Is Garrett the problem with character issue players?

Dre11

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I actually like a lot of the content that X posts here. He goes off the reservation once in a while (this OP is the perfect example) but he brings some good stuff to the forum. I don't dislike him by any definition. This post, however, happens to be a dud. It happens. He's all good in my eyes.

I don't know, it's been one crazy theory after another recently
 

skinsscalper

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I don't know, it's been one crazy theory after another recently
Meh, he's hit and miss sometimes, but he's rarely hateful and he does bring some decent content. They're not all gems, mind you, but I find his perspective valuable at times. Again, he's all good with me.
 

DasTex

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What does that mean?
There isn't one player on that list that I would have rather kept on the team or that was like a Haley and pushed them over the top. You gave a list of a bunch of players that left or got pushed out the door that really didnt amount to much.

I didn't think it was that hard of a response to understand?
 

xwalker

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If your list featured guys that left Dallas and were productive with another coach...you might have a point. As it is all you have going here is flattulence.
Was Charles Haley going to be successful if he didn't come to the Cowboys? The reports were that the 49ers traded him to Dallas because he urinated on a teammates car. Cowboys players now say that he had urinated and deficated inside a teammates car and had threatened to kill the head coach.

Most of those players demonstrated the ability to play but became entitled while they were with the Cowboys and they went off the deep end.

Hardy was the main one that arrived as a veteran. He played well in his one season. The defensive coaches wanted him to return but Garrett stood on his head to make certain Hardy did not return. The Pats were interested in Hardy but he didn't want to take a low end prove it contract.
 
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xwalker

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There isn't one player on that list that I would have rather kept on the team or that was like a Haley and pushed them over the top. You gave a list of a bunch of players that left or got pushed out the door that really didnt amount to much.

I didn't think it was that hard of a response to understand?
Haley would just be a guy that just pushed out in SF in didn't do much afterwards if Jimmy didn't resurrect his career.

If a player "pushed them over the top" why would I have him on the list?

Almost all of those players had shown the ability to be good players but all went off the deep end once they were coddled too much.
 
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Dre11

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Was Charles Haley going to be successful if he didn't come to the Cowboys? The reports were that the 49ers traded him to Dallas because he urinated on a teammates car. Cowboys players now say that he had urinated and deficated inside a teammates car and had threatened to kill the head coach.

Most of those players demonstrated the ability to play but became entitled while they were with the Cowboys and they went off the deep end.

Hardy was the main one that arrived as a veteran. He played well in his one season. The defensive coaches wanted him to return but Garrett stood on his head to make certain Hardy did not return. The Pats were interested in Hardy but he didn't want to take a low end prove it contract.

And players said in Dallas he did the same crazy shyt here.
 

Diehardblues

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It’s not unusual for talented players to be un-coachable. It’s usually more about the player than the situation. Some guys just can’t make the transition to the NFL and why there’s so many Bust in the league.

And some just fizzle our early even if they are successful at first. It’s easier to shine in College without as much competition nor as much Elite talent.

But the NFL is the best of the best from College. Some guys simply don’t shine as bright in NFL without having more talent around them while going up against lesser talent like in most games in College.

They can’t just cruise thru on talent alone. They must work hard and study film. More than just showing up being one of the studs on the team like in College.
 

xwalker

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Charles Haley was already a HOF level player and he's worn out his welcome at his previous team, also, Jimmy never kept Haley "in check", He tolerated his bull**** for the sake of winning.

Tony Casillas was never a character issue (you know, character being the entire premise of your post)

I'll ask again the question that you seem to want to dodge because any answer you give would make your entire OP look like the steaming turd that it is:

What NFL coach took on any of these POS players and turned them into something?

I'm no Garrett apologist by ANY stretch of the word (I've wanted him gone for years), but blaming Garrett for not polishing a pile of turds into a satchel full of diamonds is beyond the definition of stupid.
Greg Hardy had was a Pro Bowl and All Pro player as well as Franchise Tag player before coming to Dallas.

Are you saying that Jimmy could not have gotten 2 or 3 years of good production from Hardy?

Nate hangs around the Cowboys and says Hardy was not remotely close to as crazy or difficult as Haley.

Ratliff was a 4x Pro Bowl player and All Pro but he went off the reservation with Garrett as the HC.
Tell me HOW its not remotely similar.

They were both wanted the a job. They both agreed to a job.
They both had a "contract" to finish do the job and they failed.

Just because one played football and the other was a common person doesn't change the circumstances.

I'll wait.

I can't explain it on a 1st grade level.

If you think hiring a guy to mow the lawn that needs money to get his electricity turned on is remotely related to NFL personnel issues then you can just keep believing that.

I can't turn poop into gold.

I can't turn you into a smart person.
 
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skinsscalper

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Greg Hardy had was a Pro Bowl and All Pro player as well as Franchise Tag player before coming to Dallas.

Are you saying that Jimmy could not have gotten 2 or 3 years of good production from Hardy?

Nate hangs around the Cowboys and says Hardy was not remotely close to as crazy or difficult as Haley.

Ratliff was a 4x Pro Bowl player and All Pro but he went off the reservation with Garrett as the HC.

And, predictably, you've again avoided the question. Who turned ANY of these guys into anything once Garrett booted their *** out the door?

The whole premise of this thread is a turd, X. Do yourself a favor: quit bumping it with non-sensical rebuttals and let if drop off the front page. Maybe everyone will forget that you even posted this idiotic stream of thought.
 

LatinMind

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Garrett can't seem to handle any mental make-up issue type players.

Jimmy got to Super Bowls by handing Charles Haley.

Taco
  • Taco failed because he was or became uncoachable.
  • He did NOT fail due to a lack of physical ability.
  • Dorance Armstrong does not have more physical ability than Taco.
Was it the Pick of Taco that Failed or did Garrett fail to make Taco accountable?

Has Garrett handled any character issues players?
- They kept Dez happy by force feeding him the ball.
- Zeke has only been in limited trouble.


Garrett as Head Coach:
Taco
Greg Hardy
Josh Brent
David Irving
Dez (eventually)
Rolando McClain
Jay Ratliff
Ahmad Dixon
Joseph Randle
Rico

Others that had issues:
Beasley - Complained on twitter while he was here.
Ryan Switzer - Openly complained to the media.
T.Williams - The 2018 move to IR seemed to be more of a flake out and an long term injury.
Kyle Orton - Faked injury or illness to get cut (I forget the details).

Garrett as the OC, not HC:
TO
Patrick Crayton
MartyB

Johnson didnt handle Haley, he just didnt make a deal with anythiung he did because he was a star player. Johnson let the stars get away with alot. They had a coke house right outside valley ranch.

Difference from then to now there was no internet reports like now. If a player farts in the lockeroom there are sources to tell reporters what it smelled like.
 

xwalker

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And, predictably, you've again avoided the question. Who turned ANY of these guys into anything once Garrett booted their *** out the door?

The whole premise of this thread is a turd, X. Do yourself a favor: quit bumping it with non-sensical rebuttals and let if drop off the front page. Maybe everyone will forget that you even posted this idiotic stream of thought.
I'm not worried about it. There is a read between the lines concept in the thread that some people understand and are laughing their arses off about and the joke is not on Garrett, it on the replies that I'm getting.

I recommend that you move on because if you eventually understand the true meaning of the thread you will not want to look back and realize that you didn't get it originally.

Just look at the specific people that are attempting to rebuke thread. You've probably never wanted to be associated with them.
 

xwalker

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Johnson didnt handle Haley, he just didnt make a deal with anythiung he did because he was a star player. Johnson let the stars get away with alot. They had a coke house right outside valley ranch.

Difference from then to now there was no internet reports like now. If a player farts in the lockeroom there are sources to tell reporters what it smelled like.
What do handle mean?

Jimmy & Haley were together for 2 Super Bowl wins...
 
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Pass2Run

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Garrett can't seem to handle any mental make-up issue type players.

Jimmy got to Super Bowls by handing Charles Haley.

Taco
  • Taco failed because he was or became uncoachable.
  • He did NOT fail due to a lack of physical ability.
  • Dorance Armstrong does not have more physical ability than Taco.
Was it the Pick of Taco that Failed or did Garrett fail to make Taco accountable?

Has Garrett handled any character issues players?
- They kept Dez happy by force feeding him the ball.
- Zeke has only been in limited trouble.


Garrett as Head Coach:
Taco
Greg Hardy
Josh Brent
David Irving
Dez (eventually)
Rolando McClain
Jay Ratliff
Ahmad Dixon
Joseph Randle
Rico

Others that had issues:
Beasley - Complained on twitter while he was here.
Ryan Switzer - Openly complained to the media.
T.Williams - The 2018 move to IR seemed to be more of a flake out and an long term injury.
Kyle Orton - Faked injury or illness to get cut (I forget the details).

Garrett as the OC, not HC:
TO
Patrick Crayton
MartyB

On the surface, it seems like you might be trolling.

But dig deeper, and you see there are guys out there who have success using interpersonal communication and coaching techniques, psychology, anthropology to get through to these kinds of guys.

You know what makes Belicheck so great?

He's an anthropologist. He also knows the league overlooks certain types of receivers, because they favor a certain stereotype of receiver.

But, he also knows how to approach certain types of players from a communicative standpoint to get the results he wants.

The Patriots also hire teams of anthropologists to scout other teams and players, which gives them a huge edge.

We need a guy with a mind like that who is too busy thinking to clap.

In other words, you are on to something. This is one of the primary jobs of the head coach. And Garrett fails pretty big when it comes to turning these types of guys around.

In fact, we should just avoid them all together,which isn't that bad a strategy...But even the Patriots take their chances, as we saw this year with AB.
 

xwalker

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On the surface, it seems like you might be trolling.

But dig deeper, and you see there are guys out there who have success using interpersonal communication and coaching techniques, psychology, anthropology to get through to these guys.

You know what makes Belicheck so great?

He's an anthropologist. He also knows the league overlooks certain types of receivers, because they favor a certain stereotype of receiver.

But, he also knows how to approach certain types of players from a communicative standpoint to get the results he wants.

The Patriots also hire teams of anthropologists to scout other teams and players, which gives them a huge edge.

We need a guy with a mind like that who is too busy thinking to clap.

In other words, you are on to something. This is one of the primary jobs of the head coach. And Garrett fails pretty big when it comes to turning these types of guys around.

In fact, we should just avoid them all together,which isn't that bad a strategy...But even the Patriots take their chances, as we saw this year with AB.
Excellent post.

I'm not advocating for a team full of character issue players but it's a disadvantage when the HC can't handle any of those types of players.
 

JoeKing

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Yes, Garrett has not been good at dealing with difficult personality type players.
Everyone has an opinion about that I suppose. Some think the difficult personality types should get different treatment while others say there is one standard for everyone with what's expected from them. I even heard Jimmy Johnson once say something to the effect that not everyone gets treated the same but they all got treated fair. I don't hear complaints out of the Cowboys locker room about Garrett. He seems to have their respect. The complaints come from malcontents like Dez Bryant and Taco Charlton. They were nothing but cancers so Garrett cut it out.
 

xwalker

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Jimmy and Irvin were together for 3 and he was a coke head along with half of the team.
What difference does that make?

George Patton was an arse-h but he kicked the S out of the ***** and we won the war.

Irvin NEVER tested positive for drugs.

They won Super Bowls.

If they win I don't care what they do as long as they don't get caught.
 
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