click to expand...
Until Dak doesn't crap his knickers in a divisional round playoff game, nothing has changed. He's awful in the playoffs.

Change that, and the narrative can change. Until then, they're just regular season wins in a 6-5-1 season.
 
Chasing6 said:
What separates good QB's from elite QB's, is their supporting cast.
Click to expand...
for some for sure i can see past that and again my rank of elite is not the final.. to me its what can that QB do at a level that is best or at the top in all aspects of it, and to me Mahomes is the most complete QB right now.. but again thats my opinion and its certainly not the end of any conversation on it.
 
Chasing6 said:
I would rethink that to 32 players and you need to be in the top 3 or 4 to be an elite QB. Backup QB's who rarely play should not be considered.

You could even argue the bottom 3rd of starting QB's are not even any good.
Click to expand...
But backups DO play. Hell isn't Cleveland on like their 4th QB this season. The Jets have started two guys, so have the Steelers. The Giants have started three. The Bucs, Vikings, Niners and Cardinals have all started two. There are 42 QBs who have attempted at least 108 passes this season and that doesn't include Joe Burrow who has only attempted 82 or Sanders w ho barring something really weird is going to start 5 more games in Cleveland. There are 40 guys who have started at least 5 games. So no I am NOT going to restrict it to just the 32 opening day starters. Cause that's simply not the real world. But even if I did.. I would have to do some mental gymnastics to declare that there are 4 or 5 QBs playing at a higher level than the guy leading all the categories that Dak is. Frankly there is one (Stafford) maybe two (Maye). If those two continue to play at the level they are then one of them will win the MVP. But Maye is about experience the New England winter.. Some of that blizzard weather with 25 mph winds at game time is going to have a profound effect on his passing efficiency.
 
CowboyFrog said:
for some for sure i can see past that and again my rank of elite is not the final.. to me its what can that QB do at a level that is best or at the top in all aspects of it, and to me Mahomes is the most complete QB right now.. but again thats my opinion and its certainly not the end of any conversation on it.
Click to expand...
6-6 Mahomes with his 6 wins totaling 60 points given up by the defense. That Mahomes???
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Staff online

Members online

... and 211 more.
Total: 3,040 (members: 311, guests: 2,729)
Robots: 1,480

Latest posts

Forum statistics

Threads
470,428
Messages
14,254,622
Members
23,845
Latest member
griffdog13
Back
Top