Juan Thornhill - Do Not Want

[JBell]

How is Rapp a better fit? It's been said they aren't necessarily looking for a pure box safety. If they truly are looking for a more flexible type safety, that's not Rapp IMO.

Rapp is a better fit if they want a guy who will be an asset in the run game. Not arguing that he's more versatile than Thornhill, but skills like tackling, strength, and taking good angles in run support seem to be things they're prioritizing based off of who they've been interested in free agency and the draft process. I'm not too high on Rapp due to his lack of versatility, but the things he does bring to the table he's REALLY good at.

 

[armadillooutlaw]

I swear I read a couple of blurbs saying the Cowboys aren't necessarily looking for a pure box safety ala Church to play next to Woods.

Or maybe I just made that up!

Hopefully they are looking for somebody that has good coverage skills and instincts.
I'm liking Thornhill.

 

[reddyuta]

Rapp was my pet cat for a long time but that 40 time has really scared me off.

 

[darthseinfeld]

I’m a huuuge fan of Savage too but I just don’t know how he fits here because I think the team likes Xavier Woods and is looking to put someone next to him.

Personally, I like Woods but I would not think twice about bringing someone in to compete with him for his spot. I’m also of the mind in today’s passing game I would prioritize coverage skills over more classic in-the-box safety skills. That said, having two smaller stature safeties on the field would scare me.

If we drafted a safety that beat Woods out, I think Woods would spend the next 8 years as a member of the Dallas Cowboys never starting a game and still playing close to 50% of defensive snaps.

 

[darthseinfeld]

Yeah, I don't think Savage is in the cards for us, unfortunately

They probably dont view him as a fit. He doesn't have the length they seem to covet in DB's

 

[cnuball21]

If we drafted a safety that beat Woods out, I think Woods would spend the next 8 years as a member of the Dallas Cowboys never starting a game and still playing close to 50% of defensive snaps.

Woods as a 3rd Safety isn’t a bad thing. With how much nickel we play and his versatility he’d still get a lot of snaps.

 

[gimmesix]

W're much more of a Cover 3 team now.

That's probably more accurate, but it still calls for the strong safety to walk up in run support and cover underneath or short routes, while the free safety plays deep center. Depending on the player we have at strong safety, though, we also have him lining up and taking the tight end at times.

 

[gimmesix]

This is why it makes sense to move Woods to SS and bring in a speedy ballhawk like Savage at FS. Savage can lay the wood too.

I just don't know if Woods can handle the run support responsibilities.

 

[Oh_Canada]

He sure doesn’t play to his timed speed which tells me he is unsure of himself or lacking instincts.

I am starting to think they should pass in round two if he is all that’s left of the top sixty type safeties. Rather them spend it on an inside dlineman, wr or corner.

 

[xwalker]

Thank for taking the time to make a rebuttal X. There is quite a bit of subjectivity when watching film. Show two guys the same video and they can have two different conclusions, such as me and you . (Which is why I have a huge issue with PFF)

We're in agreement on CGJ. Seems like everyone in the thread is. But we disagree quite a bit below.

At 1:20, I didn't say he missed a tackle. I said he took a poor angle. If he had widened out, he would've beat the QB to the sideline and met him around the 50.

Also if he had better play recognition, he could've made the tackle MUCH sooner. The QB took off with intentions to run rather early and Thornill was still worried about his zone instead of pursuing the QB. That half-second to second late of diagnosing the play late mattered. He ended up going in the wrong direction, slipping, then taking a poor angle in pursuit. I have no doubt that a guy like CGJ(and a few others) would've recognized the QB was taking off earlier, ditched their zone, and tackled the QB way before he had any chance of running for 70.

at :17 of this video you can see how late Thornhill is in recognizing that the QB is taking off. Also, at :55 in the same video, you get a different angle of the TD that occurred at 3:53 in the other video. You can see that Thornhill is at least partially to blame for allowing the TD. That was just one of 2 (nearly 3 TD's) he gave up in this game.

Go to 0:05 in that video and look at the black line on the field. That is the line of scrimmage. The QB can throw the ball anytime before he crosses that line.

In regards to running downfield, again it's not a good view. The other defender running with Thornhill runs right to the blocker that was blocking the defender near the sideline.

At 0:55 I still can't tell what happened. There should be enough video of Thornhill that it's not necessary to try to analyze a play that we can't really see.

 

[xwalker]

Yeah, we're gonna disagree on the play at :54. #17 run blitzed the inside gap at the snap. #37(?) had responsibility on the strongside. #13 was lined up as stand up DE on the weakside. #28 was responsible for containing the jet sweep.

That left Thornhill in the remaining gap to make the play, and he was just too slow to react and move laterally to do anything.

 

[Sydla]

I am sure it's been said and I just missed it, but did we even bring in Savage as one of the 30 visits? Did we meet with him at the combine?

 

[DBOY3141]

I am sure it's been said and I just missed it, but did we even bring in Savage as one of the 30 visits? Did we meet with him at the combine?

I asked that yesterday and a few people said he was not a 30 visit and there has been nothing said that we've even met with him.

 

[Hennessy_King]

I just don't want to see Heath starting this year.

 

[Carson]

It’ll be a mistake too.

I don’t think he gets past philly

 

[xwalker]

They probably dont view him as a fit. He doesn't have the length they seem to covet in DB's

Then most of the top Safeties are out because only Thompson has good length.

I listed height, weight, arm length here:

https://cowboyszone.com/threads/safeties-game-footage-review.431368/

 

[VACowboy]

He sure doesn’t play to his timed speed which tells me he is unsure of himself or lacking instincts.

Based on what? He had 98 tackles and picked the ball off six times in his first year playing safety.

I've seen every game of Thornhill's college career (most in person) and from the time he stepped on the field he stood out. He was just flat good. Game in and game out he was all over the place, always in tight coverage, and not just in tight coverage but getting his hands on footballs and making plays. And he has the numbers over three years as a starter to prove it. I haven't seen the other safeties that people love so I can't compare them to JT but for all of you who like them more I'd love to know what makes them better.

Thornhill is a good tackler and great cover safety with excellent ball skills, length and tremendous hops to go get the ball. He's an explosive athlete with huge upside, played a ton of snaps at Virginia and never missed a game. I've said it before in several threads: I wouldn't draft him to play linebacker, but if you want a smart DB who can force the run, cover anybody and take the ball away, it would take a lot to convince me that you're going to find a better player than Juan Thornhill at #58. He has size, speed, instincts and tremendous college productivity. He can play corner, free and slot, and if you need him in the box in some packages he can do that too. His best football is ahead of him, so, seriously, what is it that people don't like?

Just FYI: I love my Wahoos but I don't want them in Dallas just because they played for my college team. JT is just a really good football player who I know a lot about and who plays a position we need to upgrade. Like I say, I haven't seen a lot of the other guys, but if they're available and the better player then that's who I want. I Just know JT is really good.

 

[cnuball21]

Based on what? He had 98 tackles and picked the ball off six times in his first year playing safety.

I've seen every game of Thornhill's college career (most in person) and from the time he stepped on the field he stood out. He was just flat good. Game in and game out he was all over the place, always in tight coverage, and not just in tight coverage but getting his hands on footballs and making plays. And he has the numbers over three years as a starter to prove it. I haven't seen the other safeties that people love so I can't compare them to JT but for all of you who like them more I'd love to know what makes them better.

Thornhill is a good tackler and great cover safety with excellent ball skills, length and tremendous hops to go get the ball. He's an explosive athlete with huge upside, played a ton of snaps at Virginia and never missed a game. I've said it before in several threads: I wouldn't draft him to play linebacker, but if you want a smart DB who can force the run, cover anybody and take the ball away, it would take a lot to convince me that you're going to find a better player than Juan Thornhill at #58. He has size, speed, instincts and tremendous college productivity. He can play corner, free and slot, and if you need him in the box in some packages he can do that too. His best football is ahead of him, so, seriously, what is it that people don't like?

Just FYI: I love my Wahoos but I don't want them in Dallas just because they played for my college team. JT is just a really good football player who I know a lot about and who plays a position we need to upgrade. Like I say, I haven't seen a lot of the other guys, but if they're available and the better player then that's who I want. I Just know JT is really good.

Great stuff...IMO Thornhill is best case scenario at 58.

If he falls to 58 we'd be hard pressed to find a better talent available and at a position of need to boot.

 

[AKATheRake]

We need to create turnovers and this kid Thornhill does just that and we hope he's there at 58.

Jaylon Smith is our MLB so i'm not worried about Thornhill not looking so good when he's asked to play the "mike".

 

[Alexander]