Newman out, Asante Samuel, how much draft picks to get him?

[theogt]

Asante Samuel is good if you've watched a Patriots game you know hes one of the top 5 Corners in the league and any top 5 Corner in the NFL is worth a 1st round pick.

Dude, he's not even a top 10 corner. Maybe top 15 or 20. He had one good year. And it was a good one. But in 2005 he was just an average to below average CB. He was one of the worst in the league at giving up TDs and long passes.

Maybe the light came on for him in 2006. Or maybe he just had one good season. We'll see, but he is not a top 5 corner.

 

[Cbz40]

Dude, he's not even a top 10 corner. Maybe top 15 or 20. He had one good year. And it was a good one. But in 2005 he was just an average to below average CB. He was one of the worst in the league at giving up TDs and long passes.

Maybe the light came on for him in 2006. Or maybe he just had one good season. We'll see, but he is not a top 5 corner.

I wouldn't care if he were a Top 3 Corner I would not make the trade.

 

[Sasquatch]

so, do we stand pat, and just wait to see if newman can recover, because if newman cant, we dont have a shut down corner, and thats where teams will attack us.

If the QB doesn't have enough time to progress through his reads ...

 

[CATCH17]

Dude, he's not even a top 10 corner. Maybe top 15 or 20. He had one good year. And it was a good one. But in 2005 he was just an average to below average CB. He was one of the worst in the league at giving up TDs and long passes.

Maybe the light came on for him in 2006. Or maybe he just had one good season. We'll see, but he is not a top 5 corner.

Hes been playing good since he got there. This didnt just happen last year.

Also I dont think hes just going to get worse.

Asante Samuel is easily a top 5 corner based on his play.

 

[theogt]

Hes been playing good since he got there. This didnt just happen last year.

Also I dont think hes just going to get worse.

Asante Samuel is easily a top 5 corner based on his play.

No, he hasn't been playing that good since he got there. He wasn't "good" in 2005. He was average to below average. About the only thing that looks good on his 2006 resume is the INT count. The rest of his metrics look pretty close to '05 -- average to below average. He gives up a lot of yards and a lot of TDs.

But if you want to go by INTs and think they're what puts him into top 5 corner status, look at his first four seasons with the Patriots and compare them to Anthony Henry's first four season with the Browns -- Henry had 17 INTs and Samuel had 16.

So. Was Henry a top 5 corner when we signed him?

 

[burmafrd]

I have to laugh at all the gomers that think INTs are what a CB is all about.

 

[CrazyCowboy]

TNew is not that bad from all I can gather.....he would start Sunday if it was the regular season

 

[dbair1967]

Newman isnt out for the yr

but we arnt trading for Samuel, nor should we

do you realize what it would cost in draft picks AND money to get him? He will want a mammoth deal, and he isnt better than Newman...we really shouldnt be paying two CB's huge dollars

David

 

[HopeCowboyFan]

Pioli and Bellichick franchised Samuel. They are willing to pay $8Million$ to retain him. They must think highly of Asante.

That said, I'm nervous to dole out LT money till he proves he is that good over time. He is a playmaker. He makes a lot of plays on the ball.

 

[HopeCowboyFan]

I have to laugh at all the gomers that think INTs are what a CB is all about.

You can laugh, but it's a big positive when you have a CB that can be a playmaker. Most of the great CB's that are in the Hall were playmakers.

TNew is a very good CB on what he does but until he starts making plays and turning the ball he will continue to be a tad short of a Pro Bowler.

 

[dbair1967]

You can laugh, but it's a big positive when you have a CB that can be a playmaker. Most of the great CB's that are in the Hall were playmakers.

TNew is a very good CB on what he does but until he starts making plays and turning the ball he will continue to be a tad short of a Pro Bowler.

when teams throw at T New as much as they do Samuel, he'll get more picks

this seems to be a hard concept for some to grasp...but if 1) you have no real pass rush and 2) QB's avoid your area like the plague, you wont get alot of picks

David

 

[theogt]

when teams throw at T New as much as they do Samuel, he'll get more picks

this seems to be a hard concept for some to grasp...but if 1) you have no real pass rush and 2) QB's avoid your area like the plague, you wont get alot of picks

David

Newman was thrown at 66 times. Samuel was thrown at 82 times. That's only 16 more attempts.

New England at 45 sacks and 105 QB hurries. Dallas had 36 sacks and 95 QB hurries. That's not really a significant different.

Samuel simply plays a very different style of play than Newman.

 

[dbair1967]

Newman was thrown at 66 times. Samuel was thrown at 82 times. That's only 16 more attempts.

New England at 45 sacks and 105 QB hurries. Dallas had 36 sacks and 95 QB hurries. That's not really a significant different.

Samuel simply plays a very different style of play than Newman.

9 more sacks is 25% more than we had...they had EONS better of a pass rush than we did, no matter how you try to spin it...especially the 2nd half of the yr

and hurries is a subjective stat, I also believe passes thrown at a player are not official stats, which means that too is subjective

David

 

[theogt]

9 more sacks is 25% more than we had...they had EONS better of a pass rush than we did, no matter how you try to spin it...especially the 2nd half of the yr

and hurries is a subjective stat, I also believe passes thrown at a player are not official stats, which means that too is subjective

David

I don't doubt that they had a better passrush, but it wasn't so much better to explain 1 vs. 10 INTs.

 

[dbair1967]

I don't doubt that they had a better passrush, but wasn't so much better to explain 1 vs. 10 INTs.

not being throw at much does though...Newman also dropped a couple of gimmees as I recall

also, Samuel had a couple picks off gratuitous bounces

David

 

[theogt]

not being throw at much does though...Newman also dropped a couple of gimmees as I recall

also, Samuel had a couple picks off gratuitous bounces

David

Newman dropping them is not an excuse, it's part of the problem. He doesn't have good hands.

And again, Samuel was only targeted 16 more times. I'm sure if he was lined up opposite of Henry, he'd be targeted less as well.

 

[TunaFan33]

not being throw at much does though...Newman also dropped a couple of gimmees as I recall

also, Samuel had a couple picks off gratuitous bounces

David

Aside from Cundiff's miss in that '05 T-Giving Broncos game, Newman dropped one that would have went for 6.

 

[HopeCowboyFan]

when teams throw at T New as much as they do Samuel, he'll get more picks

this seems to be a hard concept for some to grasp...but if 1) you have no real pass rush and 2) QB's avoid your area like the plague, you wont get alot of picks

David

Newman has not been a playmaker in his career. The greats accumulate a lot of picks and impact games .Newman is what he is a very good corner that has never made a pro bowl. He needs to step up his playmaking or he is just a very good corner that was just a tad shy of Pro Bowl material, year after year. See Greg Ellis for Exhibit A

 

[HopeCowboyFan]

when teams throw at T New as much as they do Samuel, he'll get more picks

this seems to be a hard concept for some to grasp...but if 1) you have no real pass rush and 2) QB's avoid your area like the plague, you wont get alot of picks

David

Guys like Samuel and Ty Law are instinctive playmakers that go get the ball. It's no coincidence they are 10 + interception guys recent.

Newman is a mirror CB that is very, very good but has limited ability to make interceptions or jump plays. This is becoming factual over time.

I love the denial of they are "throwing at them" and all the pick offs. Someone earlier posted stats - they all get thrown at.

 

[TunaFan33]

Guys like Samuel and Ty Law are instinctive playmakers that go get the ball. It's no coincidence they are 10 + interception guys recent.

Newman is a mirror CB that is very, very good but has limited ability to make interceptions or jump plays. This is becoming factual over time.

I love the denial of they are "throwing at them" and all the pick offs. Someone earlier posted stats - they all get thrown at.

Or maybe it was Tuna's ultra-conservative schemes?

Hey-look at D'Angelo Hall-a good corner, yes, but he has an even bigger ego. He gambles WAY too much, resulting in losing the battle alot more often than not. And Ty Law isn't all that GREAT either. Sure, he has a nose for the ball, but he gets successfully thrown at more often than not.

Pt being that it seems like in everyone's perceptions, INTs mean EVERYTHING for a CB.