Question about Garrett

[Idgit]

I don't either. He hasn't developed into a complete offensive coordinator so I don't see how you reward him by letting him sit in the big chair. He's in over his head now, how much worse would it be then?

In my opinion, there's one man who can get this thing fixed before the current window of opportunity closes - Bill Cowher.

Cowher assembled quality staffs of skilled coaches for years in Pittsburgh and I have every reason to believe that he would do the same in Dallas.

His 'coaching tree' is an impressive list of qualified coaches and I feel that the next staff he assembles could maximize what is currently a talented, but underachieveing roster.

He would maintain continuity with the current 3-4 defense, and would place a needed emphasis on the running game as well.

I think any other coach wouled likely experience growing pains and the team may take several steps back before they took the necessary steps forward. By that time, we likely won't be able to keep the current roster intact.

Boo, Cowher. Boo Ron Rivera. I'd much prefer Garrett to either of them. I'd be sick for a week if Jerry were to hire a Pittsburgh castoff without getting the coordinator who made that team elite.

 

[Stash]

Boo, Cowher. Boo Ron Rivera. I'd much prefer Garrett to either of them.

Why on God's green Earth would you want Garrett?

What has he shown to make anyone think he's capable of handling his current job, much less a promotion?

I'd be sick for a week if Jerry were to hire a Pittsburgh castoff without getting the coordinator who made that team elite.

'Castoff'? Whose idea was it to leave Pittsburgh?

Certainly not the Steelers casting him aside.

And who had the foresight to hire that coordinator (I assume you're referring to Lebeau)?

And I'm optimistic that Cowher would be able to get Lebeau's heir apparent Keith Butler to be his defensive coordinator (unless Lebeau retires this year).

 

[zrinkill]

You have no freakin' clue what you're talking about.

None.

Actually that is you ...... you are just guessing and are very biased.

Parcells made the call whether or not to keep Zimmer

And Wade had no choice about Garrett being here.

None.

Ridiculous ...... either Jerry is power mad or he isn't ..... you cannot have it both ways.

If you can't see the difference, it's simply because you don't want to see it.

Describes you to a tee.

 

[Hostile]

Boo, Cowher. Boo Ron Rivera. I'd much prefer Garrett to either of them. I'd be sick for a week if Jerry were to hire a Pittsburgh castoff without getting the coordinator who made that team elite.

I like Cowher and Rivera but I want Garrett mor than any other candidate and it is not even close for me.

 

[Idgit]

Why on God's green Earth would you want Garrett?

What has he shown to make anyone think he's capable of handling his current job, much less a promotion?

'Castoff'? Whose idea was it to leave Pittsburgh?

Certainly not the Steelers casting him aside.

And who had the foresight to hire that coordinator (I assume you're referring to Lebeau)?

And I'm optimistic that Cowher would be able to get Lebeau's heir apparent Keith Butler to be his defensive coordinator (unless Lebeau retires this year).

I don't particularly want Garrett. I just want him a lot more than I want Cowher.

I should have said 'retread' rather than 'castoff'. Either way, the guy's a Steeler. Don't want him. He's also not the reason that team ever won anything, which is why an inexperienced HC was able to come in and win it all in his place with the same team. By 'team' I mean 'defense.'

And I don't care that he hired Lebeau before if he can't get him now. Getting Lebeau's current student doesn't excite me in the least.

 

[zrinkill]

I like Cowher and Rivera but I want Garrett mor than any other candidate and it is not even close for me.

If Garrett becomes head coach ....... do you think he will continue to call the plays or hire an O-coordinator?

 

[Stash]

Actually that is you ...... you are just guessing and are very biased.

There's no 'guessing' about it. Do you actually think that Jones made Parcells keep Zimmer? Because that's what you're saying. Just confirm that stance for all of us to see.

Ridiculous ...... either Jerry is power mad or he isn't ..... you cannot have it both ways.

Really? So Jerry has been consistant in his approach since he bought the team? No change in approach from the puppets like Campo to coaches like Parcells? OK...

Describes you to a tee.

If you can't see how wrong you are, there's no point in even continuing to debate it.

 

[Hostile]

If Garrett becomes head coach ....... do you think he will continue to call the plays or hire an O-coordinator?

I think he'd call them but would also hire an OC capable of it.

 

[Hostile]

There's no 'guessing' about it. Do you actually think that Jones made Parcells keep Zimmer? Because that's what you're saying. Just confirm that stance for all of us to see.

Not my waltz, but Jones asked Parcells to keep Zimmer because he saw him as a possible replacement for Parcells one day.

 

[Stash]

I don't particularly want Garrett. I just want him a lot more than I want Cowher.

I should have said 'retread' rather than 'castoff'. Either way, the guy's a Steeler. Don't want him. He's also not the reason that team ever won anything, which is why an inexperienced HC was able to come in and win it all in his place with the same team. By 'team' I mean 'defense.'

Parcells was a 'Giant' too. Personal feelings shouldn't factor into making a sound decision.

And I don't care that he hired Lebeau before if he can't get him now. Getting Lebeau's current student doesn't excite me in the least.

Well the guy has been in demand for the past couple of seasons. He turned down both Green Bay and Miami's defensive coordinator jobs and has leanred at the feet of the master.

Nobody's getting Lebeau. Besides, the man could retire tomorrow.

I'll take the next best thing.

 

[zrinkill]

Just confirm that stance for all of us to see.

Jerry does not force anyone to do anything .....

He is a salesman .....

He talked Bill into keeping Zimmer ....

He talked Bill into accepting T.O. .....

He talked Wade into using Garrett ....

Wade and Bill have the same power here ....... sorry that just because Wade does not act like a tough guy, you do not believe it.

And I am not a Wade fan ...... I would have fired him yesterday if Cowher was interested.

 

[Stash]

Not my waltz, but Jones asked Parcells to keep Zimmer because he saw him as a possible replacement for Parcells one day.

I've never seen that, do you have any evidence that this was the case?

But even if it was, asking Parcells is till considerably different than hiring Phillips after Garrett.

Does anyone think that Phillips could have let Garrett go, the way Parcells could have let Zimmer go?

That's the heart of the debate here.

 

[Stash]

Jerry does not force anyone to do anything .....

He is a salesman .....

He talked Bill into keeping Zimmer ....

He talked Bill into accepting T.O. .....

He talked Wade into using Garrett ....

Wade and Bill have the same power here ....... sorry that just because Wade does not act like a tough guy, you do not believe it.

What discussion was there regarding Garrett?

Jerry had just hired him! There was zero chance that Wade could have gotten rid of him! Parcells had the option to keep Zimmer or not keep him. If Phillips balked at Garrett being here, he would never have gotten the job.

And I am not a Wade fan ...... I would have fired him yesterday if Cowher was interested.

Well we definitely agree here.

But I think that no self-respecting coach would ever jump into this current situation just a few weeks into the season.

My thinking is that if Cowher ever takes the job, we'll have to wait out this season first.

 

[zrinkill]

What discussion was there regarding Garrett?

Jerry had just hired him! There was zero chance that Wade could have gotten rid of him! Parcells had the option to keep Zimmer or not keep him. If Phillips balked at Garrett being here, he would never have gotten the job.

Ok we will just have to disagree here ..

I believe Jerry was just trying to get Jason on the payroll.

If Wade had refused ...... I think Jerry would have put him into the scouting department or created an executive position until he could convince Wade to accept him.

You give Jerry enough time, he will convince you of anything.

 

[Yakuza Rich]

I wouldn't hate having Cowher here in the least bit. I'm not sure if he wants to get into coaching. A lot of people will say that he doesn't want to come here, but that's hogwash. You pay the guy, he'll be here. Parcells wrote a book and stated he would never coach for Jerry Jones and Parcells fans would steadfastly point to that and Jerry got him rather easily.

If a coach wants to be a HC, they'll take the job. The only team that has a hard time getting a HC is Oakland because of Al Davis and they pay their coaches pretty lousy by NFL standards.

But Cowher's personnel situation in Pittsburgh was pretty similar to what we have here in the collaborative effort. In fact, I know that Cowher wanted some FA's during his tenure in Pittsburgh, but the Rooney family would turn him down and at one point that really ticked him off. But they stuck it out and it worked the best for everybody involved over there. There's no doubt in my mind that he's a great coach if he's motivated to be one still. The only thing that held him back was the QB position and he still did very well with guys like O'Donnel, Tomczak, Kordell and Maddox. He went thru numerous O-Coordinators and D-Coordinators and still was very successful.

But, I'd have to be convinced that he's in it for the *long haul* again. The 'I'll be in it for 4-5 years and expect to win a Super Bowl and then I'll hand the reigns over' really doesn't work. Didn't work for Parcells, didn't work for Gibbs and won't work for anybody else. We need somebody who wouldn't have a problem working here for 15 years if need be. I highly doubt that will happen, but that's the attitude we need.

As far as Garrett goes, the only thing I see that he has going for him is his age and he knows the personnel here. Other than that, I don't see how he's more qualified to be the HC here than Rivera is, who had dominating defenses in Chicago that were turnover happy and has now turned around the San Diego defense and is making Kevin Burnett look like an All-Pro.

I wish I didn't feel that way, but I don't see why Garrett should be considered more qualified than Rivera based on results and Rivera has done it for 2 teams where for the most part, Garrett has only coached for 1 team.

I think Norv is really an excellent playcaller. As a team preperation and toughness guy, I probably call that into question. But Chudzinski is learning from Norv and Garrett has not. So that's a big reason why I think Chudzinski should be the O-Coordinator.

The guy turned the Browns into one of the top offenses in the league in '07 with Derrick Anderson at QB, Braylon Edwards, Kellen Winslow, Joe Jurevicius, and Jamal Lewis. I think Edwards and Winslow are dynamic talents, but we have multiple of those dynamic talents at those positions and we are far better at QB and RB.

I wish I could see the validity of Garrett, but most alarming for me is that he is regressing more than anything else.





YR

 

[theogt]

Jerry also balked when Norv told him Jason wasn't ready to call plays during his interview.

Wow, didn't know that happened. What was the source on that one?

Edit: Should have finished reading the thread. That's about as damning evidence as can be had.

It really pisses me off that we're wasting the youth of Romo, Witten, Austin, Felix, etc. on having this yahoo learn on the job.

 

[Hostile]

I've never seen that, do you have any evidence that this was the case?

But even if it was, asking Parcells is till considerably different than hiring Phillips after Garrett.

Does anyone think that Phillips could have let Garrett go, the way Parcells could have let Zimmer go?

That's the heart of the debate here.

I wouldn't know where to find the evidence because I never cared. Parcells was talking about why he kept some coaches and brought in others.

It is the same for me with Garrett being hired first. I don't care. Yes, Wade can fire Garrett if he chooses to. I have no idea why he would want to.

 

[Stash]

Ok we will just have to disagree here ..

I believe Jerry was just trying to get Jason on the payroll.

If Wade had refused ...... I think Jerry would have put him into the scouting department or created an executive position until he could convince Wade to accept him.

You give Jerry enough time, he will convince you of anything.

It's my understanding that Garrett was hired to be the Cowboys' offensive coordinator - at minimum.

The team needed to do that at the least to get him from the Dolphins and there was talk that he may have succeeded Parcells as head coach.

But rather than continue our back and forth, we can agree to disagree.

 

[Stash]

I wouldn't know where to find the evidence because I never cared. Parcells was talking about why he kept some coaches and brought in others.

It is the same for me with Garrett being hired first. I don't care. Yes, Wade can fire Garrett if he chooses to. I have no idea why he would want to.

I will truly never understand your feelings on Garrett.

I have no idea what he has done as a coach to instill the level of confidence he receives around here.

 

[Idgit]

Parcells was a 'Giant' too. Personal feelings shouldn't factor into making a sound decision.

I didn't want Parcels, either, for that very same reason. And we can agree to disagree, but it's not necessarily a sound decision to hire a retread coach who's already had his greatest impact on the league in another conference where he had the benefit of an all-time great coordinator.

Well the guy has been in demand for the past couple of seasons. He turned down both Green Bay and Miami's defensive coordinator jobs and has leanred at the feet of the master.

Nobody's getting Lebeau. Besides, the man could retire tomorrow.

I'll take the next best thing.

Nobody's getting Lebeau, that's the truth. Whether or not Keith Butler is the next best thing has yet to be determined.