State of the Salary Cap

[Nightman]

As of June 3rd the Cowboys are now 19m UNDER the adjusted salary cap of 170.1m(NFLPA)

They have all of their 2017 Draft Picks signed but JLewis and have 90 players in total under contract...... only the Top 51 contracts count this time of year and Lewis' deal will have a minimal impact on the cap, if at all

Tony Romo is officially retired and his contract will count 10.7m this year and 8.9m next year but those Dead Money hits are already accounted for in the 19m under the cap....... DAL also has another 18m in cap space available within the contracts of Dez Bryant, JWitten and TCrawford...... they also have another 4.3m tied up in cut-able vets like Hanna, Morris and Wilber....... obviously the cap doesn't dictate their roster status and they should be judged by their on the field value only

Please do not mention ZMartin when talking about what to do with any cap space....... he is already under contract for 2.8m this year and 9.3m next year....... if he gets extended he will only LOWER his cap numbers for 2018 ......any large cap hits won't come until 2020

Personally I would max out the savings and try to roll over 30m+ to 2018 and get a War Daddy and build the War Chest for the future but DAL doesn't operate that way..... we will most likely sit on most of the cap space and roll over around 10m to 2018......that would put us around 30m under for next year ....either way the cap is no longer an issue as predicted and with future cap raises it won't be for some time...... RIP Cap Hell stories or the dangers of kicking the can down the road theories

 

[Manwiththeplan]

I thought Jourdan Lewis signed? Either way, as mentioned, he'll have a minimal impact on the cap. I'm not sure if there is a realistic means to improve the team in 2017, but in 2018 I'd definitely be willing to spend. Ziggy Ansah would be near the top of my list.

 

[ksadler1]

I thought Jourdan Lewis signed?

Too lazy to look it up, but I'm pretty sure he did.....

 

[big dog cowboy]

As of June 3rd the Cowboys are now 19m UNDER the adjusted salary cap of 170.1m(NFLPA)

They have all of their 2017 Draft Picks signed but JLewis and have 90 players in total under contract...... only the Top 51 contracts count this time of year and Lewis' deal will have a minimal impact on the cap, if at all

Tony Romo is officially retired and his contract will count 10.7m this year and 8.9m next year but those Dead Money hits are already accounted for in the 19m under the cap....... DAL also has another 18m in cap space available within the contracts of Dez Bryant, JWitten and TCrawford...... they also have another 4.3m tied up in cut-able vets like Hanna, Morris and Wilber....... obviously the cap doesn't dictate their roster status and they should be judged by their on the field value only

Please do not mention ZMartin when talking about what to do with any cap space....... he is already under contract for 2.8m this year and 9.3m next year....... if he gets extended he will only LOWER his cap numbers for 2018 ......any large cap hits won't come until 2020

Personally I would max out the savings and try to roll over 30m+ to 2018 and get a War Daddy and build the War Chest for the future but DAL doesn't operate that way..... we will most likely sit on most of the cap space and roll over around 10m to 2018......that would put us around 30m under for next year ....either way the cap is no longer an issue as predicted and with future cap raises it won't be for some time...... RIP Cap Hell stories or the dangers of kicking the can down the road theories

Thanks!!!

 

[Nightman]

Too lazy to look it up, but I'm pretty sure he did.....

I haven't seen that anywhere

 

[ksadler1]

I haven't seen that anywhere

I just looked it up. You're correct. He hasn't signed yet.....

 

[Wood]

As of June 3rd the Cowboys are now 19m UNDER the adjusted salary cap of 170.1m(NFLPA)

They have all of their 2017 Draft Picks signed but JLewis and have 90 players in total under contract...... only the Top 51 contracts count this time of year and Lewis' deal will have a minimal impact on the cap, if at all

Tony Romo is officially retired and his contract will count 10.7m this year and 8.9m next year but those Dead Money hits are already accounted for in the 19m under the cap....... DAL also has another 18m in cap space available within the contracts of Dez Bryant, JWitten and TCrawford...... they also have another 4.3m tied up in cut-able vets like Hanna, Morris and Wilber....... obviously the cap doesn't dictate their roster status and they should be judged by their on the field value only

Please do not mention ZMartin when talking about what to do with any cap space....... he is already under contract for 2.8m this year and 9.3m next year....... if he gets extended he will only LOWER his cap numbers for 2018 ......any large cap hits won't come until 2020

Personally I would max out the savings and try to roll over 30m+ to 2018 and get a War Daddy and build the War Chest for the future but DAL doesn't operate that way..... we will most likely sit on most of the cap space and roll over around 10m to 2018......that would put us around 30m under for next year ....either way the cap is no longer an issue as predicted and with future cap raises it won't be for some time...... RIP Cap Hell stories or the dangers of kicking the can down the road theories

ok so I wasn't only one annoyed at incessant response of lets resign Martin with cap space. He is under-contract and doesn't improve the team any further unless he can be cloned. Instead the talk should be about making trades with teams who are not happy with salary of players at need positions for Dallas like OG/RT/DE/DB or a rookie on their team will unseat a veteran player. Dallas is not a finished product and Stephen shouldn't operate like they are. Dak & Zeke were a start thats it.

 

[TonyS]

Tony Romo is officially released and his contract will count 10.7m this year and 8.9m next year but those Dead Money hits are already accounted for in the 19m under the cap.......

FIFY...unless I missed an announcement today.

 

[Nightman]

FIFY...unless I missed an announcement today.

Distinction without a difference....... he could come back to the NFL either way

 

[FuzzyLumpkins]

As of June 3rd the Cowboys are now 19m UNDER the adjusted salary cap of 170.1m(NFLPA)

They have all of their 2017 Draft Picks signed but JLewis and have 90 players in total under contract...... only the Top 51 contracts count this time of year and Lewis' deal will have a minimal impact on the cap, if at all

Tony Romo is officially retired and his contract will count 10.7m this year and 8.9m next year but those Dead Money hits are already accounted for in the 19m under the cap....... DAL also has another 18m in cap space available within the contracts of Dez Bryant, JWitten and TCrawford...... they also have another 4.3m tied up in cut-able vets like Hanna, Morris and Wilber....... obviously the cap doesn't dictate their roster status and they should be judged by their on the field value only

Please do not mention ZMartin when talking about what to do with any cap space....... he is already under contract for 2.8m this year and 9.3m next year....... if he gets extended he will only LOWER his cap numbers for 2018 ......any large cap hits won't come until 2020

Personally I would max out the savings and try to roll over 30m+ to 2018 and get a War Daddy and build the War Chest for the future but DAL doesn't operate that way..... we will most likely sit on most of the cap space and roll over around 10m to 2018......that would put us around 30m under for next year ....either way the cap is no longer an issue as predicted and with future cap raises it won't be for some time...... RIP Cap Hell stories or the dangers of kicking the can down the road theories

There is nothing preventing them from "maxxing out" next year if they so choose. There is no opportunity cost for not doing it this year.

 

[Nightman]

There is nothing preventing them from "maxxing out" next year if they so choose. There is no opportunity cost for not doing it this year.

They are paying Dez, Witen and TCrawford 39m this year on the cap
They could pay them as low as 21m........that is 18m in "dead money" that could be used or rolled over

Once the season is over that cap space is gone forever.......... deciding to overpay now is a lot worse than having real dead money later....rolled over money can be used for years to come in the future, especially at large amounts

If DAL maxxed out at say 40m under this year they would be at 9m under year .......if they roll over 30m they would be at 39m under to start next year

If they stay as is they can only rollover 10m and next years cap is a little better at 13m for a total of 23m under.... I would take the 39m under every time

@waldoputty did a great series of ssheets over the winter showing how much cap space they are wasting and how much they will still have going forward.....DAL runs their books like a Hollywood movie studio that grosses 500m but says a movie loses money after VPs, production costs, advertisments and other artificail costs to hide profits on paper

 

[waldoputty]

They are paying Dez, Witen and TCrawford 39m this year on the cap
They could pay them as low as 21m........that is 18m in "dead money" that could be used or rolled over

Once the season is over that cap space is gone forever.......... deciding to overpay now is a lot worse than having real dead money later....rolled over money can be used for years to come in the future, especially at large amounts

If DAL maxxed out at say 40m under this year they would be at 9m under year .......if they roll over 30m they would be at 39m under to start next year

If they stay as is they can only rollover 10m and next years cap is a little better at 13m for a total of 23m under.... I would take the 39m under every time

@waldoputty did a great series of ssheets over the winter showing how much cap space they are wasting and how much they will still have going forward.....DAL runs their books like a Hollywood movie studio that grosses 500m but says a movie loses money after VPs, production costs, advertisments and other artificail costs to hide profits on paper

hey BK, going to update the spreadsheet soon.
question regarding irving, we could have negotiated a long term contract with him this year instead of just the 2 year deal - right?
i am going to assume 13M/year for martin starting 18 - more than fair?
what do you think aav for la'el would be? i am going to assume long term deal also but have to assume he plays RT now. about 8M a year since he is not proven? the top RT just signed got 9M aav i believe.
when you say some cap space is lost forever - thought they can roll it all to next year?

 

[waldoputty]

They are paying Dez, Witen and TCrawford 39m this year on the cap
They could pay them as low as 21m........that is 18m in "dead money" that could be used or rolled over

Once the season is over that cap space is gone forever.......... deciding to overpay now is a lot worse than having real dead money later....rolled over money can be used for years to come in the future, especially at large amounts

If DAL maxxed out at say 40m under this year they would be at 9m under year .......if they roll over 30m they would be at 39m under to start next year

If they stay as is they can only rollover 10m and next years cap is a little better at 13m for a total of 23m under.... I would take the 39m under every time

@waldoputty did a great series of ssheets over the winter showing how much cap space they are wasting and how much they will still have going forward.....DAL runs their books like a Hollywood movie studio that grosses 500m but says a movie loses money after VPs, production costs, advertisments and other artificail costs to hide profits on paper

oh, will also assume dlaw is gone after 17.
assuming dak is not signed to long term until AFTER 19.
not sure what do assume for zeke long term.

 

[Nightman]

hey BK, going to update the spreadsheet soon.
question regarding irving, we could have negotiated a long term contract with him this year instead of just the 2 year deal - right?
i am going to assume 13M/year for martin starting 18 - more than fair?
what do you think aav for la'el would be? i am going to assume long term deal also but have to assume he plays RT now. about 8M a year since he is not proven? the top RT just signed got 9M aav i believe.
when you say some cap space is lost forever - thought they can roll it all to next year?

Irving is still on his rookie deal........ 4 years of team control.....2017 EFA at 680k and 2018 as a RFA at 3m if 1st round tendered

ZMartin will be extended before 2018 and his cap numbers will be low for 2018 and 2019 because of signing bonuses and a restructure in 2019.... I would think 6/65-72m

Cap space is lost if it isn't activated....... the 18m they could get from Witten, Dez and TCrawford expires after the season ..... I would restructure them all just to roll over the 18m

Who knows about LCollins.......it depends on how and where he plays the next 2 years ......if he is an All Pro that is a good problem

 

[waldoputty]

Irving is still on his rookie deal........ 4 years of team control.....2017 EFA at 680k and 2018 as a RFA at 3m if 1st round tendered

ZMartin will be extended before 2018 and his cap numbers will be low for 2018 and 2019 because of signing bonuses and a restructure in 2019.... I would think 6/65-72m

Cap space is lost if it isn't activated....... the 18m they could get from Witten, Dez and TCrawford expires after the season ..... I would restructure them all just to roll over the 18m

Who knows about LCollins.......it depends on how and where he plays the next 2 years ......if he is an All Pro that is a good problem

could you explain the 18m again?
i thought if they do not restructure, future salaries are lower?

 

[FuzzyLumpkins]

They are paying Dez, Witen and TCrawford 39m this year on the cap
They could pay them as low as 21m........that is 18m in "dead money" that could be used or rolled over

Once the season is over that cap space is gone forever.......... deciding to overpay now is a lot worse than having real dead money later....rolled over money can be used for years to come in the future, especially at large amounts

If DAL maxxed out at say 40m under this year they would be at 9m under year .......if they roll over 30m they would be at 39m under to start next year

If they stay as is they can only rollover 10m and next years cap is a little better at 13m for a total of 23m under.... I would take the 39m under every time

@waldoputty did a great series of ssheets over the winter showing how much cap space they are wasting and how much they will still have going forward.....DAL runs their books like a Hollywood movie studio that grosses 500m but says a movie loses money after VPs, production costs, advertisments and other artificail costs to hide profits on paper

I didn't see one spreadsheet and your analogy is crap: points for movie revenues don't have an expiration date and inlays - outlays is an honest way to account. He also made up numbers and left out data. There is no cap space lost and at worst you "lose" the marginal difference from inflation from year to year. He did no such analysis either and rolling it forward mitigates that "gain" completely anyway.

The one thing you are not factoring is the dead money you accrue in future years. it is one for one and while there is not interest it still mitigates the amount you roll over in any one year in subsequent years. Given that we have very few people signed for more than a couple of years and even fewer that have not already been restructured I am not compelled in the least.

I have also not seen any acknowledgement that increasing capital increases demand in the labor market driving up costs. Given the way markets are based on precedent there is no coming back from it.

At the end of the day the Cowboys spend up to the cap in cash spending year after year after year. It is sustainable and efficient They will do so once again this year when they hand Martin a big fat SB

 

[dwreck27]

How does dezs and tcrawfords look?


When's the earliest we can get out from under those bad deals?

 

[StarBoyz83]

How does dezs and tcrawfords look?


When's the earliest we can get out from under those bad deals?

Crawfords is 2 more years not sure on dez

 

[waldoputty]

I didn't see one spreadsheet and your analogy is crap: points for movie revenues don't have an expiration date and inlays - outlays is an honest way to account. He also made up numbers and left out data. There is no cap space lost and at worst you "lose" the marginal difference from inflation from year to year. He did no such analysis either and rolling it forward mitigates that "gain" completely anyway.

The one thing you are not factoring is the dead money you accrue in future years. it is one for one and while there is not interest it still mitigates the amount you roll over in any one year in subsequent years. Given that we have very few people signed for more than a couple of years and even fewer that have not already been restructured I am not compelled in the least.

I have also not seen any acknowledgement that increasing capital increases demand in the labor market driving up costs. Given the way markets are based on precedent there is no coming back from it.

At the end of the day the Cowboys spend up to the cap in cash spending year after year after year. It is sustainable and efficient They will do so once again this year when they hand Martin a big fat SB

those spreadsheets were repeatedly offered to everyone and even incorporated most of things you asked for.
the only one who asked the spreadsheets was bk.

you keep complaining about the $5 million additional salary estimate i made using what i know about free agency.
i tried to tell you that is how these models are done but you cannot seem to accept that is how business is done in many social science math-based models.
the big picture is - was the $5 million estimate pretty good?
the QBs and other players you mentioned did not add up to much, did they?

martin's SB is divided by 5 so the impact is pretty small.
2018 cap already includes over $9M for Martin, which will probably be substantially less than his 2018 cap impact.
of course unless the team is hiding cap space, which is essentially the result of witten's extension.

spend up to cap is irrelevant.
they had space in those 3 contracts that were not used after 13-3 season.
that effectively squeezed the 2017 salary since i believe at least 2 of those contracts were renegotiated in 2016.

a new spreadsheet will be done soon.
especially after i get clarification on a couple points from bk.
i will track the hidden cap space so people can compare.

 

[Nightman]

I didn't see one spreadsheet and your analogy is crap: p

blah blah I am Fuzzy and didn't read a word you wrote but here is why I am right

Find a new routine or go away