Some of the best WRs ever

[Q_the_man]

How fast were they....in the 40. I take guesses to....

Rice

Irvin

Chris Carter

Largent

Monk

Swann

Tim Brown

Henry Ellard

Fryar

Jimmy Smith

Just asking because I need to know how many ran a 4.3 or even a 4.4

 

[theogt]

All of these guys came out at a time where off-season training for the Combine wasn't necessary. When you read stories about guys running 4.3s you'll sometimes see blurbs about how they ran in the 4.6s or 4.7s prior to their training. In other words, a player can "learn" how to run a better 40. That doesn't necessarily make the player faster on the playing field, of course, but assuming every college player has equal access to training (probably not true) putting players' 40s next to each other does show something.

The guys you listed probably would have ran 4.3s and 4.4s if they had went through the training players go through today.

 

[joseephuss]

All of these guys came out at a time where off-season training for the Combine wasn't necessary. When you read stories about guys running 4.3s you'll sometimes see blurbs about how they ran in the 4.6s or 4.7s prior to their training. In other words, a player can "learn" how to run a better 40. That doesn't necessarily make the player faster on the playing field, of course, but assuming every college player has equal access to training (probably not true) putting players' 40s next to each other does show something.

The guys you listed probably would have ran 4.3s and 4.4s if they had went through the training players go through today.

I agree with much of what you said. I don't think Carter or Irvin would ever be that fast(4.3-4.4 range) even with that specific type of training. It just isn't about speed. Speed can be the difference between two players if all their other skills are the same. I know all those guys were fast enough on a football field. I don't know their specific times.

 

[theogt]

I agree with much of what you said. I don't think Carter or Irvin would ever be that fast(4.3-4.4 range) even with that specific type of training. It just isn't about speed. Speed can be the difference between two players if all their other skills are the same. I know all those guys were fast enough on a football field. I don't know their specific times.

This is probably true, but guys like Dwayne Jarrett would probably be more successful in the NFL if they played under the interference rules in effect when those guys played.

 

[Q_the_man]

My point being, that basically the top WR ever ran a 4.5 or slower but 4.4 and 4.3 guys go higher I wonder why.....

Point in case Jarrett compared to Ginn, just think Jarrett is bigger and stronger can catch great and go across the middle and take a hit....

Now if Ginn goes across the middle and take the same hit it could be over.....

The only fast WR that I say that really starred throughout their careers are:

Moss, TO, Torry Holt, Maybe Steve Smith but he has to stay healthy a couple more years..

Fast WRs hardly if ever play a full career without injury throughout their career, give me a big Productive WR that plays 16 games every year, instead of a fast WR who averages 13 games a year for their career.....

Plus when a fast WR gets hurt they never come back the same because alot of times they relie on speed

 

[Doomsday101]

How fast were they....in the 40. I take guesses to....

Rice

Irvin

Chris Carter

Largent

Monk

Swann

Tim Brown

Henry Ellard

Fryar

Jimmy Smith

Just asking because I need to know how many ran a 4.3 or even a 4.4

I would add Charlie Joiner who lead the NFL in receptions before Largent broke his record.

 

[ABQCOWBOY]

My point being, that basically the top WR ever ran a 4.5 or slower but 4.4 and 4.3 guys go higher I wonder why.....

Point in case Jarrett compared to Ginn, just think Jarrett is bigger and stronger can catch great and go across the middle and take a hit....

Now if Ginn goes across the middle and take the same hit it could be over.....

The only fast WR that I say that really starred throughout their careers are:

Moss, TO, Torry Holt, Maybe Steve Smith but he has to stay hefthy a couple more years..

Fast WRs hardly if ever play a full career without injury throughout their career, give me a big Productive WR that plays 16 games every year, instead of a fast WR who averages 13 games a year for their career.....

Plus when a fast WR gets hurt they never come back the same because alot of times they relly on speed

I don't think you have to be a 4.4 guy in the NFL to be succesful at WR but there are plenty of fast guys who have been starters and succesful ones. Chandler, Jefferson, Brown, Lofton, Ellard, Bruce, Reed, Fryer, Clark, Morgan, Holt, Sharp, Rison, Galloway, all fast guys.

 

[Stash]

I wonder if we'll still see these posts after Jarrett runs a slower 40 time than Joe Staley's?

 

[Q_the_man]

I wonder if we'll still see these posts after Jarrett runs a slower 40 time than Joe Staley's?

Do we go by game tape or Combine workout speed, if so I guess Emmitt should have got drafted in the 5th round

 

[Stash]

Do we go by game tape or Combine workout speed, if so I guess Emmitt should have got drafted in the 5th round

How fast was Mike Williams, the last big USC receiver?

What was his 40 time again?

If we wanted 'Chariots of Fire' speed, we should have kept Keyshawn.

 

[Chocolate Lab]

My point being, that basically the top WR ever ran a 4.5 or slower but 4.4 and 4.3 guys go higher I wonder why.....

Point in case Jarrett compared to Ginn, just think Jarrett is bigger and stronger can catch great and go across the middle and take a hit....

Now if Ginn goes across the middle and take the same hit it could be over.....

The only fast WR that I say that really starred throughout their careers are:

Moss, TO, Torry Holt, Maybe Steve Smith but he has to stay healthy a couple more years..

Fast WRs hardly if ever play a full career without injury throughout their career, give me a big Productive WR that plays 16 games every year, instead of a fast WR who averages 13 games a year for their career.....

Plus when a fast WR gets hurt they never come back the same because alot of times they relie on speed

I totally disagree. Quick, list your top 10 WRs in the league and then tell me how many of them don't have at least far better than average speed.

That's why speed is so important. Every year, several big, slow guys who were great in college are touted with the argument that Jerry Rice or Irvin ran a 4.6, and every year several of them flop. NFL corners are just too good if you can't get any separation.

And as has been said, you can't compare the times run today with the times run in the past. There is too much specialized training, better surfaces, and downright cheating in the case of Pro Days to do that.

 

[AbeBeta]

You can't compare speeds across eras -- there was far less "speed" centered training back when guys like Rice were coming out.

 

[joseephuss]

I totally disagree. Quick, list your top 10 WRs in the league and then tell me how many of them don't have at least far better than average speed.

That's why speed is so important. Every year, several big, slow guys who were great in college are touted with the argument that Jerry Rice or Irvin ran a 4.6, and every year several of them flop. NFL corners are just too good if you can't get any separation.

And as has been said, you can't compare the times run today with the times run in the past. There is too much specialized training, better surfaces, and downright cheating in the case of Pro Days to do that.

A lot of those guys relied on being faster than the people covering them in college even though they were not really that fast. They would maybe face 3 or 4 guys with real speed covering them during the season. Once they got to the pros, their speed was nullified by the speed of the corners and they did not have well rounded enough skills to get by. Guys like Rice and Irvin did more than just get separation using speed. They did a lot of other things and did them very well.

You really can't pick a receiver based on speed alone or speed as the top priority. Having speed is a plus, but not at the sake of giving up other important skills and talents. Good route running, good body control, good use of the body(sheilding for example), good hands, smarts, desire, dedication are all important to a receiver and I am probably leaving out a few others before ever mentioning speed or size.

 

[Chocolate Lab]

Of course speed isn't the only quality... There isn't any one single quality. You still need quickness, toughness, and of course good hands.

But I do think speed is hugely important. And not 40 speed, but your real speed on the field, which guys like Rice actually had regardless of what he might have run in shorts on a March afternoon.

But thanks for not bringing up Randal Williams. I was waiting for that one from someone. :

 

[joseephuss]

Of course speed isn't the only quality... There isn't any one single quality. You still need quickness, toughness, and of course good hands.

But I do think speed is hugely important.

But thanks for not bringing up Randal Williams. I was waiting for that one from someone. :

He had it all. It was a conspiracy that he hasn't made it yet. :laugh2:

 

[AbeBeta]

He had it all. It was a conspiracy that he hasn't made it yet. :laugh2:

Williams has started a number of games in Oakland (as a TE). He's had over 40 catches for them in 2 seasons.

 

[ZeroClub]

You can't compare speeds across eras -- there was far less "speed" centered training back when guys like Rice were coming out.

Very true.

Bob Hayes had an official 40 time of 4.4. He said he was quicker, but that the scouts didn't believe anybody could run faster than 4.4.

The passing game is very different as a result of rules changes (what now is and isn't allowable by rule).

Had he played under the rules of today, Bob Hayes would have been beyond incredible while playing against his 1960's and 1970's peers.

 

[2much2soon]

How fast were they....in the 40. I take guesses to....

Rice

Irvin

Chris Carter

Largent

Monk

Swann

Tim Brown

Henry Ellard

Fryar

Jimmy Smith

Just asking because I need to know how many ran a 4.3 or even a 4.4

Largent always looked capable of clicking off a wind-aided 5.4 when he was on the field.
Problem was, nobody could cover the guy. And his hands were solid gold money.
Carter and Monk weren't really burners, although not in the slow motion class of Largent. Jimmy Smith wasn't really scaring anyone with his speed either.
Being a master of the position goes a long way toward covering lack of speed.
Speed sure doesn't hurt but, like others have mentioned, nowadays many fast college kids are getting trained to put up blazing fast track times for draft purposes.
They oughta time them in full pads running with a CB next to them. It would be a lot more informative.

 

[Doomsday101]

Largent always looked capable of clicking off a wind-aided 5.4 when he was on the field.
Problem was, nobody could cover the guy. And his hands were solid gold money.
Carter and Monk weren't really burners, although not in the slow motion class of Largent. Jimmy Smith wasn't really scaring anyone with his speed either.
Being a master of the position goes a long way toward covering lack of speed.
Speed sure doesn't hurt but, like others have mentioned, nowadays many fast college kids are getting trained to put up blazing fast track times for draft purposes.
They oughta time them in full pads running with a CB next to them. It would be a lot more informative.

I agree. How a player uses what speed he has means a lot. Guys like Largent ran great routs and had a good burst coming out of his breaks that would allow separation. I think it is important to have a guy with very good speed as part of your WR core to help stretch a defense but the guys who are great rout runners normally end up being the better WR regardless of their speed.

 

[tyke1doe]

Do we go by game tape or Combine workout speed, if so I guess Emmitt should have got drafted in the 5th round

Be careful comparing running backs with wide receivers.

Emmitt may have been clock-watch slow, but he was always breaking long runs, and that against top teams in the SEC.

Jarrett scored many of his touchdowns in the redzone and by outmuscling, outjumping smaller DBs.

There's a difference between creating separation as a receiver and running away from faster defenders, as was the case with Emmitt Smith.