Prince Jonathan Taylor

Discussion in 'NFL Zone' started by RaZon, Nov 3, 2021.

  1. RonWashington

    RonWashington Well-Known Member

    2,668 Messages
    1,940 Likes Received
    Like I said if Taylor “ survives “ the wear and tear of these way too long NFL seasons overtakes # 22 in total rushing yards not average yards per carry bro and gets those shiny SB rings ( 3 of them ) and goes on Dancing with the Stars and wins then get back to me .
     
  2. RonnieT24

    RonnieT24 Well-Known Member

    7,826 Messages
    11,854 Likes Received
    I watched a good bit of that game.. I'm not really sure why Reich refused to use him more.. he had like 8 carries for 60 yards on one drive in the 4th quarter but was held in check beside that one drive. I don't know if I should credit the Tampa defense of Frank Reich for that. I don't know what possessed him to think that he should keep putting the game on Wentz's shoulders .. They got a 10 point lead on his arm but started the second half with TWENTY STRAIGHT PASSES CALLED! You have the NFL's leading rusher in your backfield and that's how you choose to protect a 10 point lead? Wentz rewarded his faith with a sack fumble and an INT on consecutive drives. Tampa scored TDs off both turnovers and that was pretty much ballgame.. Idiot coaching loses more games than good coaching wins..
     
  3. joseephuss

    joseephuss Well-Known Member

    26,959 Messages
    5,864 Likes Received
    Yep, getting over 4000 rushing attempts in the NFL is the easiest thing in the world. That is why he is the only person to get that many carries. Only 10 running backs have over 3000 career rushing attempts in the NFL. Only 25 have over 2500 career rushing attempts. Stop trying to diminish Emmitt Smith just to promote Taylor. This young man is off to a good start in his career. Give him props instead of trying to give him a stupid nickname.
     
    RonWashington likes this.
  4. RonnieT24

    RonnieT24 Well-Known Member

    7,826 Messages
    11,854 Likes Received
    LOL!.. that's a good one.. First of all the man's name is Emmitt .. Why you insist on misspelling his name is a mystery to me. Secondly Emmitt joined a team that had gone 1-15 the year before he showed up and had run for 1400 yards as a team .. Taylor on the other hand joined a team that had gone 7-9 and rushed for 2130 yards the year before he showed up. Marlon Mack rushed for 1091 yards behind that line.. Taylor "improved" on that by 78 yards? Whee.. Oh and the ream's rushing yards actually went down in 2020 vs 2019. The Cowboys leading rusher in 1989 was Paul Palmer and his 449 yards.. Emmitt improved upon that by almost 500 yards.. He also helped improve their win total by 6 games from 1-15 to 7-9. By comparison with Taylor the Colts improved 4 games from 7-9 to 11-5. Suffice it to say Emmitt came into a vastly inferior situation and made a greater impact than has Taylor. It should also be pointed out that they Cowboys spent a good portion of the 1990 season not fully utilizing Emmitt. He had 2 carries in the opener and 6 carries in game 2. He didn't get to 20 carries until game 5 or 6. I think some of that was punishment for his signing late and maybe some was him not being in game shape.. but the bottom line is that had they simply put the ball in his hands sooner he would have piled up more yards and they likely would have piled up more wins.. Taylor's a great young back.. but he's got a ways to go before I start calling him better than Emmitt. Bigger and faster? Sure.. better? He's gonna need another 15,000 yards or so before I go there.
     
  5. RaZon

    RaZon Well-Known Member

    3,913 Messages
    2,730 Likes Received
    Ah.....you are in my thread, so.....get back to you....hahahaha!!!!!

    JT is simply a better runner, really just that simple.
     
  6. RaZon

    RaZon Well-Known Member

    3,913 Messages
    2,730 Likes Received
    As you know JT put up far better stats at the NCAA level. I know....college?

    He had a 5 yard average as an NFL rookie, Emmitt a weak...3.9.

    In that second season JT will once again put up better numbers.

    This isn't going to stop, JT is the superior runner, he can score from anywhere.

    Drop the everything Cowboys must be the best and deal with reality, ok?
     
  7. RonnieT24

    RonnieT24 Well-Known Member

    7,826 Messages
    11,854 Likes Received
    Okay how about this reality then.. In his second season Emmitt's team went from 7 wins to 11.. meaning his team improved by 10 games from the year before he came to year two. Meanwhile Taylor's team went from 11 his first year and is heading for a drop to 9 or 10 in his second. It's fine that you like him.. but stats never tell the full story.. Emmitt was the engine that drove three Super Bowl championship teams.. A team that had a horrible record in games he missed or did not finish.. They were like 2-8 in those situations .. Like I have always, when someone runs for more yards and scores more TDs than Emmitt did then I will concede they are better.. It's never JUST about numbers .. but Emmitt's numbers dwarf Taylor's.. Yes he's off to a nice start to his career.. Let's check back on him in about 15000 yards and 140 more TDs before we start declaring him better than Emmitt. If he gets there I will be happy to honor his achievement.. But lots of guys have started out like a house afire and fizzled after a couple three good seasons. Some have even kept producing at a high level for a decade like AP.. but no one has gotten where Emmitt got to.. Until that happens, they're all looking up at him.. and that includes Taylor.. THAT, my friend.. is reality.
     
  8. RaZon

    RaZon Well-Known Member

    3,913 Messages
    2,730 Likes Received
    Love reality, let's have some...

    Emmitt had a monster MONSTER offensive line, he had a HOF QB, HOF WR so defenses couldn't just zero in on Emmitt like the Buc's did on Taylor Sunday.

    Dude, I have seen Emmitt play just as many games as you have he is not the runner JT is, that is why he always averages less. You know how many long runs JT already has?

    I get you love Emmitt, Zeke so go for it, but neither one of them had the NCAA numbers Taylor had and neither one of them more impressive starting out. Emmitt averaged 3.9 as a rookie, JT 5.0.

    That is reality, now JT could start doing TV, lose interest, get fat and slow but as of right now he looks like the best RB in football and a future great.
     
  9. RonnieT24

    RonnieT24 Well-Known Member

    7,826 Messages
    11,854 Likes Received
    Yet with all that all world talent the Cowboys were a .250 team without him.. You can love JT all you want.. but 25 games into his career and he's already better than the all time leader? That dawg won't hunt. Zeke led the NFL in rushing his rookie season and averaged 5.1 ypc and over 100 yards per game.. While scoring 15 rushing TDs.. Sorry but that's a might better than what Taylor did his rookie season.. by a fairly sizeable margin.. But I know what you're going to say.. It was the line, not Zeke.. right?
     
  10. RaZon

    RaZon Well-Known Member

    3,913 Messages
    2,730 Likes Received
    Yep, Zeke had a stud rookie season, in his second....4.1 average, less than a 1000. So in his first two seasons, JT more impressive, he will average over 5 in both and score more.

    Look my man, both Emmitt and Zeke are great, that isn't a debate, but neither of them were close to JT in college and neither of them more impressive in their first two NFL seasons.

    Are you saying that isn't true?

    Look, JT has legit big time speed, something Emmitt and Zeke never had, that is a fact. He is just as big and physical, so why fight this. Will he play as long as Emmitt, maybe not, but I guarantee this his average per carry will be superior ro Emmitt and Zeke just like it is right now.

    Let me ask you this....

    What RB do you think was superior to Emmitt?
     
  11. RonWashington

    RonWashington Well-Known Member

    2,668 Messages
    1,940 Likes Received
    Emmitt suited up game after game year after year and gave the Cowboys that running threat that balanced the offense. Jonathan Taylor in the early stages of a career who knows how long he lasts. It’s not a serious discussion to compare these 2 .

    I’m talking strictly NFL not NCAA not Gainesville High school not pop Warner strictly the NFL.
     
  12. RaZon

    RaZon Well-Known Member

    3,913 Messages
    2,730 Likes Received
    Funny how it works, those who were the best in pop Warner, Gainesvile High school, NCAA, are also the best in the NFL.

    Look Emmitt played a long long times so props for longevity, but when it comes to actual running ability he isn't on Taylor's level, not as fast, not as powerful, not as elusive. That is why he was averaging 4 while Taylor averages 5.

    Yes Taylor won't play what 16 years, so Emmitt is safe as far as leading rusher goes yards wise.

    Stud




    Emmitt's last nine seasons he never averaged over 4.2 a season.
     
    Last edited: Nov 30, 2021
  13. RonnieT24

    RonnieT24 Well-Known Member

    7,826 Messages
    11,854 Likes Received
    You know better than to post this.. You are the one who posted the list of the all time leading rushers in college history.. So you know the guy at the top of that list never played a down in the NFL.. You also know that the guy sitting at #2 on that list was a JAG in the NFL.. In fact of the guys on that top 10 all time list in the NCAA the only one who was ever considered "the best in the NFL" was Dorsett. The rest were "okay" but Cedric Benson, Travis Prentice, Royce Freeman, Ron Dayne, Donnel Pumphrey, Charles White, Ricky Williams and Deangelo Williams will get into the NFL Hall of Fame the same way you and I do.. they will have to buy a ticket..

    I don't know what your issue is with Emmitt.. He was one of the 2 or 3 best football players I have ever seen. He could do everything.. run inside, run outside, pass protect, catch the ball, make people miss in a phone booth, break tackles, serve hotdogs at halftime.. You name it and he could do it as well as anybody. No he never had long speed.. Who cares? If long speed were important the guys at the top of the NFL all time rushing list would all be sprinters.. Payton wasn't.. Emmitt obviously wasn't.. Frank Gore wasn't.. The first fast guy on the list is Sanders.. and even he was more of a short area burst guy than long speedster.. but he was faster than those other three.. AP was probably the fastest of all of them.. but he gained fewer yards in his career.. Go figure.. Curtis Martin was not fast.. Neither was Bettis.. Tomlinson, Dickerson and Dorsett.. yes of course.. But again.. all those speedsters are looking up at Emmitt, Sweetness and Gore.. neither of whom ever broke 4.5 in the 40. Might it be that there is more to running the football than just being fast?
     
    Last edited: Dec 1, 2021
  14. RonnieT24

    RonnieT24 Well-Known Member

    7,826 Messages
    11,854 Likes Received
    I think all the guys who ran for more yards and scored more touchdowns than Emmitt were superior..
     
  15. RaZon

    RaZon Well-Known Member

    3,913 Messages
    2,730 Likes Received
    I have no issues with Emmitt we were lucky to have him, he was a great great RB. Like you said he could do it all, and did do it all for a long time. Great player, But he was no Barry Sanders, Walter Payton, Gale Sayers, Jim Brown, Eric Dickerson, O.J.Simpson, Earl Campbell, Adrian Peterson and the only reason he has all those yards is he played longer than those guys. Yes yes he is in my top 10 all time just not above those I listed.

    I put a lot into average per carry, that really is what matters and says it all so ya gained 200 yards in 40 carries so what, how about 15 carries? Emmitt just didn't average what those I mentioned did, the reason.....not overly speedy.

    There have been thousands of RB's in the NFL for Emmitt to be in a top 10, not bad at all.
     
  16. RonnieT24

    RonnieT24 Well-Known Member

    7,826 Messages
    11,854 Likes Received
    I don't subscribe to the notion that there has to be a single "best ever" anyway. I firmly believe there has been more than one guy in the history of football who COULD have done what Emmitt did.. But they didn't.. They all got to play in the same league he did, many in far more run heavy eras than he did.. yet they all accomplished less. At some point you have to acknowledge the greatness of the football player and quit worrying about this one thing vs that one thing.. When taken as a whole the only RB in NFL history who was on Emmitt's level as a complete football player was Payton. Sure there has been a ton of guys with superior physical gifts.. Big whoop.. It's football not track and field and not a pose off at Mr. Olympia.. I believe that's why in addition to getting more yards and more TDs than everybody on that list Emmitt also played on more championship teams than all the guys on that list combined. And again we know he played on a loaded team.. a team that went 2-6 without him during his career. Like I said.. acknowledge the football player.. The whole football player.. and what he did/does for his team. In his first six seasons the Cowboys went 7-9, 11-5, 13-3, 12-4, 12-4, 12-4 ..
    That's 67-29. With Emmitt they were 67-25. Without him they were 0-4. Same all star laden roster.. went from winning 70% of its games to 0-4 without that one guy. Without Troy I believe they were something like 8-3. Without Mike it was like 4-2. Don't quote me on the exact numbers because it has been a couple of years since I did the research but I believe that's the ballpark. Without Emmitt.. 0-4.. You do the math.. I get that Emmitt's running style was not sexy or flashy.. I get that he did not create as many highlights as some others.. But he played winning football.. he moved the chains and made the defense honor the run for four quarters and it really didn't slow down until he started to get old.. Until he got old he was able to carry that team on his back on many occasions.. He was the best short yardage and goal line runner I've ever seen. His knack for making guys miss in tight spaces was almost magical. Feel free to place whichever all time great above him you like.. That is your prerogative. As for me the only guys I put above him are the guys who gained more yards and scored more TDs..
     
  17. RaZon

    RaZon Well-Known Member

    3,913 Messages
    2,730 Likes Received
    So you put Frank Gore ahead of Jim Brown, Barry Sanders, Eric Dickerson, O.J.Simpson, Adrian Peterson, Earl Campbell because he gained more yards? That is what you are saying with Emmitt. All about most yards gained and TD's.

    I saw Emmitt play many many times, I have also seen everyone from Jim Brown at Syracuse. And I am a Cowboys fan so why would a Cowboys fan not yipppppeeee Emmitt.? Emmitt had way too many 3-5 yards runs where he didn't confront a tackler, that monstrous line had too much to do with his success. Imagine Barry Sanders behind that line.

    Emmitt had more carries than anyone that is why he has all those yards, hell.....4,2 average is nothing special, Barry over 5 a carry.

    I get it ya like Emmitt Smith, ok cool and the hell with keeping it real, ya simply like him, so go for it.

    Emmitt had 4409 carries, Barry had 3062, hell yes he's going to have more yards he had over 1000 more carries. Emmitt was no Barry Sanders simply a fact. Barry never had any season averaging less than 4.3 a carry behind that weak Lions line. Emmtt rarely averaged 4.3, try 4 seasons.

    Emmitts last nine Season averages

    3.7
    4.1
    4.2
    4.2
    4.1
    3.9
    3.8
    2,8
    3,4

    Barry

    5.1
    4.5
    4,3
    4.6
    5.7
    4.8
    5.1
    6.1
    4.3

    That doesn't tell ya something, hell, Emmitt behind that Lions line, ouch!!!!!!!!!

    Give Emmitt the same amount of carries as Barry, now what?
     
    Last edited: Dec 1, 2021
  18. RaZon

    RaZon Well-Known Member

    3,913 Messages
    2,730 Likes Received
    Ran out of time above.

    Tomlinson has 162 TD's Emmitt 175, but LT played in a 1000 less games.

    Come on my man, yep Emmitt was one of the greats, but nowhere close to being the greatest. Whoa whoa.......major props for longevity that does matter.

    Curious why he did stay that long, hmmm?

    Jim Brown 8 time All Pro, 8 seasons averaging 4.5 or better, there is the best ever. 5.2 career average, imagine if he'd had over 4000 carries instead of his less than 2400.
     
    Last edited: Dec 1, 2021
  19. RonnieT24

    RonnieT24 Well-Known Member

    7,826 Messages
    11,854 Likes Received
    Nope.. because Gore scored a lot fewer TDs than most of those guys... and helped his team win zero championships and was never much of a receiver.. He never led the NFL in rushing and was only top 5 once.. So no he cannot rank ahead of guys who were more dominant just because he played longer. However Emmitt not only played longer but he was dominant for a 6-7 year stretch.. including multiple championship runs.. Again.. I grade the whole football player.. I put it all into the equation.. Rushing yards, receiving yards, TDs, time leading the league .. and yes.. longevity must be included. And the fact that Emmitt and Payton were the only ones on this list who were A level blockers just seals it. Football players.. Period.

    The "Barry had a weak line" story is as tired as it is inaccurate.. Barry didn't hit the hole when they opened them. That's why he was escorted to the sideline in short yardage and goal line situations. That's the main reason he scored FIFTY FEWER RUSHING TOUCHDOWNS than Emmitt did. I suspect not being asked to bang it in on three tries from the 5 yard line also helped keep his average high. His running style was wonderful to watch.. but most of his linemen found it hell to block for. You keep harping on yards per carry.. Would you trade a higher yards per carry for 50% more touchdowns? Most coaches would.. I certainly would as well. YMMV. On a side note, Barry's best season came when Bobby Ross put him in the I and ran him on more traditional power run plays instead of all that run n shoot shotgun draw business. Barry was great at it.. But it came at a price.. I believe those two seasons were the two highest carry totals of his career. He took a beating running inside that much.. and I think that as much as anything helped him decide to hang 'em up. He didn't have the same desire as some other backs did.. So he quit.. I am not inclined to lionize (no pun intended) for that.
     
  20. RonnieT24

    RonnieT24 Well-Known Member

    7,826 Messages
    11,854 Likes Received
    Emmitt stayed in the game because he loved the game.. Some guys don't and that's fine.. but guys who don't want it SHOULD quit and they SHOULD get dinged for it. Brown and Sanders included. Though Brown gets more of a pass because he actually could make more money acting than he ever was going to totin the rock.. so him I understand.. And those 2400 carries he had were all physical as hell and we know it took a toll on him.. That's why he's been walking with a cane for 30 years.. 4000 carries might have left him crippled by age 40.. You never know.. Emmitt didn't take that kind of beating.. He was a master at avoiding major collisions.. but eventually even his body broke down and he will pay the price for his "sins" at some point too.

    The discussion of Brown reminded me of that ridiculous "challenge" between him and Franco Harris when Harris looked like he might hang around long enough to pass Brown.. remember when Brown challenged Franco to a 40? I think the stakes were if Brown won Harris had to retire and not break his record ..something like that.. In any case neither guy was able to break 5.0 in the 40 as I recall. Brown was like 48 at the time while Franco was like 34.. Brown even threatened to come out of retirement to extend his record or some such.. Of course all that talk died down when he clocked a 5.7 in the 40 and lost badly to a pudgy Franco Harris who ran 5.2. To put that in perspective.. I was 35 when I ran my PR at 100 meters which was 10.5. At the time I was also still able to run sub 4.4 in the 40. But I had never taken a single NFL hit.. So my body was in much better shape to run fast than those two..


    I found the link to the reports on their "competition."

    https://www.latimes.com/archives/la-xpm-1985-01-19-sp-8178-story.html

    Hilarious..
     

Share This Page