The “playbook being outdated” is lazy

[BlueStar22]

I listen to former players and other analyst. Most say that most teams do the same things that we do and just that new concepts are needed.

 

[ConstantReboot]

Sorry, I don’t agree with the initial assertion that we are running 95% the same plays as the Rams. I watched all Dallas games and have seen the Rams 4-5 times. They are not the same plays with the same routes. I 100% agree that the pre snap formations and misdirections need huge changes.

The Rams run an offense similar to when Payton was our OC with a young Romo. Lots of play action. Freezing the linebackers to bite on the run and opening the passing game. We hardly ever use play action. So I have to also disagree that we run 95% of our plays similar to the rams.

 

[ConstantReboot]

It's possible if not probable that these routes are being called to play to the strengths (or limitations) of the QB.

If thats the case why force Dak into a pocket passer mode? Why do we limit his ability to run? Why don't we use play action, bootlegs or RPO?

 

[Parcells4Life]

Our problem is we do none of that and on top of that we play into our tendencies.

It’s been that way for a long time and the coach has never got it fixed.

There are many that have said our reDzone route combinations are garbage too.

All of our players, media, and fans aren’t making this stuff up. The Cowboys coaches do this team no favor and they aren’t calling game like other coaches regardless of how similar the play design is.

And playcalling is different than the play BOOK. Everyone agrees playcalling has not been on par with the best teams in the league.

 

[Parcells4Life]

The Rams run an offense similar to when Payton was our OC with a young Romo. Lots of play action. Freezing the linebackers to bite on the run and opening the passing game. We hardly ever use play action. So I have to also disagree that we run 95% of our plays similar to the rams.

We have the same plays they do. They just use them more than we do.

To say we don’t have the same plays would be our WRs have NEVER run a go route or we’ve never run a HB screen or QB draw, etc.

But arguing about the frequency of such plays is an argument about playCALLING not the playBOOK

 

[BlueStar22]

The Rams run an offense similar to when Payton was our OC with a young Romo. Lots of play action. Freezing the linebackers to bite on the run and opening the passing game. We hardly ever use play action. So I have to also disagree that we run 95% of our plays similar to the rams.

This is exactly what analyst say what is needed here. New concepts...new ideas because most team do the same things.

 

[JeffInDC]

Ive seen everyone on here and radio/internet guys keep saying the playbook is outdated.

Nate Newton, who knows more than anyone of us on here said we run 95% of the same plays post snap as the Rams.

The difference and what we’d like to see changed is the presnap misdirection that causes defenses to hesitate which opens up holes in the run game and pass game.

I’ve said forever that most NFL teams are running about the same playbook since there no true west coast or only air Coryell schemes anymore.

What separates is the timing of the calls. The perfect example is the play vs the Eagles Cooper wanted changed. We didn’t put in a new play in the huddle, we just audibled to one that already existed.

Whoever the new playcaller is, they need to have the openness to change and add some presnap motion.

But they don’t have to throw out the entire playbook.

Not sure how many of us on here have been coaches on any level, but what I DO know is the most successful ones know how to.......ADAPT!!!!!! That is why Linehan no longer has a job. While I can’t remember the various folks that have said this over the years, many that have coached or played have said that almost ALL of the teams run the same plays.....the difference comes down to (obviously) different nomenclature and concepts. A 9 or go route is still a deep pass no matter who’s running or calling the play. Where the best minds have emerged is when they can see such simple modifications to any given play concept to create great natural mismatches for their personnel......and, doing this in the simplest way possible to be able to maximize every players efficyin that given play.

A perfect example of this is how Dallas ALWAYS seemed to run the same, TIRED play on 3rd and 5+ - everyone seemed to run to the sticks and either curl back or sit at the sticks w/ Zeke basically hanging out int the backfield as a last resort. McVay has run a similar play concept on numerous occasions.....with one MAJOR difference - how he used Gurley. He has Gurley actually running an option route that attacks the LB/Nickel Safety based on his alignment. Gurley has scored on this play a few times. Simple design with a major twist. Think back to the route Zeke ran against a LB that essentially won the Detroit game - how many times did anyone see that play AFTER that game? THAT is the type of crap I’m sure the players have complained about regarding Linehan - stuff that works well is RARELY run after the trial run.

 

[Roadtrip635]

All I saw last week was HB dive and HB power over and over.

It was effective because of the misdirection but the play itself wasn’t fancy.

The play action is the same play we have.

The best way to think of the difference in the playbook is look at it as a menu. Our playcaller prefers the fish section (HB dive) no matter what the defense calls.

The Rams have that same fish section in their menu but if defenses are preparing for it, they with call from the steak category or make it look like a steak before calling the fish.

But we have all the same entrees the Rams do. We just haven’t utilized them and they have better sides (presnap motion).

No, we're making fish sticks and they're making oven poached sole in a lemon caper wine sauce. The pre-snap motion, misdirection, formations etc is all part of the play design to disguise and force defenses into making decisions. They use different route combos and concepts to clear spaces and force mismatches. You rarely see them run 3-4wr stop routes straight to the sticks. We're running into stacked boxes more often than they do, but it's less about Dak's ability to beat them and more about the formations they use. We bring in 2 and 3 TEs bringing more players to the box, they use 1 TE sets to keep the defense spread out. Just like in the analogy you tried to use, they might both use fish, but it's about the preparation and creativity that elevate it to something more.

 

[Parcells4Life]

No, we're making fish sticks and they're making oven poached sole in a lemon caper wine sauce. The pre-snap motion, misdirection, formations etc is all part of the play design to disguise and force defenses into making decisions. They use different route combos and concepts to clear spaces and force mismatches. You rarely see them run 3-4wr stop routes straight to the sticks. We're running into stacked boxes more often than they do, but it's less about Dak's ability to beat them and more about the formations they use. We bring in 2 and 3 TEs bringing more players to the box, they use 1 TE sets to keep the defense spread out. Just like in the analogy you tried to use, they might both use fish, but it's about the preparation and creativity that elevate it to something more.

We have same ingredients, this offense just wanted the 10 minute recipe and other use the 30-45 minute recipe. But we don’t need to shop for new ingredients just a new culinary artist to use those ingredients.

 

[Roadtrip635]

We have same ingredients, this offense just wanted the 10 minute recipe and other use the 30-45 minute recipe. But we don’t need to shop for new ingredients just a new culinary artist to use those ingredients.

And that requires new recipes, not cooking from the same old cookbook.

 

[KingintheNorth]

The sports world has been telling you this for years, you just don't want to believe it.

Here's some other "clues"..how many times have you heard Linehan say "I saw the Chiefs do it" or whatever team... ? All coaches steal but Linehan openly talks about having to see someone else do something before he tries to implement it. You need to be innovative, understand coverages and exploit vulnerabilities. You also need to self-scout and make sure you aren't giving away tendencies and tipping plays, something I feel we have struggled with as long as Garrett's been here. Also, Cooper came here and said Linehan immediately asked him for ideas from the Raiders. Then, after I'm guessing a scolding from Jerry, Amari rescinded.

Linehan was either restricted by Garrett's playbook or didn't embrace it and fully utilize it, all while Garrett oversaw the whole thing. You pick what's worse.

 

[Roadtrip635]

The sports world has been telling you this for years, you just don't want to believe it.

Here's some other "clues"..how many times have you heard Linehan say "I saw the Chiefs do it" or whatever team... ? All coaches steal but Linehan openly talks about having to see someone else do something before he tries to implement it. You need to be innovative, understand coverages and exploit vulnerabilities. You also need to self-scout and make sure you aren't giving away tendencies and tipping plays, something I feel we have struggled with as long as Garrett's been here. Also, Cooper came here and said Linehan immediately asked him for ideas from the Raiders. Then, after I'm guessing a scolding from Jerry, Amari rescinded.

Linehan was either restricted by Garrett's playbook or didn't embrace it and fully utilize it, all while Garrett oversaw the whole thing. You pick what's worse.

Jerry is the same way, we didn't need a #1 WR until we played against Houston and saw firsthand in Hopkins what a real #1 WR brings to the team.

 

[Qcard]

Ive seen everyone on here and radio/internet guys keep saying the playbook is outdated.

Nate Newton, who knows more than anyone of us on here said we run 95% of the same plays post snap as the Rams.

The difference and what we’d like to see changed is the presnap misdirection that causes defenses to hesitate which opens up holes in the run game and pass game.

I’ve said forever that most NFL teams are running about the same playbook since there no true west coast or only air Coryell schemes anymore.

What separates is the timing of the calls. The perfect example is the play vs the Eagles Cooper wanted changed. We didn’t put in a new play in the huddle, we just audibled to one that already existed.

Whoever the new playcaller is, they need to have the openness to change and add some presnap motion.

But they don’t have to throw out the entire playbook.

I agree, but a portion of the laziness should be attributed to Linehan.

McVay and these "new" offenses didn't reinvent the wheel but they did exactly what you stated to their respective Offense Coaching tree....they extented another branch.

Hiring Kellen as OC could be a move in line with your expectations, personally idk if it'll work but I see the logic by Garrett/Jerry.

 

[JustChip]

One little broken collar bone. Notice now you can’t land on a QB like that anymore.

Yep. But it wasn't that hit that caused them to change the rules. They wouldn't have changed had it not happened to the media darling Aaron Rodgers.

Jack Tatum would end up forfeiting all of his pay if he played today.

By the way, I wasn't taking a shot at Romo, just the idea by so many on here that he did no wrong. It's the "good ole days" syndrome; i.e., that people only remember the good of the good ole days and conveniently ignore the bad.

 

[Little Jr]

All I saw last week was HB dive and HB power over and over.

It was effective because of the misdirection but the play itself wasn’t fancy.

The play action is the same play we have.

The best way to think of the difference in the playbook is look at it as a menu. Our playcaller prefers the fish section (HB dive) no matter what the defense calls.

The Rams have that same fish section in their menu but if defenses are preparing for it, they with call from the steak category or make it look like a steak before calling the fish.

But we have all the same entrees the Rams do. We just haven’t utilized them and they have better sides (presnap motion).

You keep talking about run plays. That I agree with. Most people talk about the passing game when they say it's out dated and it is and not debatable. Or you can call it simplistic. It's been called out by multiple cowboy players and NFL analyst. If someone watches it and actually knows what they are watching its not hard to see.

 

[glimmerman]

Yep. But it wasn't that hit that caused them to change the rules. They wouldn't have changed had it not happened to the media darling Aaron Rodgers.

Jack Tatum would end up forfeiting all of his pay if he played today.

By the way, I wasn't taking a shot at Romo, just the idea by so many on here that he did no wrong. It's the "good ole days" syndrome; i.e., that people only remember the good of the good ole days and conveniently ignore the bad.

I know your not taking a shot at Romo. When Romo played he had as many haters as Dak does now. After he is gone he is better. Lol

 

[KingintheNorth]

The Saints just schemed a play where a defensive end had to cover Alvin Kamara on a wheel route. When is the last time you saw us exploiting that type of match up?

Yes, the playbook is limited. The concepts are outdated and our tendencies are predictable.

 

[Parcells4Life]

The Saints just schemed a play where a defensive end had to cover Alvin Kamara on a wheel route. When is the last time you saw us exploiting that type of match up?

Yes, the playbook is limited. The concepts are outdated and our tendencies are predictable.

Zeke vs Detroit with game on the line

 

[lukin2006]

It would be nice if they added a 4th page to it.

 

[Vtwin]

If thats the case why force Dak into a pocket passer mode? Why do we limit his ability to run? Why don't we use play action, bootlegs or RPO?

I don't know. I'd love to see more play action and bootlegs. Dak seems to be at his best when in backyard ball mode, using his athleticism to react to what's there instead of going through progressions and sticking to the script.

Whether that is sustainable is the question. I don't think you can expect to survive for long having your QB running a lot as your predominant philosophy. That ability is fantastic as change of pace here and there but I believe you do have to be able to effectively work from the pocket to consistently put up points, especially against the better, faster defenses.