Seven Things I Think I Think About The 2017 Draft

[waving monkey]

1) I think...the BtB readership didn't learn its Joey Bosa lesson.
I don't begrudge anyone his or her personal scouting assessment when it comes to draft prospects. We won't know what these players really are until they hit the field (and even then, it is difficult to evaluate personal abilities in football), so there is no completely right or wrong here. But the fairly firm negative response to the Taco Charlton pick has me befuddled.

Sure, Charlton is not a pure speed rusher. Okay, his "bend" might be in doubt. Indeed, his production wasn't eye-popping last season. All of this could have been said about Joey Bosa - who took the opposing QBs and the NFL by storm despite a ton of missed developmental time due to a prolonged holdout - and in fact, all this WAS said about Bosa last year by those who were opposing to Dallas taking him at the #4 overall pick.

Bosa wasn't the SPARQiest out there, and his profile was more typical of well-rounded DEs who often didn't end up as true elite pass-rushers. It wasn't that those claims were untrue, but rather that there is more to the equation than that. In hindsight (or, for some of us, foresight), Bosa was indeed a monster and arguably would have been the ideal pick for Dallas in 2016. Now much of the same exceptions (applied in this case to a poorer-man's version, naturally) can be said about Charlton, and yet the same incomplete criticisms are being levied on him. Were last year's debates really THAT long about that people would forget that they are making the same arguments that have now been proven to not be the full picture? Or do people have short memories when it comes to being so wrong about something?

[note: please don't get me wrong. I'm not urging you to bury or feel wrong about disappointment. If Kevin King were your dream guy at the time, or you aren't inspired by Charlton's profile, that's fair. I just don't see good reason to outright dislike the pick.]
link/ http://www.bloggingtheboys.com/2017/5/4/15508198/sevent-things-i-think-i-think-about-the-2017-draft

 

[DogFace]

In two years we'll know if Watt or King should've been the pick. They've been pretty good on first rounders for a while so I'm thinking maybe they got it right again.

 

[xwalker]

1) I think...the BtB readership didn't learn its Joey Bosa lesson.
I don't begrudge anyone his or her personal scouting assessment when it comes to draft prospects. We won't know what these players really are until they hit the field (and even then, it is difficult to evaluate personal abilities in football), so there is no completely right or wrong here. But the fairly firm negative response to the Taco Charlton pick has me befuddled.

Sure, Charlton is not a pure speed rusher. Okay, his "bend" might be in doubt. Indeed, his production wasn't eye-popping last season. All of this could have been said about Joey Bosa - who took the opposing QBs and the NFL by storm despite a ton of missed developmental time due to a prolonged holdout - and in fact, all this WAS said about Bosa last year by those who were opposing to Dallas taking him at the #4 overall pick.

Bosa wasn't the SPARQiest out there, and his profile was more typical of well-rounded DEs who often didn't end up as true elite pass-rushers. It wasn't that those claims were untrue, but rather that there is more to the equation than that. In hindsight (or, for some of us, foresight), Bosa was indeed a monster and arguably would have been the ideal pick for Dallas in 2016. Now much of the same exceptions (applied in this case to a poorer-man's version, naturally) can be said about Charlton, and yet the same incomplete criticisms are being levied on him. Were last year's debates really THAT long about that people would forget that they are making the same arguments that have now been proven to not be the full picture? Or do people have short memories when it comes to being so wrong about something?

[note: please don't get me wrong. I'm not urging you to bury or feel wrong about disappointment. If Kevin King were your dream guy at the time, or you aren't inspired by Charlton's profile, that's fair. I just don't see good reason to outright dislike the pick.]
link/ http://www.bloggingtheboys.com/2017/5/4/15508198/sevent-things-i-think-i-think-about-the-2017-draft

My top 2 pre-draft were Taco and McDowell.

McDowell's character either pushed him down or removed him from their board. Marinelli might have given him a thumbs down after he came forca visit.

My 3rd choice at #28 was Awuzie.

 

[haleyrules]

1) I think...the BtB readership didn't learn its Joey Bosa lesson.
I don't begrudge anyone his or her personal scouting assessment when it comes to draft prospects. We won't know what these players really are until they hit the field (and even then, it is difficult to evaluate personal abilities in football), so there is no completely right or wrong here. But the fairly firm negative response to the Taco Charlton pick has me befuddled.

Sure, Charlton is not a pure speed rusher. Okay, his "bend" might be in doubt. Indeed, his production wasn't eye-popping last season. All of this could have been said about Joey Bosa - who took the opposing QBs and the NFL by storm despite a ton of missed developmental time due to a prolonged holdout - and in fact, all this WAS said about Bosa last year by those who were opposing to Dallas taking him at the #4 overall pick.

Bosa wasn't the SPARQiest out there, and his profile was more typical of well-rounded DEs who often didn't end up as true elite pass-rushers. It wasn't that those claims were untrue, but rather that there is more to the equation than that. In hindsight (or, for some of us, foresight), Bosa was indeed a monster and arguably would have been the ideal pick for Dallas in 2016. Now much of the same exceptions (applied in this case to a poorer-man's version, naturally) can be said about Charlton, and yet the same incomplete criticisms are being levied on him. Were last year's debates really THAT long about that people would forget that they are making the same arguments that have now been proven to not be the full picture? Or do people have short memories when it comes to being so wrong about something?

[note: please don't get me wrong. I'm not urging you to bury or feel wrong about disappointment. If Kevin King were your dream guy at the time, or you aren't inspired by Charlton's profile, that's fair. I just don't see good reason to outright dislike the pick.]
link/ http://www.bloggingtheboys.com/2017/5/4/15508198/sevent-things-i-think-i-think-about-the-2017-draft

There is no reason to dislike the pick. The FO did what it had to do. It took the best DE available at the moment. What real choice did they have. The draft is a crapshoot. Most of the players drafted, by all the clubs, names won't be remembered in two yrs.

 

[JW82]

There is no reason to dislike the pick. The FO did what it had to do. It took the best DE available at the moment. What real choice did they have. The draft is a crapshoot. Most of the players drafted, by all the clubs, names won't be remembered in two yrs.

I agree. I wanted Watt but my next guy in the DE ranking was Taco and if they see Watt as an OLB that wouldn't easily make the transition to 4-3 end then their choice makes sense. I agreed with them that DE in rd one was the way to go.

 

[haleyrules]

I agree. I wanted Watt but my next guy in the DE ranking was Taco and if they see Watt as an OLB that wouldn't easily make the transition to 4-3 end then their choice makes sense. I agreed with them that DE in rd one was the way to go.

Nothing against Watt...those knee surguries are very troubling. Many liked Rueben Foster...but the Cowboys needed a DE.

 

[jazzcat22]

I guess some will want to turn this into an Ellis vs. Moss pick in some kind of way. It has no bearing as to who compares to who in 2 years, 5 years or 15 years.
Last I seen, Moss did not bring a SB trophy to the vikings in his time there. Nor for any other teams. Though he played in 2 SB's, he was on the losing end both times. Once with NE, once with SF.

 

[jazzcat22]

Nothing against Watt...those knee surguries are very troubling. Many liked Rueben Foster...but the Cowboys needed a DE.

Cowboys thoughts were that Watt was not where he needed to be as a pass rusher, and putting his hand on the ground for that role.
Those injuries would concern me also. If they would to draft him as a LB, not sure, but not in the 1st round.

 

[Carson]

Cowboys thoughts were that Watt was not where he needed to be as a pass rusher, and putting his hand on the ground for that role.
Those injuries would concern me also. If they would to draft him as a LB, not sure, but not in the 1st round.

Exactly.

Watt will be much better in a 3-4. Simple as that

 

[bark]

Nothing against Watt...those knee surguries are very troubling. Many liked Rueben Foster...but the Cowboys needed a DE.

Yes and a foster pick would have likely turned into a jaylon smith like redshirt year.
Doubtful he is available for much of the yr

 

[big dog cowboy]

6) I think...the Cowboys might actually be aiming to get rid of fifth round picks.
I recently stumbled on to an article (check it out, last item in the piece) that claimed that 5th round picks as just as much lottery-ticket-level as 6th and 7th rounders, and that the Patriots have taken advantage of that fact by making alternative use of 6th rounders. This got me thinking about how cavalier Dallas has been with its 5th rounders in recent years, and it makes me wonder: has Dallas discovered and taken advantage of a market inefficiency?

After all, there is no way the average NFL team sees 5th rounders as just as (not) valuable as 7th rounders. That means using your 5th rounder for some other purpose can be used to generate value. Sure, Dallas used its 2018 5th rounder in order to secure Xavier Woods, but what if part of the team's willingness to do so beyond the upcoming replacement comp picks was the knowledge that 5th rounders are particularly not special?

I'm not saying that Dallas literally wants to be rid of picks in the round, but with what little we know there is a solid implication that the team doesn't put up as much of a fight for picks in the round.


If that is the Cowboys thinking I strongly disagree. When Buffalo used the Cowboys 5th round pick on QB Nathan Peterman of Pittsburgh I was growling. Thought he had potential starter qualities and could have been good trade bait in a couple of years. I know all that is based on the Cowboys not trading for Cassell but still....

 

[ThreeandOut]

6) I think...the Cowboys might actually be aiming to get rid of fifth round picks.
I recently stumbled on to an article (check it out, last item in the piece) that claimed that 5th round picks as just as much lottery-ticket-level as 6th and 7th rounders, and that the Patriots have taken advantage of that fact by making alternative use of 6th rounders. This got me thinking about how cavalier Dallas has been with its 5th rounders in recent years, and it makes me wonder: has Dallas discovered and taken advantage of a market inefficiency?

After all, there is no way the average NFL team sees 5th rounders as just as (not) valuable as 7th rounders. That means using your 5th rounder for some other purpose can be used to generate value. Sure, Dallas used its 2018 5th rounder in order to secure Xavier Woods, but what if part of the team's willingness to do so beyond the upcoming replacement comp picks was the knowledge that 5th rounders are particularly not special?

I'm not saying that Dallas literally wants to be rid of picks in the round, but with what little we know there is a solid implication that the team doesn't put up as much of a fight for picks in the round.


If that is the Cowboys thinking I strongly disagree. When Buffalo used the Cowboys 5th round pick on QB Nathan Peterman of Pittsburgh I was growling. Thought he had potential starter qualities and could have been good trade bait in a couple of years. I know all that is based on the Cowboys not trading for Cassell but still....

If they had a 5th rounder this year and Woods was available, they wouldn't have traded the pick.

 

[Pants]

Dallas may be banking on getting a comp pick in the 5th round in 2018, thus, making their own 5th rounded expendable (or at least a tradeable commodity)

 

[jazzcat22]

Usually I am not in favor of trading away draft picks, especially in future years. Not even knowing we have comp picks to use in place of them.
however, this one made sense. Basically if we are picking from 28 to 32 next year, trading away our 2018 5th rounder was like 7 to 11 slots different at that point. We moved up 20 spots, and got Woods. For essentially those 7-11 spots difference next year. This was a win for us.

Plus we could have a 5th round comp pick, or enough 6ths and 7ths to move into the 5th. Again, wouldn't want to trade away draft picks. But this trade wasn't really giving away a pick, it was borrowing from next years draft. As we didn't lose a pick. It was not like we gave 2 for 1.

 

[CATCH17]

Exactly.

Watt will be much better in a 3-4. Simple as that

Watt just didn't look like a 4-3 player at all to me.

He is a dynamic player and we are not a dynamic defense.

Taco couldn't be anymore classic of a Dlinemen to fit in our classic scheme.

 

[Toruk_Makto]

6) I think...the Cowboys might actually be aiming to get rid of fifth round picks.
I recently stumbled on to an article (check it out, last item in the piece) that claimed that 5th round picks as just as much lottery-ticket-level as 6th and 7th rounders, and that the Patriots have taken advantage of that fact by making alternative use of 6th rounders. This got me thinking about how cavalier Dallas has been with its 5th rounders in recent years, and it makes me wonder: has Dallas discovered and taken advantage of a market inefficiency?

After all, there is no way the average NFL team sees 5th rounders as just as (not) valuable as 7th rounders. That means using your 5th rounder for some other purpose can be used to generate value. Sure, Dallas used its 2018 5th rounder in order to secure Xavier Woods, but what if part of the team's willingness to do so beyond the upcoming replacement comp picks was the knowledge that 5th rounders are particularly not special?

I'm not saying that Dallas literally wants to be rid of picks in the round, but with what little we know there is a solid implication that the team doesn't put up as much of a fight for picks in the round.


If that is the Cowboys thinking I strongly disagree. When Buffalo used the Cowboys 5th round pick on QB Nathan Peterman of Pittsburgh I was growling. Thought he had potential starter qualities and could have been good trade bait in a couple of years. I know all that is based on the Cowboys not trading for Cassell but still....

It's not the Cowboys thinking so much it's the acknowledgement that once you're in the Kate rounds whether that's the 5th or 7th round it's a.... Shot in the dark.

It's why I always laugh when people bemoan how poorly we do on day 3 meanwhile taking for granted our day 1 success. As if doing the common thing uncommonly well should be overlooked.

 

[Toruk_Makto]

Watt just didn't look like a 4-3 player at all to me.

He is a dynamic player and we are not a dynamic defense.

Taco couldn't be anymore classic of a Dlinemen to fit in our classic scheme.

I wanted Watt but I've become increasingly comfortable with Taco.

Having said that your reasoning doesn't make sense. The solution for not being a dynamic defense is TAKING dynamic players reaching a critical mass and then experimenting with what you have.

And for the record guys like Awuzie and Woods are dynamic. Didn't stop the Cowboys from selecting them for our scheme.

 

[Irvin88_4life]

I guess some will want to turn this into an Ellis vs. Moss pick in some kind of way. It has no bearing as to who compares to who in 2 years, 5 years or 15 years.
Last I seen, Moss did not bring a SB trophy to the vikings in his time there. Nor for any other teams. Though he played in 2 SB's, he was on the losing end both times. Once with NE, once with SF.

I do not remember Moss ever playing with San Francisco much less making it to the superbowl and losing it. The only one they lost I can remember was against Baltimore in the superdome when the lights went.......Moss wasn't on that team

 

[SHAMSzy]

The beauty of Charlton is you know he will be serviceable on the DL at a number of positions. It would be great if he ends up being a bookend DE, but this draft pick is a huge win from the FO if Charlton can be a very solid, dependable DL. Something we really lack/need.

 

[DogFace]

My top 2 pre-draft were Taco and McDowell.

McDowell's character either pushed him down or removed him from their board. Marinelli might have given him a thumbs down after he came forca visit.

My 3rd choice at #28 was Awuzie.

I'd like to hear some of your insight on Awuzie. I've heard a lot of conflicting info.