Lets say Wade gets the ax... which would you want?

theogt

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Alexander;2832645 said:
Grantham makes me uncomfortable. Dave Campo makes me break out into a cold sweat.

Given the theme of continuity, you would have to bet on one of those two unsettling choices.
It's hard to believe there are so few 3-4 coaches to choose from. These guys are like long-snappers. Take Capers -- he had a couple good seasons in the 90s and since then he's considered one of the best 3-4 coaches, even though he's consistently proven he's not any good.
 

zrinkill

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Mine would be

Mike Holmgren or Jason Garrett as number 1

Mike Shanahan or Jason Gruden as number 2

Everyone else would be a disappointment.
 

Stash

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Alexander;2832621 said:
The theme of this thread really needs to be maintained along the lines of who would reasonably take the job if it was even offered. I don't see Bill Cowher as falling into that category. I don't think there would be a gesture from Jones to give up the level of control he apparently craves.

Unfortunately, I'd tend to agree.

Although I think Cowher would be far and away the best choice, I think given the dynamic in Dallas, and Jones' need for an excess amount of control, you can rule out a guy like Bill Cowher being in the discussion.

I would say it's more likely that Garrett gets the job or a friend of Jones' like Mike Holmgren.
 

AbeBeta

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Gotta be Garrett. He was disappointing last season... but there are many good coaches who have been knocked off their games by TO. He does seem to have issues integrating new players (Williams, possibly Holland) and rookies (Choice, Jones a little, hmmm, but not Bennett) into the O on the fly - but those are the sort of growing pains you deal with.

I'm sick of the Shanny or Walrus talk. I want the NEXT great NFL coach. I don't know if Garrett can be that guy but finding the next Gruden or Reid the type of gamble that can pay off for years
 

Alexander

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theogt;2832654 said:
It's hard to believe there are so few 3-4 coaches to choose from. These guys are like long-snappers.

I am not sure I follow you. If you mean long-snappers (good long-snappers) are hard to find, I agree. Many more teams are or have been dabbling in it and even those you think would be a success (like Crennel) really struggle. I can understand why it is hard to find them as you don't see many places with that guru developing young coordinators to be as Parcells once did.

Take Capers -- he had a couple good seasons in the 90s and since then he's considered one of the best 3-4 coaches, even though he's consistently proven he's not any good.

I don't agree he's horrible. Overrated, quite possibly. But I think he's solid and certainly better than anyone internal.

It all depends on the degree Jerry Jones is married to the scheme. I still believe he is sold on it. If that's the case, it makes things that much harder.
 

Doomsday101

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theogt;2832654 said:
It's hard to believe there are so few 3-4 coaches to choose from. These guys are like long-snappers. Take Capers -- he had a couple good seasons in the 90s and since then he's considered one of the best 3-4 coaches, even though he's consistently proven he's not any good.

Not so sure about that since 5 more teams are moving to the 3-4. In a copy cat league it is not a shock given the top defenses in the league played the 3-4

Here’s at a look at five NFL teams that will use the 3-4 this season and the problems they might face:

Green Bay Packers

2008 numbers: Points allowed per game: 23.8; Total yards per game: 334.3; Over/under record: 9-6-1

The Packers are moving to a 3-4 this season – sort of. They announced their intention when they hired 3-4 guru Dom Capers away from New England to run it, and the exclamation point was spending their first-round draft pick on Boston College defensive tackle B.J. Raji. The Packers will likely devote the first part of training camp determining if Raji – who played in a 4-3 setup at BC – is best suited for defensive end (where he can rush the passer) or nose tackle (where he reads the center, then reacts).

Head coach Mike McCarthy says the team is not wedded to the 3-4, but will use it as the base defense. There is depth at linebacker with the likes of A.J. Hawk, Aaron Kampman and Clay Matthews (another first-round pick). They have to figure things out quickly if they expect to improve on a 6-10 record last year that was due to the team’s inability to pressure the quarterback.

Kansas City Chiefs

Points allowed: 27.5; Total yards: 393.2; Over/under record: 8-8

Kansas City had no choice. In the wide-open AFC West, pass coverage is essential. So the Chiefs locked down their defensive line by spending high draft picks on Tyson Jackson and Alex Magee, wanting to pair them on the D line with a hopefully improved Glenn Dorsey. Interestingly, no one in Kansas City is certain that Dorsey will be able to handle things too well at either DE or DT.

Linebacker Derrick Johnson has the speed and talent to handle one OLB spot, and the Chiefs hope that they can bleed a year or two out of veteran Mike Vrabel. Vrabel had an off year in 2008, though the entire Patriots’ defense sucked wind at times. Kansas City has 14 LBs on the roster, though a few are listed as LBs despite spending entire careers on the D line.

Denver Broncos

Points allowed: 28.0; Total yards: 374.6; Over/under record: 8-7-1

Denver’s management is indecisive enough on the offensive side of the ball without being non-committal on defense. The Broncos have no nose tackle of note and return the guts of a defense that ranked 30th in the league and gave up 28 points a game last season. Denver could have crawled into the playoffs by winning just one of the final three games, and instead gave up a total of 112 points, losing all of them.

Something had to be done. Mike Nolan, a 3-4 guy, was brought in from San Francisco to run the defense, but the Broncos don’t appear to have the personnel to make it work. There are holes everywhere, starting at nose tackle. The good news is DeWayne Robertson has had experience in the 3-4 with the Jets. The bad news is that Robertson hates the defense, and has been vocal about it. Just what the Broncos need, another pissed-off player.

Cleveland Browns

Points allowed: 21.9; Total yards: 356.5; Over/under record: 6-9-1

Cleveland’s original plan was for new coach Eric Mangini to play nose tackle, but since he’s only 5-foot-7, that presented problems. So Shaun Rogers returns to the job, and he’s more than pretty good. There are two problems: Last season the Browns defense treated opposing quarterbacks like they were bags of rattlesnakes (only 18 sacks) and the Cleveland offense was so bad that field position was a major issue.

D’Qwell Jackson led the NFL in tackles last season with 96, but his forte is stuffing the run. Mangini has a half dozen former Jets on the roster and used an old Patriots trick of trading down, down, down in the draft in order to strengthen the middle of the roster. Browns fans are tired of being patient, but that will be needed here.

New York Jets

Points allowed: 22.3; Total yards: 329.4; Over/under record: 8-7-1

Jets fans are giddy about the arrival of new boss Rex Ryan, who helped choreograph all those great Ravens defenses. Ryan lured away some of his former Ravens, most notably linebacker Bart Scott, to improve a defense that was average last season. But the key is NT Kris Jenkins, who some typical over-the-top Jets fans were hyping for NFL MVP last season before kissing the season good-bye by losing four of their last five. Jenkins will reside primarily at the nose but could see time at DE as Ryan tries to mix things up.

The schedule sets up pretty well for New York early. The Jets catch New England at home in Week 2 after New England plays the previous Monday night (Buffalo) in its opener, so Bill Belichick will not have a lot of look at Ryan’s defense before their first meeting. If the Jets open 2-0 with a win over New England, the New York Post will publish the parade route.
 

AbeBeta

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theogt;2832654 said:
It's hard to believe there are so few 3-4 coaches to choose from. These guys are like long-snappers. Take Capers -- he had a couple good seasons in the 90s and since then he's considered one of the best 3-4 coaches, even though he's consistently proven he's not any good.

One of the problems with our current staff is that Wade wasn't able to bring any hot young coaches with him so there is no obvious, in house replacement.

I do think there is the potential that there will be guys out there in 2010. For example, guys like Mike Nolan or Greg Manusky -- sure they are under contract but in both cases a bad season under a new HC and you might see them get the axe (b/c neither team is going to fire the HC) so they can bring in a 4-3 coordinator.
 

JohnnyHopkins

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If Garrett fails this year and is not a consideration, then I would want Ron Rivera. I wanted him or Rex Ryan the first time, so why change my mind now.

He played under Buddy Ryan with the Bears and is currently coaching the Chargers D. That would give him experience in the 3-4 and the 46 Defenses that Wade currently employees.
 

Chocolate Lab

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Arch Stanton;2832460 said:
Wouldn't averse to Irvin, but would go with Garrett.

I hoped it was obvious I was kidding, but maybe not. :eek::

Just go with Holmgren and hope you can find a decent 34 DC. I have no idea who that would be, but our D is almost guaranteed to drop off whoever it is. We just have to hope that our O will be improved enough to compensate.

And I still have no faith in Garrett. He has to show he can run his side of the ball before he's even a consideration to be given the whole team. We're not that far removed from Ed Reed and others calling him out, and his little power play of trying to bring in Capers still irritates me. I agree that a young guy would be the ideal way to go, but he hasn't shown at all that he's the right one.

On the HC choice in general, I always Jerry on his first Ticket show after the season ended, answering questions about bringing Wade back. And Jerry was recalling some advice given to him years ago by no less than Joe Gibbs that if you could, you needed to get a head coach with a real expertise on one side of the ball. And if you've seen the America's Game on the Skins Super Bowl winners (or are old enough to remember those teams), he talked about how the extent of his input on defense was to go over to Richie Pettibone and say, "Please stop them." (Plus patented grating nasally laugh.)

So while the motivating, drill sergeant type may be what most people want in a head coach, it's been proven plenty of times that it works just fine to have a head coach that runs one side of the ball without a lot of input into the other side.
 

Established1971

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TheSport78;2831940 said:
Lets assume Wade gets fired after this year and Garrett leaves after this year. Out of these available head coaches, who would you want?

Bill Cowher
Mike Shanahan
Jon Gruden
Mike Holmgren
Brian Billick


Holmgren would be the perfect fit here in my opinion. He's already on great terms with Jerry and he's a coach that demands respect. Coach Holmgren would also keep Romo in check with the turnovers and bone-head plays. Just look at old clips with Holmgren and Favre; we need that type of leader in the head coach. The main reason why Holmgren would be perfect here; He's not just a coach, but also a teacher.

Sam Rutigliano :)
 

Arch Stanton

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Chocolate Lab;2832745 said:
I hoped it was obvious I was kidding, but maybe not. :eek::

Just go with Holmgren and hope you can find a decent 34 DC. I have no idea who that would be, but our D is almost guaranteed to drop off whoever it is. We just have to hope that our O will be improved enough to compensate.

And I still have no faith in Garrett. He has to show he can run his side of the ball before he's even a consideration to be given the whole team. We're not that far removed from Ed Reed and others calling him out, and his little power play of trying to bring in Capers still irritates me. I agree that a young guy would be the ideal way to go, but he hasn't shown at all that he's the right one.

On the HC choice in general, I always Jerry on his first Ticket show after the season ended, answering questions about bringing Wade back. And Jerry was recalling some advice given to him years ago by no less than Joe Gibbs that if you could, you needed to get a head coach with a real expertise on one side of the ball. And if you've seen the America's Game on the Skins Super Bowl winners (or are old enough to remember those teams), he talked about how the extent of his input on defense was to go over to Richie Pettibone and say, "Please stop them." (Plus patented grating nasally laugh.)

So while the motivating, drill sergeant type may be what most people want in a head coach, it's been proven plenty of times that it works just fine to have a head coach that runs one side of the ball without a lot of input into the other side.

It was early and my sarcasm meter was switched off. :eek:: Dayum!

Anyways, I'd still take Mike over some of the proposed candidates and a couple of our ex-HC's. :)

Good story about Gibbs and he's probably right. Recently we've had Parcells who wanted to do everything and Phillips who didn't have the nads to deal with his OC or players. The Gibbs solution would be someone in between....though Joe DeC would be an interesting option.

Saying all that I'd go Jason Garrett.
 

DallasDomination

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Well i would say Cowher just because He will put some of these clowns on our team in line. Not enough accountability on this team. I've said it over and over. Also we will be more run heavy and Defensive minded.


That's my pick.
 

Four

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when parcells was here he was too rough, now wade is too soft, and you guys want someone to come in and be tough again.

it's like I am on a merry-go-round
 

Alexander

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Chocolate Lab;2832745 said:
We're not that far removed from Ed Reed and others calling him out, and his little power play of trying to bring in Capers still irritates me.

All I can say about this is why would you blame Garrett if Jerry Jones allowed this to occur in the first place? It isn't like he can make decisions who to add to the staff.
 

theogt

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Alexander;2832914 said:
All I can say about this is why would you blame Garrett if Jerry Jones allowed this to occur in the first place? It isn't like he can make decisions who to add to the staff.
Why blame the child for the parent that doesn't discipline? I say blame both.
 

AbeBeta

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theogt;2832921 said:
Why blame the child for the parent that doesn't discipline? I say blame both.

Was he wrong to want to bring Capers in? I've heard criticisms of Capers but did we or did we not have to replace our D-Coordinator mid-season last year?

Seems like we maybe could have used that extra set of brains
 

theogt

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AbeBeta;2832939 said:
Was he wrong to want to bring Capers in? I've heard criticisms of Capers but did we or did we not have to replace our D-Coordinator mid-season last year?

Seems like we maybe could have used that extra set of brains
Yes, he was wrong, if he was in fact behind it. There was no way of knowing how Stewart would handle play calling. He hadn't done it the year before, but the offensive coordinator shouldn't stick his head into that situation unless he's a spoiled brat kid (to keep with the analogy) to begin with. And obviously, if Garrett had enough time to focus that closely on the defense, he might should have spent more time fixing his own playcalling problems.

Thankfully, Wade recognized it was a problem sooner rather than later and it was remedied.
 

Four

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where did this come from, that garrett was who wanted to bring in capers?

I have never heard that before this thread...
 
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