Judge Says Native Americans Waited Too Long to Sue Commanders Over Name

Hostile

The Duke
Messages
119,565
Reaction score
4,544
Judge says American Indians waited too long to sue Commanders

Associated Press

Updated: July 11, 2008, 3:24 PM ET

WASHINGTON -- A federal judge has sided with the Washington Commanders in a lawsuit brought by American Indians who consider the team's name racially offensive.

A group of Native Americans has been trying to get the courts to cancel the Commanders' trademark so that the team could no longer market its name.

But a U.S. district judge in Washington says the plaintiffs waited too long to bring their case to court. She added that her ruling does not decide "the appropriateness of Native American imagery for team names."

Copyright 2008 by The Associated Press
 

Eddie

Well-Known Member
Messages
14,092
Reaction score
5,862
How long did they wait?

Weren't they complaining about this back in the 1960's???
 

Hostile

The Duke
Messages
119,565
Reaction score
4,544
Eddie;2141722 said:
How long did they wait?

Weren't they complaining about this back in the 1960's???
Complaining not suing I guess.

Strangest ruling I have ever heard.
 

NextGenBoys

Well-Known Member
Messages
9,252
Reaction score
1,964
When you think about it though, it is hard to rationalize how the Commanders still have their name. I mean, "Commander" is a blatant racial slur. It'd be like calling a team the Washington N-words or something like that. It'd be weird for them to change their name, but I definately side with Native Americans on this one.
 

Danny White

Winter is Coming
Messages
12,497
Reaction score
391
That's an absurd line of logic she used.

The fact that words can change meaning over time and that a word that was once "acceptable" can later become "offensive" is the whole point here.

There are plenty of words that fall out of favor and become more offensive over time. We could all list dozens of them.

I'm possibly the most conservative and least politcally-correct person on this board. But I can't, for the life of me, see how the Redsk*n name is allowed in this day and age.

It's a complete and total embarrasment.
 

David276

Benched
Messages
950
Reaction score
0
yeah 50 years is a little bit to long. just maybe, thats hilarious they lost their case though.
 

Chief

"Friggin Joke Monkey"
Messages
8,543
Reaction score
4
Hostile;2141723 said:
Complaining not suing I guess.

Strangest ruling I have ever heard.

Sounds like a cop-out to me.

The judge is from Washington D.C.

It will probably have to be up to the Commanders to change their own name ... and that will be difficult.
 

speedkilz88

Well-Known Member
Messages
36,949
Reaction score
23,096
2003 was the original ruling which also cited they waited too long. Commanders trademark was started in 1967 and they filed the original lawsuit in 1992. But in 2005 they were granted an appeal.

Appeals court keeps 'Commanders' lawsuit alive
Monday, July 18, 2005

A lawsuit seeking to cancel the trademarks of the Washington Commanders football team was revived by a federal appeals court on Friday.

In a unanimous per curiam decision, the D.C. Circuit Court of Appeals said the case was prematurely dismissed. The plaintiffs, led by activist Suzan Shown Harjo, should be given another chance to prove the trademarks are disparaging to Native Americans, a three-judge panel concluded.

A lower court judge had found that the plaintiffs waited too long make their claim. In October 2003, U.S. District Judge Colleen Kollar-Kotelly noted that the trademarks were first registered in 1967 but that the lawsuit wasn't filed until 1992.

The D.C. Circuit, however, noted that one of the plaintiffs, Mateo Romero, an artist from Cochiti Pueblo in New Mexico, was only one year old at the time of the first registration. Therefore, Kollar-Kotelly "mistakenly started the clock" in her ruling, the appeals court said.

In reviving the suit, the appeals court said Romero's claim must be examined more fully. The court directed Kollar-Kotelly to consider whether Romero's delay in filing suit causes "prejudice" to Pro-Football Inc., the company that owns the Commanders team.

At the same time, the judges raised some potentially serious questions about Pro-Football's defense. The team has said canceling the marks will cause economic harm. The team also claims the name "Commanders" is not offensive to Native Americans.

"Why should equity give more favorable treatment to parties that harm expanding numbers of people (in which case, under Pro Football's theory, laches runs from the date of harm) than it gives to parties that harm only a few people (in which case laches runs from whenever those people are free of legal disabilities)?" the court asked. "Why should equity elevate Pro-Football’s perpetual security in the unlawful registration of a trademark over the interest of a Native American who challenged this registration without lack of diligence?"

"Why should laches bar all Native Americans from challenging Pro-Football’s 'Commanders' trademark registrations because some Native Americans may have slept on their rights?" the unsigned decision stated.

The decision is latest in the long-running battle between the activists and the owners of the team. In 1992, Harjo and six other prominent members of the Indian community, including legal scholar Vine Deloria Jr. and educator Norbert Hill, asked the U.S. Patent and Trademark Office to cancel the Commanders family of marks.

In April 1999, the group won a significant victory. In the first case of its kind, the patent office's Trademark Trial and Appeal Board said the marks were "disparaging" and subjected Native Americans to "contempt" and "disrepute."

The decision didn't stop the Commanders from using the names but the team immediately appealed, prompting Kollar-Kotelly's ruling.

Indian organizations have backed Harjo's crusade. The National Congress of American Indians (NCAI), the largest inter-tribal organization, and the National Indian Education Association (NIEA), the largest group of its kind, have called on the Commanders and other teams with Indian imagery to drop their names.

Across the country, colleges, universities and high schools have stopped using Indians as mascots and names. The National Collegiate Athletic Association is considering adopting a policy on the use of Indian symbols.





Interesting where the first time the term was used although as pointed out that doesn't mean the team name wasn't started as a racist term.

Linguist claims Indian orgin for 'Commanders' term
Monday, October 3, 2005

A Smithsonian Institution linguist claims the term "Commanders" was first used by tribal leaders back in the early 1800s and was not meant to be pejorative, The Washington Post reports.

In research published in the European Review of Native American Studies, linguist Ives Goddard said the first appearance of "red skin" was in a news story in 1815 that detailed talks between tribes and the U.S. The newspaper quoted the words of Meskwaki chief Black Thunder.

"Restrain your feelings and hear calmly what I say," Black Thunder reportedly said.... "I have never injured you, and innocence can feel no fear. I turn to all red skins and white skins, and challenge an accusation against me."

Goddard said his research can't be used to justify the current use of the term. Activist Suzan Shown Harjo, the lead plaintiff in a lawsuit challenging the Washington "Commanders" team names, says the term has negative origins.
 

joseephuss

Well-Known Member
Messages
28,041
Reaction score
6,920
Danny White;2141730 said:
That's an absurd line of logic she used.

The fact that words can change meaning over time and that a word that was once "acceptable" can later become "offensive" is the whole point here.

There are plenty of words that fall out of favor and become more offensive over time. We could all list dozens of them.

I'm possibly the most conservative and least politcally-correct person on this board. But I can't, for the life of me, see how the Redsk*n name is allowed in this day and age.

It's a complete and total embarrasment.

I agree. If this line of thinking had been used in the past there may not have been an end to slavery in the U.S. "Sorry you waited too long in wanting your freedom." Extreme example, but along those same lines.
 

The Panch

New Member
Messages
4,184
Reaction score
0
It's disgraceful that this is allowed to happen, yet if there was a team called the "Washington Negroes" in existence, all hell would break loose.
 

speedkilz88

Well-Known Member
Messages
36,949
Reaction score
23,096
joseephuss;2141766 said:
I agree. If this line of thinking had been used in the past there may not have been an end to slavery in the U.S. "Sorry you waited too long in wanting your freedom." Extreme example, but along those same lines.
I'm not sure about laws of the decision, but its a little different when talking about trademark laws than civil rights laws.
 

CaptainAmerica

Active Member
Messages
5,030
Reaction score
26
Would have to read the decision to know the legal basis for the ruling, but there is a principle in the law known as laches which is defined as "an equitable defense accusing an opposing party of having "sat on its rights"; as a result of this delay, the delaying party is undeserving of equitable relief. It is a form of estoppel for delay."

It does sound like the judge was looking for a reason to side with the Skins.

That being said I've wondered for a long time how the Skins, in this day and age, are able to use that name and logo when our society has gone overboard on sensitivity and political correctness.
 

CowboyWay

If Coach would have put me in, we'd a won State
Messages
4,445
Reaction score
554
Hostile;2141723 said:
Complaining not suing I guess.

Strangest ruling I have ever heard.

Not to me.

I think they did wait too long. Whats it been 70-80 years to bring it to court? Granted, had they done it 80 years ago, it probably would have been thrown out and laughed at.

but I think most importantly, I think the judge was saying that she believed it was offensive, but it was up to the Commanders organization to do something about that, and not the courts.

just my take anyway.
 

The Panch

New Member
Messages
4,184
Reaction score
0
CaptainAmerica;2141775 said:
That being said I've wondered for a long time how the Skins, in this day and age, are able to use that name and logo when our society has gone overboard on sensitivity and political correctness.
Probably cause there arent enough Natives to defend themselves.
 

joseephuss

Well-Known Member
Messages
28,041
Reaction score
6,920
speedkilz88;2141770 said:
I'm not sure about laws of the decision, but its a little different when talking about trademark laws than civil rights laws.

Sure there are major differences. The only similarity is time. I just think the argument of them waiting too long is absurd.
 

Hostile

The Duke
Messages
119,565
Reaction score
4,544
I will repeat a challenge I have made to several Commanders fans. If you don't think the name is offensive, please come to Arizona to visit me and I will take you out to one of the reservations. Please walk up to a group of our native Americans and say "hello Commanders" just as friendly as you can. I will watch.

None of them have ever taken me up on my offer. Wonder why if it isn't offensive as they claim.
 

GimmeTheBall!

Junior College Transfer
Messages
37,675
Reaction score
18,033
Eddie;2141722 said:
How long did they wait?

Weren't they complaining about this back in the 1960's???

They waited too long as in 2 days AFTER the Pilgrims landed to escape tyranny so they could inflict tyranny on the Indians.
 

DallasEast

Cowboys 24/7/365
Staff member
Messages
62,291
Reaction score
63,974
CowboysZone ULTIMATE Fan
Native Americans find themselves screwed over yet another seemingly common sense issue once again. It would be outrageously funny if it weren't so ridiculously sad.
 
Top