RECAP: T-new on Sirius

[FuzzyLumpkins]

I've never claimed any such thing, go back to sleep

David

He'd have the single biggest impact of any player we could draft at any position...I'm all for getting him

it's a longshot no doubt, but if we get this kid we're over the top in a big way fro 2008 and beyond

David

oh excuse me you just said that a backup running back would 'put us over the top.'

 

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Again, there are plenty of variables to throw into this argument. I never said defensive pressure was a bad thing.

I could go down that list and bring up a counter point, which someone could counter, and then counter that. There are a lot of things that go into making a good football team.

Weren't we like number two in sacks?

 

[k19]

Weren't we like number two in sacks?

3rd last year behind NE and NY

 

[TheCount]

Weren't we like number two in sacks?

Something like that, but the Giants were #1 last year and they actually won the SB.

 

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Something like that, but the Giants were #1 last year and they actually won the SB.

I am a bit confused here. Are people saying we need another pass rusher and should let Newman walk?

As far as I could tell, our problems weren't getting pressure as much as it was we couldn't cover anyone. i don't recall thinking that Ellis, Ware et al we're sucking as much as it was our mid field pass defense and Reeves.

Maybe its just me but making the weakest part of our defense weaker does not make sense.

 

[TheCount]

I am a bit confused here. Are people saying we need another pass rusher and should let Newman walk?

As far as I could tell, our problems weren't getting pressure as much as it was we couldn't cover anyone. i don't recall thinking that Ellis, Ware et al we're sucking as much as it was our mid field pass defense and Reeves.

Maybe its just me but making the weakest part of our defense weaker does not make sense.

I don't know if that's the conversation entirely. Doomsday had said that cornerback was the most overrated position in football, and he'd take 3 Wares over 3 Newmans because the Giants proved pressure was more important, which they kind of did.

I was saying pointing out cornerbacks as the most overrated is one sided, just because the Giants won with pressure doesn't mean it hasn't been done other ways. The Giants are just the latest and freshest memory to compare to.

And for the record, I don't think even Newman is worth 10 mil a year if that's really what he's after. The Raiders were idiots to give Hall that much, and he's much younger.

 

[k19]

I don't know if that's the conversation entirely. k19 had said that cornerback was the most overrated position in football, and he'd take 3 Wares over 3 Newmans because the Giants proved pressure was more important, which they kind of did.
I was saying pointing out cornerbacks as the most overrated is one sided, just because the Giants won with pressure doesn't mean it hasn't been done other ways. The Giants are just the latest and freshest memory to compare to.

And for the record, I don't think even Newman is worth 10 mil a year if that's really what he's after. The Raiders were idiots to give Hall that much, and he's much younger.

I never said that :

 

[TheCount]

I never said that :

You're right. Sorry about that, didn't mean to put words in your mouth.

Doomsday is the one that said that.

 

[FuzzyLumpkins]

I don't know if that's the conversation entirely. Doomsday had said that cornerback was the most overrated position in football, and he'd take 3 Wares over 3 Newmans because the Giants proved pressure was more important, which they kind of did.

I was saying pointing out cornerbacks as the most overrated is one sided, just because the Giants won with pressure doesn't mean it hasn't been done other ways. The Giants are just the latest and freshest memory to compare to.

And for the record, I don't think even Newman is worth 10 mil a year if that's really what he's after. The Raiders were idiots to give Hall that much, and he's much younger.

then again the Giants drafted Aaron Ross and finally got Springs healthy when they made the run at the end. You need both really.

 

[DallasDomination]

Pressure is more important then coverage Bar none.

 

[TheCount]

then again the Giants drafted Aaron Ross and finally got Springs healthy when they made the run at the end. You need both really.

Agreed. They didn't exactly have scrubs in their secondary. Ideally, you want both. There's no law that says it's one or the other.

 

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Pressure is more important then coverage Bar none.

You have to have a minimal amount of coverage to be able to pressure at all. Our problem last year was we had to play soft zones due to our personnel and the fact our underneath coverage was horrific. As such teams could use three step drops and short passes to backs and TEs for safety valves.

So many drives were kept alive on us last year like that.

It is impossible to pressure the QB if you cannot cover on 3 step drops.

Really though i think the best thing we could do to help generate pressure is get a nose tackle. What i mean by that is someone that along with Tank can come in and take Ratliff off the nose so he doesnt have to eat up double teams all day long and can move out to end.

We have plenty of pass rushers. We have edge rushers in Ware, Ellis and Spencer and guys that can do it inside or out in Ratliff, Hatcher, and Tank.

This team doesn't have pressure problems. The problem is we couldn't get even decent quarterbacks like Eli have to pull the ball down on a three step drop to allow our pass rushers to get to the ball. We had NO coverage sacks and we were handcuffed on the coverages we could call because Reeves, Burnett and RW were sucking in coverage.

Thomas helps in this a lot and I hope to god he replaces Burnett on the nickel. But having 2 Jacque Reeve caliber players on the field because we ditched Newman is folly.

 

[dbair1967]

oh excuse me you just said that a backup running back would 'put us over the top.'

sure HE would, because he'd have such a a huge impact on our offense, the way teams played defense against us and because he adds a dimension that only one other player on our offense currently has

depending on WHO the "backup" to Barber is, that guy will probably get anywhere from 10-20 plays a game...but if its McFadden he'd probably be close to a 50/50 split between him and Barber, meaning he'd have a chance to really make a strong impact

but I have never said its the ONLY way to go...we have a very good team

David

 

[Chocolate Lab]

scroll down to "heard it on sirius"
http://www.sirius.com/nfl

Thanks. He sounds like his butt hurts.

As for what Doomsday is saying, anyone would take three Wares over three Newmans. That's not even an argument. If you know where we can get another Ware, I'm sure Jerry would be happy to trade TN for him right away.

But that's obviously a completely unrealistic scenario. The fact is, nobody has or ever has had three Wares.

I'm kind of curious, why would Jim Johnson, one of the better DCs anywhere, think a top corner like Samuel was worth paying for when he already had two very good-to-very-good corners? Isn't QB pressure all that matters?

 

[superpunk]

I don't understand people begrudging Newman the right to ask for more money. This is the appropriate time to do so. It's not like he's threatening a holdout or making a spectacle of himself at camp like our own Desperate Housewife, Greg Ellis.

The guy has earned a big payday. Whether he gets it from us or someone else.

 

[Doomsday]

Thanks. He sounds like his butt hurts.

As for what Doomsday is saying, anyone would take three Wares over three Newmans. That's not even an argument. If you know where we can get another Ware, I'm sure Jerry would be happy to trade TN for him right away.

But that's obviously a completely unrealistic scenario. The fact is, nobody has or ever has had three Wares.

I'm kind of curious, why would Jim Johnson, one of the better DCs anywhere, think a top corner like Samuel was worth paying for when he already had two very good-to-very-good corners? Isn't QB pressure all that matters?

Im not saying you can just go find more Wares, but you have to invest draft picks in the front 7 to find one. Obviously pressure isnt all that matters but you dont need shut down lock up corners. Again there is only so much money to go around, I dont think paying a 30 year old corner top dollar is going to help this team in the long run. Id rather see them spend in other areas.

Im not begrudging Newman for wanting to get paid, I just dont think Dallas should be the team to do it. That said his comment about not spending money on Chad Johnson or whoever else so he can get paid is Ellis like though.