Melvin Gordon: It'd be "Sweet" to Run Behind Cowboys O-Line

[endersdragon]

Do what QBs do and just say, "Sorry, not playing here!",
and get yo booty to Dallas!

We would still have to trade in that case... look at Eli/Rivers

 

[tyke1doe]

Not really worried about the Ravens... but between the Cards and Lions... at least 1 will draft a RB. If Gurley makes it to 23 Gordon might make it to 27... but I just don't see it happening. I think if we want Gordon or Gurley we will have to make a Dez Bryant type trade and move up 5 or so spots.

What did we give up to move ahead of Baltimore to get Dez?

NEVERMIND. I read the answer already.

 

[AzorAhai]

If you look at it in terms of # of snaps played, I think Gordon would have more snaps than anyone we'd chose on defense in 2015. Otherwise, let's think of the different options on defense. At defensive end, if you think Hardy is just a one year mercenary, then obviously DE becomes a huge need, but at least for 2015 a DE in the first is going to be largely a rotational guy. A corner in the first might win a starting position, but only if you assume we cut Carr. A 1-tech would be an immediate starter and upgrade, but the only guy really mentioned for that position probably isn't on the field for over half the snaps when we're in nickel. There aren't really any safeties thought of as good value picks at 27, but a trade down could result in a good FS.

One thing I'm thinking about is that, while spending a first on a RB is almost against my religion at this point, this pick would essentially guaranty that we can go 5 more seasons not using salary cap space at the position. We could churn cheap players behind Gordon and then just see where things are at in 2020.

Hardy was so huge for this team to get. Even if he is a 1 yr rental, any DE drafted will likely be the 4th DE on the depth chart and probably won't see a ton of snaps. Basically this year would be an adjustment, learning season for the player. Why draft a more polished ready to play DE who doesn't need as much seasoning just to sit and learn on the bench, when you can get one in the 3rd or 4th who actually needs some transition time. Hardy has at minimum bought the team a year to groom a mid rd pick.

 

[tyke1doe]

Still have to worry about SD, Det, and Baltimore.

I doubt SD takes a back. They're jockeying for Mariota. Besides, they draft higher than Detroit, Arizona and Baltimore and can pick a back in the second.

 

[tyke1doe]

Hardy was so huge for this team to get. Even if he is a 1 yr rental, any DE drafted will likely be the 4th DE on the depth chart and probably won't see a ton of snaps. Basically this year would be an adjustment, learning season for the player. Why draft a more polished ready to play DE who doesn't need as much seasoning just to sit and learn on the bench, when you can get one in the 3rd or 4th who actually needs some transition time. Hardy has at minimum bought the team a year to groom a mid rd pick.

Good point.

 

[KDM256]

Would love to see Gordon on this team as well as Gurley but I don't want the Cowboys trading up to get a player unless its a can't miss QB or DE like someone said earlier...

 

[burmafrd]

to be blunt you can get a back about as good as gordon and maybe better later on. Coleman for sure in the 2nd and there are other backs that would get the job done pretty well you could get in the third. Gurley is the only back worth a first in this draft.

 

[Idgit]

If you look at it in terms of # of snaps played, I think Gordon would have more snaps than anyone we'd chose on defense in 2015. Otherwise, let's think of the different options on defense. At defensive end, if you think Hardy is just a one year mercenary, then obviously DE becomes a huge need, but at least for 2015 a DE in the first is going to be largely a rotational guy. A corner in the first might win a starting position, but only if you assume we cut Carr. A 1-tech would be an immediate starter and upgrade, but the only guy really mentioned for that position probably isn't on the field for over half the snaps when we're in nickel. There aren't really any safeties thought of as good value picks at 27, but a trade down could result in a good FS.

One thing I'm thinking about is that, while spending a first on a RB is almost against my religion at this point, this pick would essentially guaranty that we can go 5 more seasons not using salary cap space at the position. We could churn cheap players behind Gordon and then just see where things are at in 2020.

Well, it's snaps played over that rookie contract, which makes things more complicated. And then you're really looking at the incremental value of the snaps played in that rookie contract over what we'd get instead with a lower round RB, compared to that same differential for a lower round CB or LB or pass rusher. It's the idea that value is so much more closely tied to first round ability at DE or CB that gives me the heebee jeebies when it comes to taking a RB in the first.

Honestly, it's a decent bet that whichever guy Dallas ends up with at RB (say for argument's sake it's a 3rd rounder) ends up with a bigger second contract than the RBs chosen before him this year. Whereas when it comes time to re-up the CBs and DEs taken before the third round this year, you can imagine many of them getting bigger deals than whichever guy we bring into Dallas. A lot of that's because our OL puts the RB in the position to be successful, but we've already sunk that investment, so we might as well use the heck out of it. It's like the opposite of spending all that money and all those picks on CBs and then leaving them at the mercy of a totally pedestrian DL like we've been doing in Dallas the last three years.

 

[fishspill]

All I know is actually running a good RB behind this OL made both sides of the ball better than I thought they would be. I'm not a believer in anything we have now and want to see a talented player come in to do the work this year. It's on the scouts, coaches, and front office to get that done in the next few months. I have players I like (Gurley, Gordon, Yeldon, AD) and those I don't like so much (Ajayi, Coleman, Abdullah) but since I'm not in the business of evaluating football players I'll just have to hope whoever gets here makes the same magic happen. I hope they move for the right player in whatever direction makes sense.

 

[AzorAhai]

to be blunt you can get a back about as good as gordon and maybe better later on. Coleman for sure in the 2nd and there are other backs that would get the job done pretty well you could get in the third. Gurley is the only back worth a first in this draft.

To get Coleman or Ajayi, you're going to have to trade up in the 2nd. That cost the team a 3rd last year to do and to move up high enough to get either, they probably have to do the same this year. To move up to to 21 or 22 they can give up a 3rd and probably recoup a 4th. Its assumed we can just get one later, but after the 1st the value may not line up with the pick until the 3rd and possibly the 4th. At that point the RB may not even be an upgrade and I would rather wait.

I think bottom line is they will likely have to maneuver up or down in the 1st or 2nd to get one of the top RBs and not reach on the pick or have them go off the board before them.

 

[JBS]

Gurley is going to disappoint a lot of people...he just can't stay on the field...I'd rather have Gordon

 

[gimmesix]

Still have to worry about SD, Det, and Baltimore.

I haven't looked. Is that how many teams are in need of a starting running back? Four (five including us).

 

[endersdragon]

I haven't looked. Is that how many teams are in need of a starting running back? Four (five including us).

There are others, but most of them are too early for it to make sense to draft one in the first.

 

[Szczepanik]

I haven't looked. Is that how many teams are in need of a starting running back? Four (five including us).

I doubt DET takes a RB. They lost ALOT of defensive players. They will go D.

BAL signed Forsett. They won't get a RB from this draft that will produce more than Forsett. They lost 2 WR's last year in Torrey and Jacoby. They will go WR.

SD is our bet to snag Gurley. Gordon will be there at 27 but I hope KJ or Kendricks is the name on the card.

 

[gimmesix]

To get Coleman or Ajayi, you're going to have to trade up in the 2nd. That cost the team a 3rd last year to do and to move up high enough to get either, they probably have to do the same this year. To move up to to 21 or 22 they can give up a 3rd and probably recoup a 4th. Its assumed we can just get one later, but after the 1st the value may not line up with the pick until the 3rd and possibly the 4th. At that point the RB may not even be an upgrade and I would rather wait.

I think bottom line is they will likely have to maneuver up or down in the 1st or 2nd to get one of the top RBs and not reach on the pick or have them go off the board before them.

I'm thinking the trade down is more likely than the trade up. Gurley and Gordon will likely be gone and I don't think Dallas wants to give up an extra pick to move into position to get one of them, especially since it doesn't seem like it's a clear falloff to a few of the others.

I could see us trying to drop to somewhere early in the second, if we want one of the second-tier backs, but I won't necessarily be surprised to see us take one of them in the first if we have them rated similarly to the others players available.

 

[gimmesix]

I doubt DET takes a RB. They lost ALOT of defensive players. They will go D.

BAL signed Forsett. They won't get a RB from this draft that will produce more than Forsett. They lost 2 WR's last year in Torrey and Jacoby. They will go WR.

SD is our bet to snag Gurley. Gordon will be there at 27 but I hope KJ or Kendricks is the name on the card.

I think Gordon will be the higher-rated player on our board, and if he is, then I'd prefer for him to be the pick at a position of bigger need.

 

[AsthmaField]

Gordon would be the odds on favorite for ROTY in Dallas. It's hard not to want that on the team. I wonder how much it would take to trade up 3-5 spots to jump over the Ravens. Probably too much. But if you could spend a 1st and 4th to get a guy that is most likely to be voted the best player on offense for his class, is that worth it? I think you have to take that deal, though many would probably hate it.

No problem. Just tell Pittsburgh at #22 that you're trying to keep Gordon out of Baltimore for them and they should switch pretty cheaply. They will likely either take a CB or a safety so they should be fine with a RB going before them. Plus that would put Dallas in front of Detroit and Arizona and would likely guarantee Gordon to Dallas if that what they want.

 

[Doc50]

If you look at it in terms of # of snaps played, I think Gordon would have more snaps than anyone we'd chose on defense in 2015. Otherwise, let's think of the different options on defense. At defensive end, if you think Hardy is just a one year mercenary, then obviously DE becomes a huge need, but at least for 2015 a DE in the first is going to be largely a rotational guy. A corner in the first might win a starting position, but only if you assume we cut Carr. A 1-tech would be an immediate starter and upgrade, but the only guy really mentioned for that position probably isn't on the field for over half the snaps when we're in nickel. There aren't really any safeties thought of as good value picks at 27, but a trade down could result in a good FS.

One thing I'm thinking about is that, while spending a first on a RB is almost against my religion at this point, this pick would essentially guaranty that we can go 5 more seasons not using salary cap space at the position. We could churn cheap players behind Gordon and then just see where things are at in 2020.

Good thought process.

I'd like to see a comparative analysis of the personnel valuation process for each team. Asset worth is based on many factors, and weighting them properly will lead to wiser selections and cap mgt.

The reason a QB has high value is obvious -- he touches the ball and directs the offense on every play, and is personally involved in most scores.

High OL valuation is a bit more subtle in its design; we have seen how this unit is critical in making every offensive play go.

This kind of moneyball was initially developed by none other than Schramm and Landry.

 

[Hardline]

I want Gurley on this team bad.
If we miss out on him then I dont care what RB gets selected here.

 

[AzorAhai]

I want Gurley on this team bad.
If we miss out on him then I dont care what RB gets selected here.

Rumors coming out say he's the top RB for the Cowboys right now, but the RBs won't be finalized until his medical re-check on the 18th. If he gets past SD at 17 I would look out for a Cowboys trade up to 21-23 to get ahead of Ariz and take him.