CFZ No guts no glory

Blitzen

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I do not have the patience or desire or time to constantly engage in trolling/bickering with the an opposing viewpoint if there is zero chance in me or them altering viewpoints because of the argument.

I do like to see other opinions and perspectives, which is why I even spend time on the board. So please share your thoughts on the following if you can manage (apologies for a long post).

My general belief is that the Cowboys’ front office main goal as a franchise for the past 3 decades has been to ensure they do not give a “get fired” effort. I’ve worked alongside literally several hundred different people throughout my career and realize the majority out there put an effort that I would categorize as middle of the road effort when compared to the whole spectrum of workers.

Going to the extreme and working as though tomorrow could be your last is usually reserved for a business owner that really needs/desires the business to excel financially. Or for someone desperate to move forward aggressively in their career path. Neither of these profiles fit for the Jones’ family for the last 3 decades.

The big motivator for them is to not finish at the bottom of the standings routinely. That would be potentially damaging to TV ratings and general interest in the squad (which the media, league execs, and team ownership value more than big wins). The current Cowboys’ model is to ensure middle of the road to slightly above average performance.

This is the point where so many on here get into arguments about the squad. Fans are not the ones that must put in the actual extreme work to turn mediocrity into greatness. They are also not the ones risking millions of dollars because of poor or radical decisions.

I am in the category of fans that are okay with awful results in the short term for a better chance at long term great success. I understand that you cannot guarantee long term success with ANY method. I have very little interest in the squad in the current version though. This keep your nose above water at all costs approach is like watching a body slowly decay.

In my opinion, that is how the decision to extend Dak is viewed by many fans. They understand he is not the worst option (even from the staunchest trolls). They probably are like me in that the decision was essentially a front office firm decision to keep the team’s nose above water for the foreseeable future. Without him, the team runs the risk of finishing last place in the division (perhaps for several years). I do not care about that risk (as a fan). I only care about the team putting together a squad that can make a conference championship game 1-2 times a decade and at least one Super Bowl appearance in that time frame (as a fan).

Would you rather make the playoffs 6 times in one decade with 9 out of 10 years finishing above last place (no conference championship games) OR make the playoffs in only 3 years with one super bowl appearance and 1 other conference championship game (but 5 last place finishes)? I’m for the latter option if you cannot tell.
 

Ranched

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Dallas has had many "good squads" throughout the years. But, they need a decent HC/OC to take these squads to the nest level.

A young Shanahan took over the Niners a few years back & took them to the SB in his 4th season. Young McVay is both the play caller & HC for the Rams & took a horrid Goff & Stafford to SB's. Same w/Reid. Both play caller & HC. These 3 coaches, not the players, are tough to beat. Coaches are the core of a franchise & Dallas hasn't had one since Johnson.
 

Big_D

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Has Jerry’s way worked? Just staying relevant while watching other teams play every January.
 

fivetwos

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Dallas has had many "good squads" throughout the years. But, they need a decent HC/OC to take these squads to the nest level.

A young Shanahan took over the Niners a few years back & took them to the SB in his 4th season. Young McVay is both the play caller & HC for the Rams & took a horrid Goff & Stafford to SB's. Same w/Reid. Both play caller & HC. These 3 coaches, not the players, are tough to beat. Coaches are the core of a franchise & Dallas hasn't had one since Johnson.
How are you ever getting that when qualification number one through 20 for a head coach here is if he is willing to let Jerry be Jerry and be the face of the franchise and a celebrity?

Most worth their salt would pass.
 

RS12

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I do not have the patience or desire or time to constantly engage in trolling/bickering with the an opposing viewpoint if there is zero chance in me or them altering viewpoints because of the argument.

I do like to see other opinions and perspectives, which is why I even spend time on the board. So please share your thoughts on the following if you can manage (apologies for a long post).

My general belief is that the Cowboys’ front office main goal as a franchise for the past 3 decades has been to ensure they do not give a “get fired” effort. I’ve worked alongside literally several hundred different people throughout my career and realize the majority out there put an effort that I would categorize as middle of the road effort when compared to the whole spectrum of workers.

Going to the extreme and working as though tomorrow could be your last is usually reserved for a business owner that really needs/desires the business to excel financially. Or for someone desperate to move forward aggressively in their career path. Neither of these profiles fit for the Jones’ family for the last 3 decades.

The big motivator for them is to not finish at the bottom of the standings routinely. That would be potentially damaging to TV ratings and general interest in the squad (which the media, league execs, and team ownership value more than big wins). The current Cowboys’ model is to ensure middle of the road to slightly above average performance.

This is the point where so many on here get into arguments about the squad. Fans are not the ones that must put in the actual extreme work to turn mediocrity into greatness. They are also not the ones risking millions of dollars because of poor or radical decisions.

I am in the category of fans that are okay with awful results in the short term for a better chance at long term great success. I understand that you cannot guarantee long term success with ANY method. I have very little interest in the squad in the current version though. This keep your nose above water at all costs approach is like watching a body slowly decay.

In my opinion, that is how the decision to extend Dak is viewed by many fans. They understand he is not the worst option (even from the staunchest trolls). They probably are like me in that the decision was essentially a front office firm decision to keep the team’s nose above water for the foreseeable future. Without him, the team runs the risk of finishing last place in the division (perhaps for several years). I do not care about that risk (as a fan). I only care about the team putting together a squad that can make a conference championship game 1-2 times a decade and at least one Super Bowl appearance in that time frame (as a fan).

Would you rather make the playoffs 6 times in one decade with 9 out of 10 years finishing above last place (no conference championship games) OR make the playoffs in only 3 years with one super bowl appearance and 1 other conference championship game (but 5 last place finishes)? I’m for the latter option if you cannot tell.
This team has missed the playoffs 8 of the last 12 years.
 

cityochamps

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If your goal is to just make the play offs every year and you don't set your sights on the big prize at all costs your team will be called the Dallas Cowboys of the past 25 years. Jerry has never been able to see the big picture when it comes to that.
 

Runwildboys

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First, I don't think Jerry & Co. are intentionally trying to just tread water. I think they're trying to win, but they want to do it their way, thinking they know how, when they really don't. It's borderline Dunning Kruger Effect. It's not lack of effort, but lack of sense.

As for signing Dak, I was on the fence, but if a QB comes along who seems like a near sure thing, I wouldn't be averse to doing just about whatever we need to, in order to draft him, short of giving up Micah. Tank the season for someone like that?...Sure. Give up Lamb and Diggs?...Maybe. But the problem is that there's no such thing as a sure thing, especially where QBs are concerned, and I'd rather have a winning season that goes nowhere than a losing season that goes nowhere.
 

Blitzen

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First, I don't think Jerry & Co. are intentionally trying to just tread water. I think they're trying to win, but they want to do it their way, thinking they know how, when they really don't. It's borderline Dunning Kruger Effect. It's not lack of effort, but lack of sense.

As for signing Dak, I was on the fence, but if a QB comes along who seems like a near sure thing, I wouldn't be averse to doing just about whatever we need to, in order to draft him, short of giving up Micah. Tank the season for someone like that?...Sure. Give up Lamb and Diggs?...Maybe. But the problem is that there's no such thing as a sure thing, especially where QBs are concerned, and I'd rather have a winning season that goes nowhere than a losing season that goes nowhere.

My stance is that their first priority is treading water. Winning big is an ancillary prize-not a real objective.
 

john van brocklin

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I do not have the patience or desire or time to constantly engage in trolling/bickering with the an opposing viewpoint if there is zero chance in me or them altering viewpoints because of the argument.

I do like to see other opinions and perspectives, which is why I even spend time on the board. So please share your thoughts on the following if you can manage (apologies for a long post).

My general belief is that the Cowboys’ front office main goal as a franchise for the past 3 decades has been to ensure they do not give a “get fired” effort. I’ve worked alongside literally several hundred different people throughout my career and realize the majority out there put an effort that I would categorize as middle of the road effort when compared to the whole spectrum of workers.

Going to the extreme and working as though tomorrow could be your last is usually reserved for a business owner that really needs/desires the business to excel financially. Or for someone desperate to move forward aggressively in their career path. Neither of these profiles fit for the Jones’ family for the last 3 decades.

The big motivator for them is to not finish at the bottom of the standings routinely. That would be potentially damaging to TV ratings and general interest in the squad (which the media, league execs, and team ownership value more than big wins). The current Cowboys’ model is to ensure middle of the road to slightly above average performance.

This is the point where so many on here get into arguments about the squad. Fans are not the ones that must put in the actual extreme work to turn mediocrity into greatness. They are also not the ones risking millions of dollars because of poor or radical decisions.

I am in the category of fans that are okay with awful results in the short term for a better chance at long term great success. I understand that you cannot guarantee long term success with ANY method. I have very little interest in the squad in the current version though. This keep your nose above water at all costs approach is like watching a body slowly decay.

In my opinion, that is how the decision to extend Dak is viewed by many fans. They understand he is not the worst option (even from the staunchest trolls). They probably are like me in that the decision was essentially a front office firm decision to keep the team’s nose above water for the foreseeable future. Without him, the team runs the risk of finishing last place in the division (perhaps for several years). I do not care about that risk (as a fan). I only care about the team putting together a squad that can make a conference championship game 1-2 times a decade and at least one Super Bowl appearance in that time frame (as a fan).

Would you rather make the playoffs 6 times in one decade with 9 out of 10 years finishing above last place (no conference championship games) OR make the playoffs in only 3 years with one super bowl appearance and 1 other conference championship game (but 5 last place finishes)? I’m for the latter option if you cannot tell.
I feel the same way !
So did Jimmy Johnson when he tore the team down and traded Walker.
I was very excited after the 1 and 15 season because I could see light at the end of the tunnel.
I have no hope for the current team because the chief architect has proved for 27 years he does not have the ability or the skill set to assemble a Championship caliber team.
So we are adrift on the sea of mediocrity until a change at the top is made.
 

FanofJerry

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Define Glory and define the exact requirements needed to get it. Youre withholding information which leads one to believe this a phrase used to manipulate. No one should ever follow your cheesy phrase.
 
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noshame

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I used to believe Jerry wanted to win a Super Bowl at all costs he just had no clue how .
But what Jerry really loves is Jerry and as long as he can stick his ugly face in a camera he's as happy as a pig and poop

. He will go down in history as the worst owner and general manager the league has ever seen.
 

Runwildboys

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Jerry Jones' net worth is over $15 billion.

To put that amount in perspective, he could lose $1 million/day, every day, for 40 years and still be worth over $350 million.
Irrational fear is still fear.
 

xwalker

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I do not have the patience or desire or time to constantly engage in trolling/bickering with the an opposing viewpoint if there is zero chance in me or them altering viewpoints because of the argument.

I do like to see other opinions and perspectives, which is why I even spend time on the board. So please share your thoughts on the following if you can manage (apologies for a long post).

My general belief is that the Cowboys’ front office main goal as a franchise for the past 3 decades has been to ensure they do not give a “get fired” effort. I’ve worked alongside literally several hundred different people throughout my career and realize the majority out there put an effort that I would categorize as middle of the road effort when compared to the whole spectrum of workers.

Going to the extreme and working as though tomorrow could be your last is usually reserved for a business owner that really needs/desires the business to excel financially. Or for someone desperate to move forward aggressively in their career path. Neither of these profiles fit for the Jones’ family for the last 3 decades.

The big motivator for them is to not finish at the bottom of the standings routinely. That would be potentially damaging to TV ratings and general interest in the squad (which the media, league execs, and team ownership value more than big wins). The current Cowboys’ model is to ensure middle of the road to slightly above average performance.

This is the point where so many on here get into arguments about the squad. Fans are not the ones that must put in the actual extreme work to turn mediocrity into greatness. They are also not the ones risking millions of dollars because of poor or radical decisions.

I am in the category of fans that are okay with awful results in the short term for a better chance at long term great success. I understand that you cannot guarantee long term success with ANY method. I have very little interest in the squad in the current version though. This keep your nose above water at all costs approach is like watching a body slowly decay.

In my opinion, that is how the decision to extend Dak is viewed by many fans. They understand he is not the worst option (even from the staunchest trolls). They probably are like me in that the decision was essentially a front office firm decision to keep the team’s nose above water for the foreseeable future. Without him, the team runs the risk of finishing last place in the division (perhaps for several years). I do not care about that risk (as a fan). I only care about the team putting together a squad that can make a conference championship game 1-2 times a decade and at least one Super Bowl appearance in that time frame (as a fan).

Would you rather make the playoffs 6 times in one decade with 9 out of 10 years finishing above last place (no conference championship games) OR make the playoffs in only 3 years with one super bowl appearance and 1 other conference championship game (but 5 last place finishes)? I’m for the latter option if you cannot tell.

Jerry made many moves trying to go "All In" and that did not work.
- Wacky trades and huge contracts for free agents.

Starting in 2014, they began to change how they operate.
- Fans have taken this change as a move towards not trying hard to win.
- In reality, they started doing things more like a quality NFL GM would operate.
- Stephen Jones pushed to promote Will McClay to the top player evaluation job.
- SJ and McClay started developing an actual plan and method of operation instead of 'wildcatting'.
- Focus on building through the draft, stop over-paying free agents, stop pushing the cap limits to the extreme.
- Once SJ pushed Garrett out the door, everyone in football operations now report to SJ and he reports to Jerry.
- This stopped players from going directly to Jerry.
- SJ hired McCarthy & treats him like an employee that will be fired if there he does not get results instead of Jerry treating Garrett as a stepson.
- They started making bold moves to dump players like Dez instead of holding onto them way too long like Jerry had done in the past.
- They made the move that Jimmy or Belichick would have made with Amari Cooper.
- Jimmy & Belichick would never tolerate players calling out the coaches in the media.

What should they have done differently starting from January 2016?
 

Blast From The Past

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Has Jerry’s way worked? Just staying relevant while watching other teams play every January.
As long as those cash registers do not stop ringing up sales on Cowboys related stuff then just staying relevant has worked to perfection for Jerry Jones.
 

Blitzen

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Jerry made many moves trying to go "All In" and that did not work.
- Wacky trades and huge contracts for free agents.

Starting in 2014, they began to change how they operate.
- Fans have taken this change as a move towards not trying hard to win.
- In reality, they started doing things more like a quality NFL GM would operate.
- Stephen Jones pushed to promote Will McClay to the top player evaluation job.
- SJ and McClay started developing an actual plan and method of operation instead of 'wildcatting'.
- Focus on building through the draft, stop over-paying free agents, stop pushing the cap limits to the extreme.
- Once SJ pushed Garrett out the door, everyone in football operations now report to SJ and he reports to Jerry.
- This stopped players from going directly to Jerry.
- SJ hired McCarthy & treats him like an employee that will be fired if there he does not get results instead of Jerry treating Garrett as a stepson.
- They started making bold moves to dump players like Dez instead of holding onto them way too long like Jerry had done in the past.
- They made the move that Jimmy or Belichick would have made with Amari Cooper.
- Jimmy & Belichick would never tolerate players calling out the coaches in the media.

What should they have done differently starting from January 2016?

Free Agency is not all about wildcatting. You can add one or two very good players via free agency if they are substantially better options than what you currently have on the roster.

Being brutally honest about players and coaches currently on the roster and their potential longevity would be a start as would being adverse to massive risks in the second round instead of taking a player that is almost universally thought of as a solid potential starter with fewer injury and off field issues.

You mentioned 2016 specifically though my reference would be a consolidated view of the past 26 years. They should have fired Jason Garrett following 2015 (even sooner). There were several players that had higher draft value (by virtue of playing position) than Zeke. Jalen Ramsey or Deforest Bukner in the first round make way more sense. Chris Jones or Jarran Reed or Derrick Henry or even Myles Jack instead of a potentially permanently crippled Jaylon Smith (that they stupidly extended after one year of promise). I liked every single option better than who they took at the time (and I am a couch scout). Never underestimate Jerry when it’s about marketing and reclamation projects.

After 2017, the team should have had serious doubt as to what Dak’s career trajectory and how much he adds to the QB position when not given a very powerful running game to play-action off of. Also, in the following years how much he depended on his own rushing ability to deliver big plays. Could he develop into a traditional pocket passer which would allow him to have more longevity? The answer thus far is yes-if he is not facing a top 5-10 healthy defense-and an emphatic no if he is.

You would like to be able to successfully flip team assets into future round 1-3 draft picks if you are not 100 percent convinced that they are core players capable of delivering a NFCCG or SB. The team has basically avoided all big free agent contracts since Brandon Carr. Either the team has failed in developing or drafting good enough players to accomplish it or failed to successfully negotiate good trades, a Jones responsibility.

The team still had major problems in evaluating its own talent since 2016. Not every draft was a major success and the free agency strategy has been employed since they cut ties with Demarcus Ware if not before. When the current strategy finally yields a NFCCG or SB you can be sure they and you will gloat like they always knew it would work. Until then, my point rests its case.
 
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