Question, if Commanders are restructing contracts well into 2011 & 12, why cant we?

[cowboyjoe]

I admit I dont like the Commanders, never will, especially joe gibbs too. My question is this, if the supposedly Commanders are restructering deals into 2011 & 2012, why cant the cowboys do a few of them to, to free up a little more cap money. Not a whole lot mind you, just a little to get a couple more million free in cap money. Just bugs me to heck, we should have won that first game with the Commanders.

 

[theogt]

Do you see how much cap room we have this year compared to how much they have? Thats the reason. They will always have a mediocre team in the cap era. You can't just build a team through the draft. It requires free agency too. Being idiots with cap space is well....being idiots with cap space.

 

[dbair1967]

I admit I dont like the Commanders, never will, especially joe gibbs too. My question is this, if the supposedly Commanders are restructering deals into 2011 & 2012, why cant the cowboys do a few of them to, to free up a little more cap money. Not a whole lot mind you, just a little to get a couple more million free in cap money. Just bugs me to heck, we should have won that first game with the Commanders.

because they were a gazillion dollars over the cap and we have plenty of room...

how much more room do you want? by most accounts we have between 20-25mils right now

David

 

[Manster]

We did do this in the 90's and look where we ended up in 2000-2002. The only difference between us and Washington is that we ended up with some rings.

:laugh2:

 

[RiggoForever]

Do you see how much cap room we have this year compared to how much they have? Thats the reason. They will always have a mediocre team in the cap era. You can't just build a team through the draft. It requires free agency too. Being idiots with cap space is well....being idiots with cap space.

Dude, we built all our championship teams through a great deal of free agency.

 

[theogt]

Dude, we built all our championship teams through a great deal of free agency.

I don't think you read my post at all. Read it and then reply.

 

[BigDFan5]

I don't think you read my post at all. Read it and then reply.

I think you might have gotten it backwards when you said build thru FA lol

 

[Q_the_man]

Whats this the 12th Commander thread today

 

[theogt]

Whats this the 12th Commander thread today

It is the biggest rivalry in sports.

 

[silverbear]

I admit I dont like the Commanders, never will, especially joe gibbs too. My question is this, if the supposedly Commanders are restructering deals into 2011 & 2012, why cant the cowboys do a few of them to, to free up a little more cap money.

Because restructuring deals is only done by teams desperate to create cap room... doing so pushes cap hits further into the future, but it also makes those future cap hits considerably larger...

IOW, it's a case of penny wise and pound foolish... the Cowboys have 22.5 mil in cap room, and the only renegotiation they're contemplating is Larry Allen's contract, which could free up another 2-3 mil if they get the job done...

That should be plenty to upgrade via free agency... the Boys signed 6 nice free agents last year, with less cap room than this...

Just bugs me to heck, we should have won that first game with the Commanders.

So, because we gave away that first game against the Skins, we should start restructuring a bunch of contracts that we don't really need to restructure in the first place??

Sorry, the logic of that escapes me... be patient, friend, I think you're gonna enjoy some of the things the Boys are about to do to upgrade the roster...

 

[silverbear]

Whats this the 12th Commander thread today

I personally find Skins threads to be far more entertaining than the 50 TO threads a day we've been seeing...

If I had a vote, I'd make mentioning Terrell Owens' name a bannable offense on these boards...

 

[AmishCowboy]

I don't think there was any FA's, the last time the Commanders won a SB?.

 

[SkinsandTerps]

Because restructuring deals is only done by teams desperate to create cap room... doing so pushes cap hits further into the future, but it also makes those future cap hits considerably larger...

Is it desperate or is it, manipulating the system ? Almost backfired indeed. But alas it worked out.

IOW, it's a case of penny wise and pound foolish... the Cowboys have 22.5 mil in cap room, and the only renegotiation they're contemplating is Larry Allen's contract, which could free up another 2-3 mil if they get the job done...

That should be plenty to upgrade via free agency... the Boys signed 6 nice free agents last year, with less cap room than this...

6 nice ? ehh. Commanders potentially could end up being around 19M Under from what I have been reading. Should be interesting indeed.

 

[AmishCowboy]

For a team with roughly $7 million under the cap. it's funny when you visit ES, they are talking about signing Adam A, Randle-Al, Andre Carter and David Givins, I'll believe it when i see it.:skins: :suxskins: :dissskin: :holmes:

 

[silverbear]

Is it desperate or is it, manipulating the system ? Almost backfired indeed. But alas it worked out.

Desperate was a carefully chosen word... teams like the Iggles, and now the Cowboys, construct their salaries in such a way as to not NEED to restructure deals, thereby giving themselves some flexibility under the cap each and every year...

Without having to restructure a whole slew of contracts... I repeat, though Danny Boy has so far managed to avoid having to pay the piper, what will happen is that one or more of those stars with the megacontracts will suffer an injury that forces them to retire, and all of their remaining bonus money will accelerate onto the cap... that's what happened to the Boys, Jay Novacek got a bad back and had to retire, Charles Haley got a bad back and had to retire, then concussions forced Troy Aikman to retire...

Sooner or later, the Skins will face a serious cap crunch... it might not happen for another couple-three years, but it's coming... think about this, if Danny Boy really had found a loophole that would let him work around the cap, other teams would be doing the exact same thing... the NFL is a copycat league, but I don't see any other teams doing all this contract restructuring year after year after year...

 

[SkinsandTerps]

I think HH31 has been talking about this cap hell too. I better look into it.

But seriously, I will admit the Commanders dodged the bullet this week. But I will also present that Danny & co. may have put their coins all in one bag to say; "Dare to see what I will be able to do without a cap".

At some point I am sure the Commanders will screw it up and have to face the same problems that the Cowboys have...naah. The cap will continue to rise and now there are 6 more years for the Commanders and others teams to get their ships in order. If they screw it up by next negotiation time, than they deserve it. I will be miserable but I will still remain loyal.

At this point the cap just went up significantly and dead money for the Commanders is coming off the books as we type. A major injury would be a concern, however the Commanders sustained a 9M cap hit from Coles last season and a 8M cap hit from LaVar this season.

Other teams havent done it because of how contracts are structured. Other teams are afraid to commit that type of investment it seems. However you have seen Randy Moss sign a huge deal and leave, Culpepper is likely on the same boat. And others as well.

As bad as it is, it seems to always work itself out.

Now as far as how competitive the Commanders have been since the cap... I will plead the 5th (Knob Creek if you have it).

 

[silverbear]

6 nice ? ehh.

Are you trying to suggest that Jason Ferguson, Anthony Henry, Aaron Glenn, Drew Bledsoe and Marco Rivera are not solid players??

Bet ya a nickel that the Skins could find room for all of them on their roster... more important, those players were the biggest reason the Cowboys improved from 6-10 to 9-7, all while completely retooling their defense...

Commanders potentially could end up being around 19M Under from what I have been reading.

Don't believe everything you read by Robert Large, son... sorry, but the MOST optimistic projection I've seen from the Skins from semi-credible media sources has been 15 mil... a nice total, but there will be like 15 teams in the league with more cap room...

And of course, you can't spend all of that 15 mil (if the final figure is actually that high, I've seen a number of estimates more in the 10 mil range) on free agents, unless you don't care to re-sign Ryan Clark or Robert Royal... further, you'll have to set aside money for your draft picks and to fund a practice squad next year... figure it will take about 2.5-3 mil to re-sign your own free agents, another 2-2.5 mil for draft picks and a practice squad, and suddenly your down around 10 million in cap room, max... give that everybody else has an extra 7.5 million in cap room to play with, the cost of free agents this year is bound to be higher than normal, so if the Skins have 10 mil to play with, that would mean maybe 2 or 3 good signings, and another 1 or 2 signings of free agents who are more on the fringe...

Then there's the matter of how your recent cuts have left you razor thin in the defensive backfield (just 4 veterans under contract-- Springs, Taylor, Prioleau and Rogers), and that a report in today's Washington Post said that negotiations to bring back Ryan Clark aren't going real well, and that Sean Taylor may wind up in jail, and you guys clearly have to devote a big chunk of your cap room toward building a respectable secondary...

Unless, of course, you're content to watch the likes of Ade Jimoh, James Bethea, Curry Burns, Christian Morton, Dimitri Patterson and/or Aric Williams back there... me, I'd really enjoy that, LOL...

 

[silverbear]

I think HH31 has been talking about this cap hell too. I better look into it.

Son, the ONLY folks I've seen uttering the words "cap hell" these last few weeks, through all of our debates, have been Skins fans... that's a straw man y'all keep dragging out...

At worst, if there had been no CBA this year, the Skins might have been in cap "HECK", but cap hell is when you have to cut high priced stars in order to get under the cap, and even then you don't have sufficient room to make any free agent moves... clearly, the Skins aren't in that position...

Yet...

But seriously, I will admit the Commanders dodged the bullet this week.

Well, duh...

At some point I am sure the Commanders will screw it up and have to face the same problems that the Cowboys have...naah.

Apparently, you think that Snyder and company are somehow smarter than the Cowboys were, the Niners were, the Titans were... and yet, all of those teams at least got to the Super Bowl before entering cap hell, while the Skins haven't...

And of course, with the NFL being such a copycat league, if Danny Boy really had found a new and better way to work the cap, the other teams would rush to employ his tactics... I don't seem to see anybody else doing so... this should suggest to you that ther est of the league has looked at his approach, and seen problems with it...

If they screw it up by next negotiation time, than they deserve it. I will be miserable but I will still remain loyal.

You wouldn't be worth a crap as a fan if you felt any other way... I've been a Cowboys fan since Day One, way back in 1960, which means I suffered through their 0-11-1 record their first year, 1-15 in 1989, and my loyalties never once wavered...

As bad as it is, it seems to always work itself out.

It always worked out for the Cowboys, too... until Jay Novacek's back forced him into premature retirement, Charles Haley's back did the same, and not long after that, Troy Aikman's concussions forced him out of the league, too...

Presto, instant cap hell...

Though I'm arguing with you, I'm enjoying this debate... I hope I'm not being insulting to you...

 

[SkinsandTerps]

First off the Commanders could easily find room for maybe 2 of those guys that were worth the money this past season.

Why do you keep talking about Robert Royal ? He is a role player. I like Clark and think he could be good but I am hoping not to break the bank on this guy either.

Give them 10M fine with me. More than enough to sign whomever they want or shall I say need.

 

[SkinsandTerps]

silverbear we have already been through our insult matches. I am beginning to think you may drink on the job. haha.

EDIT: The rest of that post I will have to get in the morning. As I have to be up at 6CST. And will make sure to find the time to debate this some more with you.