JFK Assassination...Your Honest Thoughts

[Hostile]

I read one time that 73% of people believe there was a plot to kill President Kennedy and then a cover up by the Warren Commission. It makes me wonder what people think now.

So, do you think Oswald acted alone? It is clear Oswald was involved, and especially in the killing of Officer Tippitt.

Do you think there was a "Badgeman" shooter on the grassy knoll? If so who do you think it was? Many names have been mentioned over the years.

If you do believe in the grassy knoll theories what is it that persuades you to believe them?

Do you know anyone who was alive then who was at Dealey Plaza, and what do they think?

Have you met anyone who at one time or another was linked to the plot theories?

 

[notherbob]

I was in Downtown Dallas and saw the motorcade pass while I was standing next to the street on Main or Elm, whichever one the parade was on and I saw that JFK had a somewhat annoyed look on his face and Connoly had more of a concerned, serious look while Jackie seemed to have a contrived pose kind of look.

I was on my lunch break and had to walk back the 10 -12 blocks to my office so I did not stick around but retraced my route back briskly. somewhere past the Republic National Bank I was crossing a street when I heard the three shots and their weaker echos from off the buildings but I assumed the sounds were from a car backfiring and a minute or two later I saw two cars filled with large burly men in dark suits speeding the wrong way up one way Akard street and turning toward Dealy Plaza in front of the big fancy Fairmont Hotel at Ross (I think) and Akard.

A couple of minutes later I arrived back at my office and had some time to spare so I went up to the lunch room to get a sandwich wnd someone burst into the room and yelled "They shot the president!" I immediately thought "they" were some right wing wackos that Dallas was filled with at the time. Turned out my guess was wrong.

In that same lunchroom a week or so earlier when it was announced JFK was coming to visit Dallas and the motorcade route published in newspapers, I had a bad feeling about it and thought it was a bad idea and said so to my co-workers. John Birchers in Dallas hated him and I was surprised that he would come to Dallas, after all, Adlai Stevenson was spit on and hit with a sign and General Walker was shot at and there were some other signs of political unrest locally.

Nobody got anything done the rest of the day and they let us go home early. As I waited for my bus I bought two copies of the extra edition of the Dallas Times Herald for souveniers. years later sold one for $250 and still have the other.

Yes, I believe there was a conspiracy and a coverup and I wonder if Ruby had anything to do with it but the Warren Commission effectively covered up anything suspicious and I find it intriguing that so many people close to the situation died under questionable circumstances with a very few years after the assination. It wouldn't surprise me one bit if it were discovered that the CIA was involved (Kennedy was opposed to getting more deeply involved in Viet Nam and was reportedly wanting to pull out all the advisors and wash his hands of the whole affair at a time when the military industrial complex seemingly wanted a war to get richer, but we'll never know for sure.)

I believe Oswald acted alone though he may have somehow been influenced. At one time I had lived in the same Oak Cliff neighborhood where he and Marina lived but at a different time - it was an older lower middle class low rent white blue collar neighborhood popular with newly marrieds. After ny first wife left me for more glamorous settings I shifted gears and moved over to the Gaston avenue luxury apartment area (Sin Alley) for upwardly mobile white collar fun-loving party types. Life was good in spite of the divorce.

Remembering all those things really takes me back to my wild and crazy young adulthood. The Cowboys played on Sunday anyway but lost as I recall.

 

[WDN]

I believe it was a coverup.

BTW, if you haven't gone to the museum then go. Its nice bit its also very emotional.

 

[theogt]

No conspiracy.

 

[Rynie]

It was Orlando Scandrick.

 

[HoleInTheRoof]

Definite coverup. No doubt in my mind.

 

[Chocolate Lab]

This should be a good thread. I hope some of the guys who were around back then, like notherbob, will post their thoughts on it.

It's been quite a while so I don't remember all the details, but I once read about a high-ranking Hungarian or other Eastern Bloc official who claims that Oswald was trained by the Soviets and set up to do this. IIRC the guy said RO wasn't ordered to do this, but the Russians didn't order him not to, either, so they didn't expect it to happen. But RO went ahead with it and was successful. He claimed that our government figured all this out, and thus the coverup -- they were afraid if word got out it would lead to WWIII.

That may all be complete bunkum, but it would explain all the weird coincidences and contradictions in the story, and would be a plausible explanation for why the goverment hushed it up. After all, almost anything is worth it if it avoids getting nukes involved. But the idea that the CIA and military-industrial complex did it just to make more money is too far out there for me.

Then again, my dad was working in Ft. Worth at the time, and he thinks Oswald acted alone. He's big into guns and hunting like some of you guys, and he insists that the shot Oswald made that is sometimes claimed to be impossible by the "crossfire" people wouldn't be a hard shot at all for someone trained as a marksman, or even for your average hunter who is a good shot.

 

[Concord]

There was a second gunman in the grassy knoll...when Kennedy's head explodes it from a hit from the front...not the back.

Don't know who it was but he was there.

 

[burmafrd]

Oswald was not a good shot. He barely qualified. No one was able to show that he had done any serious practice before that day. The weapon used is clunky and not particularly good. A 3006 Springfield would have been a much better weapon. What is not known is that 3 FBI snipers tried to duplicate his shots some years later and none did as well as he did. If he acted alone he was one of the luckiest SOB's around. So one can think its possible. But the weakest part of the acted alone arguement is the magic bullet. As an ammunition inspector and expert for 25 years, that bullet really was magic.

So much of what the Warren commission had to look at had been sanitized. And as has been mentioned many of that commission certainly died not long after and in curious circumstances. There are way too many unanswered questions about how security was allowed to be so relaxed that day and things like that that have made me think for a long time that a conspiracy is much more likely than what the warren commission claimed.

 

[big dog cowboy]

A cover up by the Warren Commission? No

Do you think Oswald acted alone? No

Do I think we will ever know the real truth? No

 

[Hostile]

Notherbob, that was really more than I ever could have hoped for in this thread. One of the issues of the conspiracy has always been the number of shots. I think you are right and there were 3 shots and echoes.

I've seen the Zapruder film so many times as I'm sure we all have. I am convinced the shot came from behind President Kennedy and was Oswald.

I've seen the Moorman photograph and all of the other films etc. of the grassy knoll area and the "enhanced photographs" and I just do not see a "badgeman" or any other person there.

Where I waver is on a conspiracy. The real mystery guy is Jack Ruby. Ruby's Carousel Club was supposedly a hangout for a lot of powerful players in Texas. Ruby allegedly had connections. Did he have a connection to Oswald? Is that why he killed him? That is where I am flat not sure.

The main name I have ever heard mentioned as a connection between Oswald and Ruby is David Ferrie, an alleged hit man who is known to have spoken out publicly against JFK. There is a photograph of Ferrie and Oswald together on Ferrie's Wiki page. It was taken 8 years before the assassination. But the connection to him is there. Jack Ruby also was alleged to have called Ferrie the day before the assassination. For years there were rumors Ferrie's library card was on Oswald when he was arrested. That has since been proven false.

One of the enhanced photos was allegedly of Ferrie holding a rifle. Others claim to have seen a clown like figure leaving the area. Ferrie had no body hair and was alleged to wear red wigs and draw his eyebrows on.

So many weird things surround this event. As mentioned the odd number of people who died strangely. The autopsy photos and the debate on whether they are doctored or not. LBJs possible involvement. CIA involvement.

By far, to me two of the most compelling photographs in our History have been taken surrounding this event. They are John Jr. saluting and Jackie in her blood stained coat at Johnson's swearing in. Images I don't think I will ever forget.

 

[zrinkill]

Once everyone who could be imprisoned or embarrassed by this case is dead, someone will miraculously find some paperwork (whether a "diary" or a government document) that will tell about the cover up.

I think many will be surprised on why he was assassinated.

 

[ShiningStar]

wow have times and society has fallen. Back then it wasnt about politics as much as it was the president of the United States, now that we have media coverage on every street and everyone with a camera catches everything, go ahead try it out yourself, do something funny and watch it on Youtube.

We at least showed a lot more respect for the president back then than we do today.

Overall I dont care, and I agree with Zrinkill, after all the people are dead than we'll learn a smidgen of the truth, we'll clap hands, let the dust settle, tell whoever they were wrong and someone in the dark will smile, whistle a little tune and walk away.

 

[urface59]

I thought everyone knew by now that it was The Comedian

 

[Arch Stanton]

If you haven't seen it the Discovery Channel documentary based on the book Legacy of Secrecy is worth a look.

The book's website - http://www.legacyofsecrecy.com/

I've always thought there was a connection between the mob and / or the Cubans and the JFK / Bobby Kennedy assassinations. I don't believe that is was a coincidence that they were both assassinated by different parties. Someone had a grudge against both of them.

 

[CanuckCowboysFan]

The Government is behind it.

 

[CowboyDan]

wow have times and society has fallen. Back then it wasnt about politics as much as it was the president of the United States, now that we have media coverage on every street and everyone with a camera catches everything, go ahead try it out yourself, do something funny and watch it on Youtube.

We at least showed a lot more respect for the president back then than we do today.

Overall I dont care, and I agree with Zrinkill, after all the people are dead than we'll learn a smidgen of the truth, we'll clap hands, let the dust settle, tell whoever they were wrong and someone in the dark will smile, whistle a little tune and walk away.

Not entirely true. You should read the full page ad taken out in the Dallas Morning News the week that JFK was to arrive. It is brutal. And that wasn't the only time he was called a socialist, commie, etc. He was hated and loved, and there were few people that fell in between.

Many of you have brought up some great points, facts and info about the event. I love this topic, so keep it coming. 2 quick recommendations: visit the 6th Floor Museum in Dallas and read "Brothers".

My thoughts on the event:
I do not believe Oswald acted alone. I do believe there was a 2nd gunman on the grassy knoll. All you have to do is watch the Zapruder film, and ask yourself, "if Dan smacked me in the forehead, which way would my head snap....forward or backward? " To me, it's clear as day. Not sure how anyone argues it. It is also clear to me that there is no way the "Magic Bullet Theory" has any basis in reality. Consider who came up with the idea....Arlen Spector.
Ok, so who was it? After reading and viewing tons on this event, I rule out Castro and Hoffa/Unions. Castro actually came to admire JFK. Hoffa hated RFK much more than JFK and there's no connection to Oswald as far as I can see. Kennedy often felt threatened by the CIA. He knew he couldn't trust them after the Bay of Pigs and was constantly at odds with them over situations in Cuba and Vietnam. It is my opinion that the CIA took him out. They wanted to get LBJ in there as soon as possible and ramp up Vietnam. It worked.
The thing that I don't understand is how poorly Oswald planned his "getaway". He fires the shots, goes to the cafeteria, then walks to the movies, killing a cop along the way?? I just don't get it. Makes me wonder if he really was just a patsy, as he claimed.

 

[CowboyDan]

If you haven't seen it the Discovery Channel documentary based on the book Legacy of Secrecy is worth a look.

The book's website - http://www.legacyofsecrecy.com/

I've always thought there was a connection between the mob and / or the Cubans and the JFK / Bobby Kennedy assassinations. I don't believe that is was a coincidence that they were both assassinated by different parties. Someone had a grudge against both of them.

RFK was hated by the Mob and by Hoffa/the Unions, because he went after both of them, hard, as Attorney General. I think you should start with those two groups when looking at RFK's death.

I'm telling you, check out the book "Brothers". It's great stuff.

 

[notherbob]

Notherbob, that was really more than I ever could have hoped for in this thread. One of the issues of the conspiracy has always been the number of shots. I think you are right and there were 3 shots and echoes.

I've seen the Zapruder film so many times as I'm sure we all have. I am convinced the shot came from behind President Kennedy and was Oswald.

I was on Akard st. crossing Pacific when I heard the shots; there was one and then a second after maybe two seconds and then a third about a second or a little more after the second. Pacific street was basically a canyon with big buildings to the left and much shorter buildings to the left so there was a fairly clear audio path from my position to Dealy Plaza and I definitely heard the original shoets followed by weaker echos off the tall buildings on the right following each shot.

Most of downtown was devoid of cars and the pedestrians were almost all lined up along the motorcade route so I was alone as I walked briskly back to my office and I wondered about those sounds and my curiosity certainly peaked when I saw those two carloads of what were probably secret service agents roaring up the wrong way on a one way street. They had probably been at the Trade Mart awaiting JFK's arrival when they got the radio call and sped to the scene.

 

[Hostile]

I was on Akard st. crossing Pacific when I heard the shots; there was one and then a second after maybe two seconds and then a third about a second or a little more after the second. Pacific street was basically a canyon with big buildings to the left and much shorter buildings to the left so there was a fairly clear audio path from my position to Dealy Plaza and I definitely heard the original shoets followed by weaker echos off the tall buildings on the right following each shot.

Most of downtown was devoid of cars and the pedestrians were almost all lined up along the motorcade route so I was alone as I walked briskly back to my office and I wondered about those sounds and my curiosity certainly peaked when I saw those two carloads of what were probably secret service agents roaring up the wrong way on a one way street. They had probably been at the Trade Mart awaiting JFK's arrival when they got the radio call and sped to the scene.

I have long believed the reports of 4, 5, and 6 shots were echoes. You cleared up a huge part of the mystery for me today.

You were far enough away to distinguish. Those right at the site wouldn't have been able to.