Our last 2nd round hit was Sean Lee

[GhostOfPelluer]

Woodson was more reliable, durable, & more worthy of a 2nd pick than Lee.

Woodson was worthy of a first round pick. Let's not pretend second round guys are typically all-pros.

 

[GhostOfPelluer]

Until this year, in a league where availability is essential, Sean Lee could never really be counted on to be available.

It took until his 7th year in the NFL, at age 30, for Lee to finally have an entirely healthy season where he was fully available.

In Lee's career, he has started 61 out of a possible 112 games -- exactly 50%.

Nice player.. he played AWESOME this year... however, I don't think he is an easy slam dunk great value for where he was drafted in the 2nd round.

You are right about his availability for the first few years of his career. But it's not just this year. He's played in 29 of the past 31 games for Dallas (you can dismiss the game they sat him on purpose against Philly in Wk 17). He had some rotten luck on a couple of the injuries, but that's evened out the past two seasons.

I don't know what you expect out of a second round guy. If not for the knee issues, Lee has played like a first round guy. Given that the knee issues were real and you can't just dismiss them, second round seems like the perfect spot for him.

 

[perrykemp]

You are right about his availability for the first few years of his career. But it's not just this year. He's played in 29 of the past 31 games for Dallas (you can dismiss the game they sat him on purpose against Philly in Wk 17). He had some rotten luck on a couple of the injuries, but that's evened out the past two seasons.

I don't know what you expect out of a second round guy. If not for the knee issues, Lee has played like a first round guy. Given that the knee issues were real and you can't just dismiss them, second round seems like the perfect spot for him.

I agree with everything you just said.

My general point is IF you have to wait until Years 6 and 7 to start getting a solid return on your 2nd round investment, you can't call the pick a home run.

 

[GhostOfPelluer]

I agree with everything you just said.

My general point is IF you have to wait until Years 6 and 7 to start getting a solid return on your 2nd round investment, you can't call the pick a home run.

He also played well in 2011 and 2013, but I understand your point. Delayed returns and all, I'd take Lee over Gregory and Escobar though. I can't criticize the Lee pick is what I'm saying. There are enough real second round busts to criticize.

 

[perrykemp]

He also played well in 2011 and 2013, but I understand your point. Delayed returns and all, I'd take Lee over Gregory and Escobar though. I can't criticize the Lee pick is what I'm saying. There are enough real second round busts to criticize.

My favorite Cowboy (I think). Love the player.

 

[GhostOfPelluer]

My favorite Cowboy (I think). Love the player.

I agree. I've never bought a jersey because I work in media (I don't ask for autographs either) but if I bought one it would be Lee. The guy has overcome so much to become such a beast. I really admire the player he's made himself into.

 

[xwalker]

We've designated the second round to gambling on injured players, drug addicts and TEs we can't use, instead of making smart safe picks like we have in the first round. If we would approach the second round like we have the first round, we could have a solid defense to compliment our offense. Compare all the first round hits we've had the last several years to all the misses in the second round. Practically all the hits have been on the offensive side of the ball, except for Lee. There can't be many teams in the league that have missed on more second round picks the past decade than the Cowboys.

If that was their 4th round strategy, I would be all in, but in the 2nd round they should be able to get high quality players without gambles.

In the 4th through 7th I like the idea of gambling on high upside players. They could be character/drug, injury risk or other risks like Basketball players as long as they have high upsides if they overcome their issues. Actually, I would prefer drug risk types over injury risk types. We've seen guys like Honey Badger come to the NFL and not have any drug related issues. Taking high character, low upside players like Caleb McSurdy seems pointless to me.

 

[KJJ]

If that was their 4th round strategy, I would be all in, but in the 2nd round they should be able to get high quality players without gambles.

In the 4th through 7th I like the idea of gambling on high upside players. They could be character/drug, injury risk or other risks like Basketball players as long as they have high upsides if they overcome their issues. Actually, I would prefer drug risk types over injury risk types. We've seen guys like Honey Badger come to the NFL and not have any drug related issues. Taking high character, low upside players like Caleb McSurdy seems pointless to me.

A lot of starters/great players have been found in the second round and we used a "high" second round pick on a player coming off a serious injury that cost him his rookie season. The strategy in the second round has been to draft first round talent that's fallen due to injury or off the field/drug concerns in hopes of coming up with a great player and so far that strategy has failed with only Lee panning out. Gamble with lower picks not premium picks.

 

[Nightman]

It was a (probably bad) joke bro.

If I wanted to do drugs, I'd do them regardless. I don't, so I don't.

I was making a point that was obviously missed.

Didn't mean to sound harsh or personal....just kind of a pet peeve

These guys got life by the balls and throw it all away

 

[AsthmaField]

Didn't mean to sound harsh or personal....just kind of a pet peeve

These guys got life by the balls and throw it all away

It's all good bro. I agree

 

[LocimusPrime]

Sorry I was eating a milkey way

 

[FuzzyLumpkins]

I always love it when people manufacture something to complain about.

 

[Manwiththeplan]

What makes you say that? Assuming he can even stay clean to come back from a suspension.

Yea, I don't understand why anyone would have faith in Gregory outside of blind optimism

 

[Manwiththeplan]

Until this year, in a league where availability is essential, Sean Lee could never really be counted on to be available.

It took until his 7th year in the NFL, at age 30, for Lee to finally have an entirely healthy season where he was fully available.

In Lee's career, he has started 61 out of a possible 112 games -- exactly 50%.

Nice player.. he played AWESOME this year... however, I don't think he is an easy slam dunk great value for where he was drafted in the 2nd round.

Two things, If you are making a point about Lee's availability, why would you lump his 14 games played as a reserve with his unavailable games? It would be far more accurate to say Sean Lee has played in 75 out of a possible 112.

Also 56 would be exactly 50% of 112 not 61

 

[KJJ]

I always love it when people manufacture something to complain about.

Not difficult to manufacture something to complain about with our second round picks, they've been pretty bad the past decade which is a big reason our defense continues to have the same issues year after year. We've wasted #2 picks on TEs that could have gone on defense and we've thrown away #2s on injured players and one with a drug problem. Our last couple of #2 picks which were on the defensive side of the ball have made no impact and one is already finished. We've made smart, safe picks with our #1s which has helped us build a championship caliber offense and have gambled our #2s on injured players, drug addicts and TEs we can't use that have resulted in a mediocre defense that keeps getting us beat in the playoffs.

 

[Thomas82]

Don't give up on Gregory yet, he should be fine in a few years when he gets back from suspension

I really believe he played his last down for the Cowboys.

 

[Hoofbite]

That's one way to look at it. Another way of looking at it is:

2010: Lee Is a home run
2011: Bruce Carter--serviceable player who played out his contract with us, and played in the NFL after he departed from the team
2012: MO Trade up: Mo isnt an all pro but he stuck for 5 years on the team and was a solid player for most of the time he was healthy
2013: Gavin Escobar-- stuck on the roster his entire rookie contract--but based on his production we will call that one a mostly bust
2014: DeMarcus Lawrence: He hasn't been a cut and has performed ok at some times. Talent seems ok, but health has not.
2015: Randy Gregory. Total Miss. Bust. End of Story.
2016: Jaylon Smith: Redshirt rookie year. Too early to tell on this pick.

Really the only true outright bust is Gregory and that's probably not based on ability but the fact that he is a knuckle head. Gavin Escobar is probably also a bust even though he has made it through his entire rookie contract but I could see him sticking in the NFL for some time provided that they don't ask him to block.

I'm not sure why they didn't trade Escobar. I am also not sure why Escobar still can't block at all after sever years in an NFL weight training program. I guess he just has the wrong body type. They really drafted a player that they really didn't use at all.

"Stuck" AKA having a fully guaranteed rookie contract simply for being a top pick. They declined the 5th year option and offered him a 1-year deal worth less than what Minnesota gave 38-year-old Terence Newman for his 1-year agreement in 2016. Suited up half the time, and aside from the half season he played in 2016 he really wasn't any good. If it weren't for the Roy Williams trade, the trade for Claiborne would probably be the worst trade the team has ever made.

That said, I'd offer him another deal. It would be heavily contingent on playing time. Base salary not much higher than this year, and per-game bonuses that, in total, could push his earnings up to that of a respectable starter. He did look better this year, but it doesn't help anyone if he's on the sideline.

 

[Hoofbite]

Escobar is probably the least rational pick of the bunch and has been a complete waste. While Claiborne is easily the biggest waste of resources and Gregory looks to be the one who will yield the least, strictly from the perspective of strategizing and developing an action plan, Escobar is hands down the least logical pick the team has made.

They failed with Bennett because when he was on the field (maybe half the teams snaps), he was blocking on like 60% of his snaps. They never established him as a receiving threat even though his post-Dallas play has clearly demonstrated he can be. He's more or less matched his cumulative production in Dallas in a single season 3 times since leaving. This failure of course coming on the heels of bailing on Fasano in a short course of time because Fasano apparently wasn't versatile enough in the passing game. Fasano, of course, went on to produce well enough to prove that he would have been just fine as the #2 TE.

Bennett 2008 - 2011: 130 Receptions, 846 Yards, 4 TDs
Fasano 2008 - 2011: 220 Receptions, 1,772 Yards, 18 TDs
​

Dallas fails to utilize Bennett in the exact manner they drafted him for. Not an entire loss because he could block which allowed the team to utilize their 6 OL formation most of the time Bennett was in the game so at least they had that going for then. But, just when you thought it couldn't get worse they again go for a TE who can finally fulfill this receiving threat from the #2 TE position that they've so desperately seeking. This time however, their prized TE cannot block. Likely one of the weaker guys of his size in the NFL and more importantly you'd probably be hard pressed to find another player in the league who is as timid as Gavin. Chris Jones is more willing to lay a hit on someone than Escobar. If Gavin were to ever get the best of someone and lay the wood on them, he'd probably apologize afterward.

 

[GhostOfPelluer]

Escobar has never come around as a blocker and that's a bit of a disappointment but he's a freak athletically. He has the physical skills to be dynamic in the passing game. The problem is he can't read defenses on the fly and the QB can't count on him to be where he's supposed to.

At least Fasano was decent. Martellus was a bit of a malcontent but was a great blocker and has shown he can be a weapon in the passing game since he left. Escobar just never panned out. Definitely a wasted pick.

 

[Bullflop]

This organization seriously needs to reconsider whatever it is that they've been doing to blow so many 2nd round picks. I had read in the past that the rest of the staff gave Jerry his big chance to contribute by allowing him the 2nd round pick to do so. Not sure if that's 100% true or not but something needs to change. If it's really so, they'd best lock him in a broom closet and proceed, undaunted by any perceived shame.