My Meaningless Thoughts On the Game...

Yakuza Rich

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AdamJT13;2960185 said:
I thought you said they knew how to protect the ball? Now you're saying they should throw interceptions? And Brees should throw fewer interceptions, given that a much higher percentage of his passes are screens and dumpoffs. When he has to throw downfield, he gets picked off way too much.

If you would really take Romo over Brees, then I don't know what to say. And if you think that Peyton Manning doesn't protect the ball entirely better than Romo, again...I don't know what to say.

Like I said, good luck with that. You'll almost certainly end up with the same number of bad games and fewer good ones.

Romo is a known commodity now. There's a reason why we stink with him come December. I'd rather see the reality that we won't win with him, trade him while he should have exceptional trade value and make the team better. They called us fools for trading away Hershel, too.





YAKUZA
 

Yakuza Rich

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SultanOfSix;2960188 said:
and the last one was simply like a punt. Yeah, they were bad plays but outside of the first one, hardly game changers or really that boneheaded.

That's where Romo and his apologists make the mistake. No, it wasn't like a punt..especially how well the punt unit has performed this year. If the pass goes incomplete and Dallas punts, there's a good chance we can down that inside the 10.

In other words, leave the punting to our Pro Bowl punter.





YAKUZA
 

MrMom

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SultanOfSix;2960188 said:
As much as had a distaste for Romo's play yesterday, I feel that the defense was much worse. This is supposedly Wade, the defensive guru's defense we're talking about. We know Romo will make the occasional boneheaded play right now, which he does have to shore up. The only interception that really cost the team was the first boneheaded one. The second was just an inaccurate throw that all QBs make once in a while that happened to get a lucky bounce off of Witten's legs right into the arms of a defender, and the last one was simply like a punt. Yeah, they were bad plays but outside of the first one, hardly game changers or really that boneheaded.

:laugh2:
 

SultanOfSix

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Yakuza Rich;2960212 said:
That's where Romo and his apologists make the mistake. No, it wasn't like a punt..especially how well the punt unit has performed this year. If the pass goes incomplete and Dallas punts, there's a good chance we can down that inside the 10.

In other words, leave the punting to our Pro Bowl punter.

YAKUZA

I didn't say it was a good punt. The main point was, it wasn't a game changer. The defense had ample opportunity to stop the Giants, but once again they came up short, just like on the last drive. Just like last year against the Ravens. If Romo plays better, we win this game. If the defense plays better we win this game. Neither one is absolved in any manner.
 

juck

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Yakuza Rich;2959997 said:
Romo's great games almost always come against mediocre to bad defenses. His awful games can be against anywhere from mediocre to great offenses. Usually if the defense is pretty good, we are in trouble. The big thing is he doesn't protect the ball and doesn't seem to care to protect the ball.

Looking to replace him as quick as possible, but in a sensible manner would be good for Dallas. In '01 the Chargers made Drew Brees the first pick in the 2nd round and he was set to the be the franchise QB. After '03 the Chargers pretty much gave up on him for the most part and then drafted Phillip Rivers in '04. But a funny thing happened...Brees had a fantastic year. He then had a very good '05 season. So the Chargers had a great problem on their hands, a Pro Bowl QB and a high first round pick with All Pro potential. And if you ask the right people close to the Chargers situation, they will tell you that Brees was certainly motivated to keep his job because his offseason workouts were far more intense than the previous years with the team.

In the end the Chargers let Brees go and wound up with a great QB (who also led his team to the AFC Championship game in '07 before losing to a historic Patriots team). And if the Chargers execs were not so incompetent, they could've traded away Brees for a lot of picks (although to their credit, he did tear his labrum just months before).

There are potentially 3 great QB's coming up in this draft (Bradford, McCoy, and Tebow). Certainly we'd have to scout them out and see what the scouts think. But in recent years we've seen Ryan in Atlanta, Flacco in Baltimore, Roethlisberger in Pittsburgh and now Sanchez in NYJ come out and have very solid rookie years and then get better in year two and see their team seriously contend for the Super Bowl. I think we can do that as well if these QB's have got 'it', I don't think Romo does.





YAKUZA
I am a big Longhorn fan and I think Mccoy is very good.Bradford is gonna be special. I know Tebow seems like he could be a bust to some,but all I see is a winner.That guy is a true beast.
 

kmd24

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Yakuza Rich;2959997 said:
Looking to replace him as quick as possible, but in a sensible manner would be good for Dallas. In '01 the Chargers made Drew Brees the first pick in the 2nd round and he was set to the be the franchise QB. After '03 the Chargers pretty much gave up on him for the most part and then drafted Phillip Rivers in '04. But a funny thing happened...Brees had a fantastic year. He then had a very good '05 season. So the Chargers had a great problem on their hands, a Pro Bowl QB and a high first round pick with All Pro potential. And if you ask the right people close to the Chargers situation, they will tell you that Brees was certainly motivated to keep his job because his offseason workouts were far more intense than the previous years with the team.

In the end the Chargers let Brees go and wound up with a great QB (who also led his team to the AFC Championship game in '07 before losing to a historic Patriots team). And if the Chargers execs were not so incompetent, they could've traded away Brees for a lot of picks (although to their credit, he did tear his labrum just months before).

There are potentially 3 great QB's coming up in this draft (Bradford, McCoy, and Tebow). Certainly we'd have to scout them out and see what the scouts think. But in recent years we've seen Ryan in Atlanta, Flacco in Baltimore, Roethlisberger in Pittsburgh and now Sanchez in NYJ come out and have very solid rookie years and then get better in year two and see their team seriously contend for the Super Bowl. I think we can do that as well if these QB's have got 'it', I don't think Romo does.

Trading Brees is your idea of a good analogy for trading Romo? The Chargers were lucky that Rivers has panned out, otherwise they would look like fools right now. What's the percentage of 1st round, can't miss prospects that turned out better than Romo? Thought so.

Romo is a big part of the problem, if the problem is losing a game now and then, but getting rid of him is not the solution, unless being mired in mediocrity for several more years is what you're shooting for.
 

superpunk

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Yakuza Rich;2960203 said:
Romo is a known commodity now. There's a reason why we stink with him come December.
YAKUZA

They've said the same thing about so many QBs. Even the Manning bros.

They can't win the big one - until they do. It's really a stupid argument. The notion that Romo can't get any better is really short-sighted.
 

Jimz31

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Oh how I would have loved to see you post like this when P. Manning had fewer than 50 starts....the complaints were the same....the guy threw INT's in 9 straight games that were returned for TD's....talk about mistake prone....throwing INT's on out routes...something a QB must absolutely not do....did he eventually learn from that? Yep. How long did it take him to get that monkey off of his back? Quite a while.

Everybody wants to act like Romo has been starting 5+ years but he hasn't.

Now, having said that, he absolutely sucked yesterday....that's a no-brainer....but we have all seen what he can do.

Couldn't disagree more on the JG issue....we still had more passes called than runs....always has been that way since he's been the OC...and normally for good reason as Romo more often than not gets it done.

However, last night it was obvious to everybody and their mother that Romo was struggling and that the G-men couldn't stop the run.

Just like another poster said yesterday....if we were Pittsburgh we would have run the ball 45 times and passed 15 times....

But....this is what we get having a former QB as an OC....More balance....MIX in the pass when the pass isn't working....make the defense stop you.

I like JG, but in a close game where your QB is sucking and the run can't be stopped....and we get the ball back after a three and out after we had just scored....you don't call a pass with one of the options being a deep guy. The smart thing would be to keep calling the same sort of game....didn't do it....all it took was a FG and the way our secondary was playing was pitiful....

More runs equals more TOP....less of a chance for them to score....

Just a pitiful gameplan in the second half with an obvious struggling QB.
 

goshan

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This whole thread is absolutely ridiculous.
Nobody in their right mind would set the team back 3-4 years back by trading Romo and drafting a college QB (which by the way, would have a 40% chance of being an NFL starter, and a 10% chance of being as good as Tony Romo).

If you think you have a chance (even a 20% chance) of competing for playoffs and superbowl, you absolutely don't throw in the towel on your franchise QB. This would be ludicrous. You have to give him at least 1-2 more years to see if he can get over the lump in terms of handling pressure and eliminating mistakes.

This isn't even a close 'football' decision.

I can't believe this argument is coming from someone that thinks of themself as an an 'expert' in football and tries to put stuff out there like some sort of journalist or expert analyst.

Totally a joke - get real.
 

Jimz31

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goshan;2960354 said:
This whole thread is absolutely ridiculous.
Nobody in their right mind would set the team back 3-4 years back by trading Romo and drafting a college QB (which by the way, would have a 40% chance of being an NFL starter, and a 10% chance of being as good as Tony Romo).

If you think you have a chance (even a 20% chance) of competing for playoffs and superbowl, you absolutely don't throw in the towel on your franchise QB. This would be ludicrous. You have to give him at least 1-2 more years to see if he can get over the lump in terms of handling pressure and eliminating mistakes.

This isn't even a close 'football' decision.

I can't believe this argument is coming from someone that thinks of themself as an an 'expert' in football and tries to put stuff out there like some sort of journalist or expert analyst.

Totally a joke - get real.

I guess he was right....meaningless thoughts.....
 

jumanji

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good post yakuza. most diehards are going to go after you on this. i think it's too ealry to bail on romo but i'm getting closer. he's running out of time. he doesn't take the game serious enough, he makes too many mistakes. worst of all, he chokes. you can have all the talent in the world....if you don't have it mentally, you're never going to succeed in this game.
 

AdamJT13

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Yakuza Rich;2960203 said:
If you would really take Romo over Brees, then I don't know what to say.

Did I say that? No. But I might. Brees has been a starter for seven seasons before this and has made the playoffs only twice. He barely has a .500 record. He throws an extremely high percentage of very short passes and still throws interceptions. And he's still prone to numerous bad games every season (he had a rating of less than 70 in six losses last year).

Brees and Romo are completely different types of quarterbacks, but I don't see how anyone can say Brees has been more successful. Throwing the ball 650 times in a season doesn't automatically make you great.


And if you think that Peyton Manning doesn't protect the ball entirely better than Romo, again...I don't know what to say.

I didn't say that, either. You said Manning and Brady knew how to protect the football when they were off. But if that's true, how do they end up throwing four or six interceptions in a game? Shouldn't they know how to protect the ball after, say, the first three? Or four? Or five?

No, the answer is that they're prone to having those types of games, too. And they're the best quarterbacks of this decade. Romo isn't any more prone to them than most quarterbacks.

Romo is a known commodity now.

Yeah, because no quarterback has ever gone without a playoff win in his first three seasons as a starter then went on to win a Super Bowl.

Isn't Brees a known commodity now, too? Would that make him a barely .500 quarterback who usually misses the playoffs and wins only one playoff game in seven seasons?

Cutler must be a known commodity by now. And boy, his 18-21 career record, zero playoff appearances and that four-interception game last week sure are appealing.

Was Peyton Manning a known commodity after his first four or five seasons? You know, when he was still throwing 19 or 23 interceptions in a season, barely had a .500 record as a starter and was 0-3 in the playoffs?

Was Eli Manning a known commodity in the middle of his fourth season, when he had a career losing record, had never won a playoff game and was leading the league in interceptions?

How is Romo any more a "known" failure than any of those guys -- Brees and Cutler right now, Peyton after four or five seasons and Eli during his fourth season? They haven't done anything more than he has, and they usually had done much less.
 

Jimz31

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AdamJT13;2960424 said:
Did I say that? No. But I might. Brees has been a starter for seven seasons before this and has made the playoffs only twice. He barely has a .500 record. He throws an extremely high percentage of very short passes and still throws interceptions. And he's still prone to numerous bad games every season (he had a rating of less than 70 in six losses last year).

Brees and Romo are completely different types of quarterbacks, but I don't see how anyone can say Brees has been more successful. Throwing the ball 650 times in a season doesn't automatically make you great.




I didn't say that, either. You said Manning and Brady knew how to protect the football when they were off. But if that's true, how do they end up throwing four or six interceptions in a game? Shouldn't they know how to protect the ball after, say, the first three? Or four? Or five?

No, the answer is that they're prone to having those types of games, too. And they're the best quarterbacks of this decade. Romo isn't any more prone to them than most quarterbacks.



Yeah, because no quarterback has ever gone without a playoff win in his first three seasons as a starter then went on to win a Super Bowl.

Isn't Brees a known commodity now, too? Would that make him a barely .500 quarterback who usually misses the playoffs and wins only one playoff game in seven seasons?

Cutler must be a known commodity by now. And boy, his 18-21 career record, zero playoff appearances and that four-interception game last week sure are appealing.

Was Peyton Manning a known commodity after his first four or five seasons? You know, when he was still throwing 19 or 23 interceptions in a season, barely had a .500 record as a starter and was 0-3 in the playoffs?

Was Eli Manning a known commodity in the middle of his fourth season, when he had a career losing record, had never won a playoff game and was leading the league in interceptions?

How is Romo any more a "known" failure than any of those guys -- Brees and Cutler right now, Peyton after four or five seasons and Eli during his fourth season? They haven't done anything more than he has, and they usually had done much less.

Nice.

It's so funny how people want him gone and use other people as comparison and then completely forget what they were like at the same point in their careers....
 

AdamJT13

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Jimz31;2960346 said:
Just like another poster said yesterday....if we were Pittsburgh we would have run the ball 45 times and passed 15 times.

I guess that other poster didn't watch Pittsburgh against the Giants last year.

The Steelers' running backs averaged 4.6 yards per carry, and Roethlisberger threw four picks. But they called 37 pass plays and only 21 running plays -- even though they were LEADING for most of the game. (Their defense folded in the fourth quarter, and they lost by seven.)
 

Jimz31

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AdamJT13;2960445 said:
I guess that other poster didn't watch Pittsburgh against the Giants last year.

The Steelers' running backs averaged 4.6 yards per carry, and Roethlisberger threw four picks. But they called 37 pass plays and only 21 running plays -- even though they were LEADING for most of the game. (Their defense folded in the fourth quarter, and they lost by seven.)

Barber averaged 6.9 and Felix averaged 13.7....with averages like that.....
 

AdamJT13

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Jimz31;2960457 said:
Barber averaged 6.9 and Felix averaged 13.7....with averages like that.....

Our backs averaged only 4.1 yards per carry in the first half, when Romo threw 19 of his 26 passes. We called far more running plays than pass plays in the second half, when our running game got going.
 

LittleBoyBlue

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YR - I look forward to your posts. Seem unbiased and to the point.

Unfortunately I flew out Sunday morning to go to that game so Romo could just give it away.

Romo is pathetic. Aikman must have been shaking his head. While Romo is not even close to Aikman QB-wise, he could have made a "few" good decisions and he didnt. Aikman could have won that game last night in his suit. Alot of the lesser QB's in the league would have come away with a win simply by Trent Dilfering it.



Yakuza Rich;2957991 said:
My Meaningless Thoughts On The Game
Yakuza Rich Blog

- I think Garrett will get a lot of the blame, but I actually didn't have too much of an issue with the playcalling this game. We simply had to pass the ball a little in the second half to keep the defense honest and that's what Garrett attempted. Unfortunately, the QB has to know that we need to protect the ball because the running game is working and at the very least you want to keep the defense honest. But, we simply do not have that in our QB.

We've added a QB-friendly O-Coordinator. We've spent millions on the O-Line. We've added a dynamic tailback unit consisting of Barber, Felix and Choice. We've got not one, but TWO dynamic tight ends. We then get rid of Owens because supposedly he was forcing the ball to him and that would give him room to grow. Instead, he showed that he's the same old Romo.

Put him against a team that is somewhat disciplined and not soft and if Romo doesn't have his 'A' game going the team will lose because of him. Let me make that clear, if the defense is pretty good (not great) and Romo is a little off, we will assuredly lose because of Romo. It's almost as good of a guarantee as you will find in the NFL.

I know this isn't popular, but we need to start looking for a way to replace him as soon as possible because in the NFL, you don't win playoff games if your QB cannot protect the ball. The Bears tried to disprove this in '06 and it burned them in the end. And the Bears in '06 had a ferocios defense that actually scored points for them and had an amazing special teams that scored points for them. But Grossman turned the ball over and all of that help from the defense and special teams couldn't get them a Lombardi Trophy. People talk about 'never winning a Super Bowl with Romo', well I'm hear to say that I don't see us winning a playoff game with Romo at the rate he's going.

I seriously mean this, if somehow a good QB is available in FA or via trade, I really think the team should take a good hard look at it. You have to give players chances to prove themselves in the NFL, but you also have to be very good to know when to stop giving them chances because they'll never meet the base level expectations that are set for them. We've got too much talent on this team with guys like Jay Ratliff, Kyle Kosier, Marc Colombo, Roy Williams, Jason Witten, etc who have shown a ton of heart and stepped up their games to let it be blown by a guy who simply cannot raise his level of play.

I am officially on the Get Rid of Romo (but do it in a smart way) bandwagon and a firm believer we won't win a playoff game with him until proven otherwise. Sometimes you gotta know when to throw in a lousy hand.


- Congrats to Joe DeCamillis with another impressive performance on special teams. This is part of the problem with Romo. The special teams are entirely impressive and effective at helping Dallas win the field position battle. Unfortunately when the QB throws pick 6's and INT's in our own territory, that doesn't help matters.


- Here's the difference between an organization like the G-Men and the Cowboys. The G-Men can take a guy like Manningham, a productive but troubled player in college and turn him into a productive and inspired player in the NFL. I'm still trying to figure out when was the last time the Cowboys have done that.

- Terence Newman is officially a pretty decent starting corner. He's no longer the shutdown corner he once was. Not even close

- Jay Ratliff looks like the best player on the team right now.

- Don't get too down on O-Scan right now. Young CB's seem to struggle the most in their second year. Never really figured out why, but that's what happens throughout the league. Newman's worst year was his second year. So was Asomugha's. Champ Bailey was horrible his second season. It happens.

- Spencer is too inconsistent. He'll look really great one play, then lose gap control and/or containment on the next play. His play is part of the reason why we have no sacks. He can get the beat on offensive tackle, but then he'll over-commit. He's almost symbolic of how the team plays as a whole.

- Last week I got criticized for saying we probably won't get many sacks early on, and so far we are at a goose egg.

- I still hate the 'freezing the kicker' method. I think it's bush league, but I also think it isn't effective. Coming from a golf background, which has similarities to kicking, I think freezing the kicker doesn't work because if I miss the field goal on the first try, I can then go off what I did wrong and correct it. It's essentially a practice kick.


- I'll give Garrett a lot of credit, he not only found ways to use each tailback effectively, but found ways to open up things in the running game. 250 yards rushing and we lose. If that doesn't tell you how disappointed I am in #9, then I don't know what to tell you.

- But let's not completely blame Romo. This was the epitome of an undisciplined, soft football team. How many missed tackles were there? 10? 12? 15? 20??? Flozell's trip costs Dallas a huge play which eventually leads to the fluke INT (although the throw by Romo was horrible). Carpenter gets called for a defensive hold which would've had Feagles punting from his own 5. Just lovely.

- Well, they get the Panthers...a team they've usually played well against although that is usually at Charlotte for whatever reason. Dallas had a real chance of going 5-0 into the bye week, but now with Carolina in a must win situation and a QB that not only has seen me and other fans jump off the bandwagon, but I have to question what the team is thinking or how long they will put up with this crap. But of course this doesn't excuse the other dumb mistakes, but you have to come away with a win when you should win (Dallas should've dominated the scoreboard), especially when you are playing a divisional foe at home. Believe it or not, Garrett has drawn a lot of confidence from me in his playcalling and play design. Now he's just got to get it through Romo's thick skull that these turnovers can't be allowed. Garrett seemingly has read my mind with playcalling lately and how to improve it, hopefully he'll do the same with Romo. If not, this could be a 7-9 team this year...if we're lucky.





YAKUZA
 

Yakuza Rich

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Jimz31;2960432 said:
Nice.

It's so funny how people want him gone and use other people as comparison and then completely forget what they were like at the same point in their careers....

Using ONE game for Peyton Manning in his career in rain soaked weather and claiming that it's practically the same thing as Romo's constant issues with protecting the ball is absurd.

Claiming that you never said you would take Brees over Romo and then say 'I might' but not really saying it is major league waffling. I like Adam's posts quite a bit, but this is something we just disagree on. I say fold on the lousy hand, he's a coach killer and a fan heartbreaker and a hope dasher.






YAKUZA
 

theebs

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YoMick;2960478 said:
YR - I look forward to your posts. Seem unbiased and to the point.

Unfortunately I flew out Sunday morning to go to that game so Romo could just give it away.

Romo is pathetic. Aikman must have been shaking his head. While Romo is not even close to Aikman QB-wise, he could have made a "few" good decisions and he didnt. Aikman could have won that game last night in his suit. Alot of the lesser QB's in the league would have come away with a win simply by Trent Dilfering it.


actually I just saw aikman on the news saying Dallas is a good team and that he thinks we will be right there in the end with philly and ny. He went as far as to say we have good players and he thinks the nfc rep for the superbowl will come from the east.

oh and aikman lost a couple of games on INT's returned for TD's. Had aikman had to grow up and play in this media environment he would be viewed very differently.

My suggestion is anyone that thinks romo is not good enough and on top of that thinks Jerry Jones the GM can go find another franchise qb well you need help and you are completely unrealistic.
 

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Somebody's *** is getting kicked in this thread. But I can't stop watching the trainwreck.
 
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