Scotland rejects Independence, Unionists "celebrate" in our biggest city

[daschoo]

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...-separate-rival-groups-tension-increases.html

I love my country but today is about as low as I have felt in my life. Devastated, angry, ashamed and empty is my best attempt to convey my feelings.

 

[sureletsrace]

I'm sorry to hear this.

As an American, it's something that I don't really have to worry about. I'm sure it is devastating.

My sincere condolences.

 

[CashMan]

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...-separate-rival-groups-tension-increases.html

I love my country but today is about as low as I have felt in my life. Devastated, angry, ashamed and empty is my best attempt to convey my feelings.

I can not say, I know too much on this subject, but what are some of the pros and cons of being independent?

 

[Manwiththeplan]

Yea, I don't see the benefit of breaking free nor the harm in staying.

 

[daschoo]

I can not say, I know too much on this subject, but what are some of the pros and cons of being independent?

That's an extremely political answer which I can't really get into here I wouldn't have thought. Suffice to say that the same as any other country on the planet the principle of self determination and the idea that we would run our own affairs better ourselves than have them decided for us from London.

 

[CashMan]

That's an extremely political answer which I can't really get into here I wouldn't have thought. Suffice to say that the same as any other country on the planet the principle of self determination and the idea that we would run our own affairs better ourselves than have them decided for us from London.

Well, I do not think, you are going to get popped for politics involving Scotland, but that is fine. Would you compare it to, Puerto Rico and the US? Are you guys on their money system?

 

[Phoenix]

You can search for the pros and cons using your favorite search engine (I opt for DuckDuckGo.com) ...when I was in London last week the free daily evening paper (I forget its name) had a nice write up of the pros and cons of the election result. As pointed out, a lot of both are really political in nature and probably against posting rules on this board. There are others though, including economical, military, etc.

 

[CashMan]

You can search for the pros and cons using your favorite search engine (I opt for DuckDuckGo.com) ...when I was in London last week the free daily evening paper (I forget its name) had a nice write up of the pros and cons of the election result. As pointed out, a lot of both are really political in nature and probably against posting rules on this board. There are others though, including economical, military, etc.

I was looking more from someone who lives there, rather than more of the political answers of the pros and cons.

Ex: Con: We have to come up with our own version of the pound/dollar.

 

[CF74]

This would drive me to revolt...

 

[Ren]

Is it true that your national animal is a unicorn?

 

[JoeyBoy718]

I feel you. I'm Irish American and I know the issues between the Republic and Northern Ireland. England has its hands in everything.

 

[zrinkill]

 

[BoysFan4ever]

I love Ireland. I love Scotland.

2 beautiful places to visit with great people in both.

 

[arglebargle]

I was vaguely pro-Independance, just on general principles, but had no decent grasp of the issues. However, my middle name is of Scots origin, and my grandfather served in the Essex Scottish Regt. in WWII, so that may explain that leaning.

 

[BringBackThatOleTimeBoys]

For us Americans, imagine for one moment there was no state legislature in Austin or any of the 50 states....all of that was decided in Washington. A number of states would be wanting to secede in that kind of situation. Until 1996?, London had that kind of power, then they allowed Scotland, Wales, Northern Ireland to have a parliament for their local matters like our state legislature. The fallout of the Scotland vote is the Scots will have more local say, but also Wales, N Ireland, AND England. This will be a thorny issue for them but I see it as all good.

I won't pretend to know the other issues that Scotland has that led to this vote and won't comment on that.

 

[daschoo]

I was looking more from someone who lives there, rather than more of the political answers of the pros and cons.

Ex: Con: We have to come up with our own version of the pound/dollar.

The idea proposed was that we would have continued using the pound as that made economic sense both sides of the border. Westminster maintained that they wouldn't enter a formal currency union to which the Yes campaign pointed out that denying us access to the financial assets of the Bank of England (England in this case meaning Britain) would mean an independent Scotland could not be expected to take a share of the financial liabilities ie the national debt. For this reason I personally am convinced that the refusal to enter a currency union was a bluff and that there would have been agreement after a Yes vote. Personally I would have liked to have seen a new Scottish currency but the plan was for a currency union.
A lot of the cons were in my opinion scaremongering. Uncertainty over what currency we would use, uncertainty over EU and NATO membership. The main scaremongering that definitely worked was the Better Together campaign continually talking about uncertainty over pensions despite the UK government having confirmed that they would honour existing pension funds that had been paid into. A breakdown of the vote afterwards revealed that 73% of over 65s voted to maintain the union, if you take them out of the equation then the result would have been a Yes. Some businesses voiced concern over a potential split and spoke about increased costs while others came out in favour of independence. Initial setup costs for a new country and setting up a defence force are obvious cons.
Pros include the money raised in Scotland being used by a Scottish government in the best interests of Scotland rather than the current system where it goes to London and a percentage of it is used here. The English media like to point out that public spending is a good deal higher in Scotland per head than the UK average but usually fail to point out that Scotland contributes more money than it receives as this doesn't fit the theme of us being "subsidy junkies"
Last week the PM cancelled a session in parliament to come up to Scotland to speak in favour of maintaining the union. This was summed up by the Yes campaign poster stating "Imagine living in a country where our leaders don't make emergency visits but are actually based here"
Scotland has 8% of the UK population but the following percentages of resources
Oil 95
Gas 65
Open cast coal 47
Hydro electric production 92
Solar, wind, wave production 40
Fresh water (by surface area) 90
Fish landed 55
Beef stock 30
Sheep 20
Timber production 62
We also have the Scotch whisky industry and more top ranked universities per head than any other nation.
In my personal opinion the main thing that cost us this referendum is fear. 45% of the population did vote for independence though. The biggest city in the country, third biggest in the UK and I'm proud to say my hometown did vote for independence. The majority of people under the age of 65 did vote for independence. Unfortunately I think this is why we won't get our independence, the only reason Westminster allowed this referendum is because it was assumed that it would be an overwhelming No vote. The fright they have had over the last few weeks when it looked like we might vote Yes in my opinion makes the likelihood of them authorising another in my lifetime practically nonexistent.
The main reason for independence is independence itself. Why when offered the chance to run our own affairs we decided to reject it and continue to have them run from London is something that I will never understand and will break my heart until the day I die.

 

[CashMan]

The idea proposed was that we would have continued using the pound as that made economic sense both sides of the border. Westminster maintained that they wouldn't enter a formal currency union to which the Yes campaign pointed out that denying us access to the financial assets of the Bank of England (England in this case meaning Britain) would mean an independent Scotland could not be expected to take a share of the financial liabilities ie the national debt. For this reason I personally am convinced that the refusal to enter a currency union was a bluff and that there would have been agreement after a Yes vote. Personally I would have liked to have seen a new Scottish currency but the plan was for a currency union.
A lot of the cons were in my opinion scaremongering. Uncertainty over what currency we would use, uncertainty over EU and NATO membership. The main scaremongering that definitely worked was the Better Together campaign continually talking about uncertainty over pensions despite the UK government having confirmed that they would honour existing pension funds that had been paid into. A breakdown of the vote afterwards revealed that 73% of over 65s voted to maintain the union, if you take them out of the equation then the result would have been a Yes. Some businesses voiced concern over a potential split and spoke about increased costs while others came out in favour of independence. Initial setup costs for a new country and setting up a defence force are obvious cons.
Pros include the money raised in Scotland being used by a Scottish government in the best interests of Scotland rather than the current system where it goes to London and a percentage of it is used here. The English media like to point out that public spending is a good deal higher in Scotland per head than the UK average but usually fail to point out that Scotland contributes more money than it receives as this doesn't fit the theme of us being "subsidy junkies"
Last week the PM cancelled a session in parliament to come up to Scotland to speak in favour of maintaining the union. This was summed up by the Yes campaign poster stating "Imagine living in a country where our leaders don't make emergency visits but are actually based here"
Scotland has 8% of the UK population but the following percentages of resources
Oil 95
Gas 65
Open cast coal 47
Hydro electric production 92
Solar, wind, wave production 40
Fresh water (by surface area) 90
Fish landed 55
Beef stock 30
Sheep 20
Timber production 62
We also have the Scotch whisky industry and more top ranked universities per head than any other nation.
In my personal opinion the main thing that cost us this referendum is fear. 45% of the population did vote for independence though. The biggest city in the country, third biggest in the UK and I'm proud to say my hometown did vote for independence. The majority of people under the age of 65 did vote for independence. Unfortunately I think this is why we won't get our independence, the only reason Westminster allowed this referendum is because it was assumed that it would be an overwhelming No vote. The fright they have had over the last few weeks when it looked like we might vote Yes in my opinion makes the likelihood of them authorising another in my lifetime practically nonexistent.
The main reason for independence is independence itself. Why when offered the chance to run our own affairs we decided to reject it and continue to have them run from London is something that I will never understand and will break my heart until the day I die.

I totally understand now. Thanks!

 

[CliffnDallas]

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...-separate-rival-groups-tension-increases.html

I love my country but today is about as low as I have felt in my life. Devastated, angry, ashamed and empty is my best attempt to convey my feelings.

Freeeeedom!!! ... O'h wait...

 

[daschoo]

Is it true that your national animal is a unicorn?

Sorry I managed to miss this post. Yeah, I never knew that until recently - always assumed it was the lion since the Royal Standard is the Lion Rampant.

 

[xwalker]

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...-separate-rival-groups-tension-increases.html

I love my country but today is about as low as I have felt in my life. Devastated, angry, ashamed and empty is my best attempt to convey my feelings.

I thought people in Scotland had been fighting for independence since the formation of Great Britain.

I seem to like shows about Scotland. I know it's highly inaccurate, but I loved Braveheart.

Recently, I've been watching a show called Outlander. It's good and most of the cast appears to be from Scotland.