Let's cut Dez

[Verdict]

Nobody's trading for that contract. Not when they can clearly see the returns aren't there.

The problem is that these guys view Dez as he was once viewed and don't believe any of Dez' lack of production is his fault.

 

[Verdict]

You don't cut Dez you cut that horrible contract in half.

That takes agreement from Dez which will never happen.

 

[Stash]

I think it would be reasonable to restructure Dez and try to make him a #2 possession receiver and a goal line target but he is NEVER going to agree to that. Dez is probably a really nice person but he is delusional if he thinks he's too 5 (and based on his actions that's what I think Dez thinks).

If we we ask Dez to take a pay cut he is going to flip out and go totally maliganant cancer on us. A pay cut is a reasonable objective option but I don't think that's remotely an option for Dez from his point of view.

I tend to agree with you, so if the team is considering asking him formally to take a paycut, they had better be fully prepared for a possibly "nuclear reaction" and plan accordingly.

The last thing any party needs is the "malignant cancer" you're speaking of.

 

[DallasDW00ds0n]

"Who is your number 1?"

Well that's even debatable now. Your implying Dez is a #1

 

[Stash]

The problem is that these guys view Dez as he was once viewed and don't believe any of Dez' lack of production is his fault.

It definitely looks like there are two extremes in opposite directions. Neither of which tells the full story.

 

[Satchel89]

Ridley isn't as good as Christian Kirk.

I do like him too. He's another one that can run and catch the ball. They need that in this Offense. I would take either guy but that's just me

 

[Verdict]

I'd love to see what other top WRs would do in our scheme, running plays that seemingly seem to not help our WRs get open. Outside of maybe Brown who is just a freak, maybe Julio or Hopkins I suspect the results would not be too different. Of course I could be wrong...but aren't all our WRs having down years? My 2 cents.

Dak just isn't ready, and he may never be that type of QB, to overcome this scheme and have this passing game perform like it once did (even when Zeke is back). That doesn't mean he sucks or anything, but he may not be that Rivers/Romo/Rodgers, etc type of QB passing wise.

We were a bit premature riding solely with Dak, but that ship has sailed. He can be the guy, but the team is RUINING him by making him throw it to a covered Dez Bryant and three yards short of the chains Witten. It's idiotic coaching and it's ruining Dak.

 

[erod]

I think it would be reasonable to restructure Dez and try to make him a #2 possession receiver and a goal line target but he is NEVER going to agree to that. Dez is probably a really nice person but he is delusional if he thinks he's too 5 (and based on his actions that's what I think Dez thinks).

If we we ask Dez to take a pay cut he is going to flip out and go totally maliganant cancer on us. A pay cut is a reasonable objective option but I don't think that's remotely an option for Dez from his point of view.

With Brady or Rodgers, who can throw back shoulders and high-point balls like Romo did, he'd be a top 5 receiver again in touchdown productivity.

 

[erod]

I do like him too. He's another one that can run and catch the ball. They need that in this Offense. I would take either guy but that's just me

Kirk would be a devastating slot receiver and punt returner. Bye, bye, Ryan Switzer.

 

[Sydla]

Why don't you post Dez stats from the time before Dez signed his contract. They would be equally relevant. You can keep dreaming Dez is plying at the same level as he was pre contract if you want but it's not realistic.

He's not played as well........ no one denied that. But I am not sure it's time to just heave him to the wolves either.

His biggest issue right now is he has had a case of the dropsies this year. I am not sure that's something that is now going to be a long term issue.

 

[coult44]

It seems to be a suggestion/plan that keeps gaining steam with some around here. I don't get it but let's explore it.

For starters, let's look at the cap implications. If you cut him in the 2018 league year, you take an $8MM dead cap hit but save $8.5MM. If you make him a June 1 designee, that's $4MM in dead money and $12.5MM in cap savings. More than likely, they would want the cap savings immediately because they will have holes to fill in FA.

Now let's look at roster implications.

Bryant is gone. Who is your #1 WR? The answer seems to be "Oh, just draft your new #1". This logic is folly on a few levels. For one, few WRs come in and immediately plant their flag as a legit #1 WR. Second, this isn't a strong draft in terms of WRs to begin with. There is no Calvin Johnson, Julio Jones, AJ Green, Dez Bryant type in this draft.

Oh, maybe we can just sign a FA WR. OK...... here are the Top 3 WRs in free agency - Pryor, Wallace and Watkins. Any of those three strike you as legit #1s? Maybe Pryor with his upside but he's going to cost you and eat up whatever cap savings you had with cutting Bryant. And are you really better off with Pryor over Bryant? This might work IF you could get Pryor on a one year deal like Washington has. Little risk in that if he doesn't improve you have no long term implications but I am not sure he makes you better than if you had Bryant.

So I am fascinated by this cut Dez talk. I truly would love to see the plan some of you have come up with that involves cutting Dez and yet still improving the WR corps.

You forgot to mention that teams with WR's like Green, Jones, Johnson, Bryant, win a ton of championships. Oh wait, never mind. Why do people think "number 1" type WR's are needed? Who was the last one to be great and win? Seems to me teams like NE, SEA, NY, Den, win SB's with different types of guys...

 

[Stash]

With Brady or Rodgers, who can throw back shoulders and high-point balls like Romo did, he'd be a top 5 receiver again in touchdown productivity.

I wouldn't dispute that. I also wouldn't dispute the fact that neither of those teams would touch him.

 

[TwentyOne]

It seems to be a suggestion/plan that keeps gaining steam with some around here. I don't get it but let's explore it.

For starters, let's look at the cap implications. If you cut him in the 2018 league year, you take an $8MM dead cap hit but save $8.5MM. If you make him a June 1 designee, that's $4MM in dead money and $12.5MM in cap savings. More than likely, they would want the cap savings immediately because they will have holes to fill in FA.

Now let's look at roster implications.

Bryant is gone. Who is your #1 WR? The answer seems to be "Oh, just draft your new #1". This logic is folly on a few levels. For one, few WRs come in and immediately plant their flag as a legit #1 WR. Second, this isn't a strong draft in terms of WRs to begin with. There is no Calvin Johnson, Julio Jones, AJ Green, Dez Bryant type in this draft.

Oh, maybe we can just sign a FA WR. OK...... here are the Top 3 WRs in free agency - Pryor, Wallace and Watkins. Any of those three strike you as legit #1s? Maybe Pryor with his upside but he's going to cost you and eat up whatever cap savings you had with cutting Bryant. And are you really better off with Pryor over Bryant? This might work IF you could get Pryor on a one year deal like Washington has. Little risk in that if he doesn't improve you have no long term implications but I am not sure he makes you better than if you had Bryant.

So I am fascinated by this cut Dez talk. I truly would love to see the plan some of you have come up with that involves cutting Dez and yet still improving the WR corps.

I think Dez is gone after 2018.

That gives us enough time to replace him. Draft a WR in 2018 or get a FA.

I liked Dez but the way he handled his contract negotiations wasnt ok. He lost me there.
More of all he isnt a good player anymore and i really was always in doubt.

he didnt pan out. Let him go and get someone who can handle the #1 duties.

But more of all we are in need of an capable #2 receiver. TWILL doesnt get it. We need someone who can step up when Beasley and Witten/Dez is double covered.

 

[TwentyOne]

With Brady or Rodgers, who can throw back shoulders and high-point balls like Romo did, he'd be a top 5 receiver again in touchdown productivity.

I agree 100%. This is also a QB problem. But what will one do ? We have Dak now. Give us a WR who can create seperation when needed. Im tired of seeing Dez being pushed out of bounds on fly routes.

 

[Verdict]

It definitely looks like there are two extremes in opposite directions. Neither of which tells the full story.

If you can get Dez to play for about half of his current contract (which will never happen), get him to shut up, leave his QB alone and not melt down (which will also not happen) and get the coaching staff to quit forcing the ball to Dez to placate him (which will also not ever happen) ----I'm down with that. That's reasonable stuff right there.

Now back to reality. Do you remotely think ANY of those three things would ever happen? No way. Ever.

The only way that they can keep Dez on this team is to force the ball to him to keep him from melting down to justify his contract. It's a slippery slope that doesn't end well for the team. It's like TO. It will end badly. Things always end badly or they would not end at all.

 

[Leadbelly]

Dez and Boldin are NOTHING alike. Bolden was never very fast which is why he was drafted so low. But Bolden was a great tactician and an exceptional route runner. He didn't beat you with speed. He beat you with technique. He is the Anti-Dez.

Baloney. Boldin was a body position brute who ran a limited route tree mostly within 15 yards of scrimmage, created zero separation, racked up yards after the catch from slinging off smaller CBs and took three guys to bring him down. His game was the same routes as Dez is running now. If you think he was a tactician, you don't know what a tactician looks like.

The only marginal difference is Boldin caught a slightly higher percentage of his targets over his career and that's mostly because he played as a #2/#3 later in his career and played closer to the QB.

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

Well in fairness, NE has the greatest QB who ever played and a coaching staff that seems to know what they are doing. I suspect if Tom Brady had Dez Bryant, we wouldn't be commenting on how washed up Bryant is.

The Rams have a dynamic playcaller. Now, if you are telling me we are going to bring in a Sean McVay type as OC for 2018, yeah, I might buy into cutting him. You know I am all about a coaching change here.

This is a very good, very fair point. I will, however, qualify this. What you say very true IMO but, the flip side is that New England probably doesn't ever draft Dez because Dez has never been a guy who puts in the time to learn how to be a great route runner or flawless hands guy. I mean, it's a balance thing, in many ways IMO.

 

[noshame]

I don't care if we cut Dez as long as he's willing to take a heck of a lot less celery.
if he won't do that then I cut him.
And you're not replacing a number 1 you're replacing Dez, I don't think it would be that difficult

 

[Stash]

If you can get Dez to play for about half of his current contract (which will never happen), get him to shut up, leave his QB alone and not melt down (which will also not happen) and get the coaching staff to quit forcing the ball to Dez to placate him (which will also not ever happen) ----I'm down with that. That's reasonable stuff right there.

Now back to reality. Do you remotely think ANY of those three things would ever happen? No way. Ever.

The only way that they can keep Dez on this team is to force the ball to him to keep him from melting down to justify his contract. It's a slippery slope that doesn't end well for the team. It's like TO. It will end badly. Things always end badly or they would not end at all.

If there's no compromise and nothing changes? Peace out homie!

Thanks for everything and all the memories, but this situation just can't stay.

Again, it's not entirely one thing or one person's fault, as you alluded to. It's a combination of factors that make for a poop sandwich. And nobody likes the taste.

 

[erod]

I agree 100%. This is also a QB problem. But what will one do ? We have Dak now. Give us a WR who can create seperation when needed. Im tired of seeing Dez being pushed out of bounds on fly routes.

Dez' skillset and Dak's skillset just aren't a good match. That's what we're seeing.

Which makes Dez' contract a problem.