Our pass rush is putrid

[Royal Laegotti]

I can't remember exactly, but pressure by Ware led to one of the picks for a TD or the one in OT. I'm thinking it was the one Lee took back. Ware pushed the OT right in Manning's face.

I watched "The Blitz" last night and they showed 3 of the 4 picks and pressure wasn't a factor in any of those and of course they showed both pick 6's. Manning was just awful yesterday or his young receivers were by running wrong routes.

 

[Doomsday101]

I see some complaining about the secondary, who BTW picked off 4 passes, if you want to count a LB in coverage as secondary. As awful as they were save the picks. I have to think they would be better if the D-line would've ever gotten close to Manning. Maybe I'm wrong but I can't remember them even knocking him down after a pass much less getting pressure or getting a sack. Where's the pass rush? Was Ware or Spencer even out there? I put that on them as much as the secondary.

All in all glad they won though!

Manning has only been sacked 13 times this season the man gets rid of the ball so if you are expecting a sacks vs the colts don't hold your breath.

 

[basstapp]

maybe they need to move ratliff to DE this year on ware's side and see if we can get production that way. The season is a lost cause, but teams won't prepare for that and move brent inside at NT

 

[Venger]

Front four just sucks. That's why Wade had to blitz so much (to no success) because the regular four guys can't get pressure. I've said it before but we miss Ellis and Canty, and so does Ware.

THIS. IN CAPS.

Ware is a monster out there, but he's the ONLY monster. Did you see him toss that Colts lineman aside like a used condom? Problem is there is always a second blocker there. He still was forcing the tempo on Manning quite often.

But he gets NO HELP. When Ellis was here, we had two outstanding outside pass rushers. Ellis unleashed Ware, and Ware made Ellis better.

If anyone actually WATCHES Ware, every play, all game, only Stevie Wonder couldn't see the guy is simply great out there.

If Ware had to rush against the Cowboys OL, he'd have 5 sacks a game.

 

[goshan]

He is playing pretty good, but he is hardly 'a monster'.

 

[Stautner]

I have to laugh when people keep talking about how impossible it is to get a pass rush when only rushing 4 people. I wonder how they think 4-3 defenses get their pass rush?

Sure the more people rushing the better a team's chances of getting to the QB, but sometimes players just have to beat their man one on one. If the only chance they have to beat their man is through a stunt or throwing in too many blitzers for the offense to handle, then they just aren't good pass rushers.

The bottom line is that our pass rush is almost non-existent, whether we rush 4 or 5 men, and you can't just chalk it up to the unwillingness of the defensive coordinaotor tho throw everything but the kitchen sink at the pass rush.

 

[joseephuss]

Ware has 74 sacks since joining the NFL in 2005. This is his 6th season. Over that same time span Dwight Freeney has 52 sacks. After Freeney completed his 6th season he had 60 sacks. I think Freeney is a great pass rusher.

 

[Kevinicus]

I watched "The Blitz" last night and they showed 3 of the 4 picks and pressure wasn't a factor in any of those and of course they showed both pick 6's. Manning was just awful yesterday or his young receivers were by running wrong routes.

Rewatch the one Scandrick took back. Ware is right there.

http://i110.***BLOCKED***/albums/n114/ChldsPlay/waremanning.jpg

And Ware was about to sack him on the Lee one as well.

http://i110.***BLOCKED***/albums/n114/ChldsPlay/waremanning2.jpg

 

[Doomsday]

DeMarcus Ware has absolutely 0 motor. It was pathetic watching him today.

What game are you watching? Ware was getting decent pressure from the out side but Manning had such a big pocket he was able to step up and avoid his rush all game. That is on Ratliff and others. I thought it was stupid that we didnt try to send any pressure up the middle the entire game. Not to mention that on 2 of Manning's interceptions, Ware was about 1/2 second away from sacking him.

I love Ratliff but we need a big strong NT that can collapse the pocket, if we had any sort of push up the middle Manning would of had a long day.

 

[RoyTheHammer]

Rewatch the one Scandrick took back. Ware is right there.

http://i110.***BLOCKED***/albums/n114/ChldsPlay/waremanning.jpg

And Ware was about to sack him on the Lee one as well.

http://i110.***BLOCKED***/albums/n114/ChldsPlay/waremanning2.jpg

The Lee one was pressured a little. The first one here Manning could have just stepped up and had much more time. He had already chosen to throw it though.

 

[Marktui]

Ware is sooo bloody overrated it's not funny...if he had half Freeney's motor he would have two sacks a game. I'm not even gonna start with Spencer, he just flat out sucks...can't understand what's happend to both of them.

Ware cannot do it by himself. He is a good pass rusher. He needs other guys to step up and get pressure on the qb. He provides a rush from the outside, if the guys up the middle could collapse the middle of the pocket and flush the qb's Ware might get more sacks.

He was wearing some sort of cast on his hand also, so it looked like it limited his use of his left hand.

I think he needs to be used in the similar style to Clay Matthews, Capers always has some overload or blitz package for him to get maximum pressure on the qb.

 

[Marktui]

I have to laugh when people keep talking about how impossible it is to get a pass rush when only rushing 4 people. I wonder how they think 4-3 defenses get their pass rush?

Sure the more people rushing the better a team's chances of getting to the QB, but sometimes players just have to beat their man one on one. If the only chance they have to beat their man is through a stunt or throwing in too many blitzers for the offense to handle, then they just aren't good pass rushers.

The bottom line is that our pass rush is almost non-existent, whether we rush 4 or 5 men, and you can't just chalk it up to the unwillingness of the defensive coordinaotor tho throw everything but the kitchen sink at the pass rush.

The Giants do it all day long with their front four. Our problem is Ware is the only great pass rusher we have. The key to having a great pass rush is being able to beat one on one battles. Ware is really the only one that can do it consistently. And if you cannot beat the one on one battles, bull rush up the middle creates a lot of pressure. None of our DT's can do that right now.

 

[Kevinicus]

The Lee one was pressured a little. The first one here Manning could have just stepped up and had much more time. He had already chosen to throw it though.

If you watch it in motion, Ware got up on him pretty fast. Manning thought he had more time than he did because Ware looked blocked, but he powered the guy back pretty quick. At the point of the pic I showed, Ware and the OL are going more horizontal than vertical. Also Spencer (I think) was moving his guy as well.

 

[Doomsday]

I have to laugh when people keep talking about how impossible it is to get a pass rush when only rushing 4 people. I wonder how they think 4-3 defenses get their pass rush?

I agree last season when Ratliff and Spencer were playing at a high level our defense was playing lights out. This year neither one has been getting much if any pressure on the QB and our pass rush is non existent.

 

[burmafrd]

Spencer has been maybe the biggest Disapointment this year outside of Jenkins.

 

[Hook'em#11]

The WHOLE defense sucks.

And they have sucked for a while now.

Blow it up.

 

[joseephuss]

Rewatch the one Scandrick took back. Ware is right there.

http://i110.***BLOCKED***/albums/n114/ChldsPlay/waremanning.jpg

And Ware was about to sack him on the Lee one as well.

http://i110.***BLOCKED***/albums/n114/ChldsPlay/waremanning2.jpg

The OT blocking Ware was pushed back into Manning on the Lee interception. The OT hit Manning's plant leg during the throw. This contact with the OT prevented Manning from putting everything into that throw. That pressure goes to Ware.

On the final interception, Manning had to step up away from pressure and then try to throw the ball kind of while hopping in the air. He didn't get to step into the throw because of the pressure.

 

[Stautner]

The Giants do it all day long with their front four. Our problem is Ware is the only great pass rusher we have. The key to having a great pass rush is being able to beat one on one battles. Ware is really the only one that can do it consistently. And if you cannot beat the one on one battles, bull rush up the middle creates a lot of pressure. None of our DT's can do that right now.

I agree with most of this, but I can't even say Ware can do it consistently. Ware was very successful for a couple of years while relying on his pure athleticism and speed, but at this point team know he is a one dimensional pass rusher - he relies almost exclusevilly on his speed move to the outside, and OT's are more prepared to deal with that now. Ware is getting a lot more 1 on 1 blocking than he used to, but he is having less success than he used to.

 

[burmafrd]

The other teams are also making sure he is chipped a lot as well. I do think Ware needs to work on his game, but he is nowhere near as bad as some numbies claim.

 

[Stautner]

The other teams are also making sure he is chipped a lot as well. I do think Ware needs to work on his game, but he is nowhere near as bad as some numbies claim.

I certainly don't think he is bad - those who go to that extreme or just part of the increasing group of people that tend to overexaggerate everything. Ware is unquestinoably a good player, but he is probably not at the level many wanted to put him at early on. If, somehow, he could develop different moves and learn to find different ways to get to the QB rather than just the outside speed rush he can again reach some pretty impressive levels.