The Great Dakbate

Hawkeye0202

Well-Known Member
Messages
23,224
Reaction score
42,791
That's where I am and evidently so is the team. While they have referenced the next contract, we've yet to see anything out front on that.

I just have the feeling not everyone in management is in the Dak camp at this time.

I'm guessing you have not seen or read comments from Stephen or Jerry regarding Daks next contract. The so-called third-year prove it talk is 100% fan driven. Hell listening to Jerry and Stephen, lead one to believe they'd sign Dak to an extension today if they could. Other words, based on management that matters, Dak has already earned a 2nd contract, the only question is how much.
 

G2

Taco Engineer
Messages
24,426
Reaction score
26,192
That’s part of it. I mentioned several other concerns as well.

Do you have any concerns in Daks passing ability or just defending others criticism ?
I wouldn't call them concerns really, I do know what you mean though.

Throwing mechanics are a process on every throw. It's like a golf swing where multiple things have to be worked on and polished in order to be efficient.
It starts with footwork, which is workable. Under pressure, his footwork is thrown off effecting some of his throws.
Getting his elbow up is challenging after that.

So that's what I see. It's all doable, you have to remember a 2 year QB is getting dissected here as if he's a 10 year vet. The Romo comparisons are ridiculous to even assume.

The deep field throws is another overused phrase. Same with not being able to throw a back shoulder fade. It's BS. If he has protection and time to throw he can throw a fine pass. He also would benefit from an elite WR/TE.
 

Doomsday101

Well-Known Member
Messages
107,762
Reaction score
39,034
I'm guessing you have not seen or read comments from Stephen or Jerry regarding Daks next contract. The so-called third-year prove it talk is 100% fan driven. Hell listening to Jerry and Stephen, lead one to believe they'd sign Dak to an extension today if they could. Other words, based on management that matters, Dak has already earned a 2nd contract, the only question is how much.

Jones also said this

Stephen Jones To Dak Prescott: Be an MVP and You’ll Get Paid:
Jones addressed this type of development by saying: “We all see what some of the other guys are who aren’t Aaron Rodgers, who aren’t Matt Ryan [are getting paid].

How Dak does will play a big part in the kind of offer the Cowboys would be willing to pay. No doubt the Cowboys management is showing confidence in Dak and believe in him but they will still want him to go out and perform to a high level.

https://www.opptrends.com/stephen-jones-to-dak-prescott-be-an-mvp-and-youll-get-paid/
 

Diehardblues

Well-Known Member
Messages
55,286
Reaction score
36,436
I wouldn't call them concerns really, I do know what you mean though.

Throwing mechanics are a process on every throw. It's like a golf swing where multiple things have to be worked on and polished in order to be efficient.
It starts with footwork, which is workable. Under pressure, his footwork is thrown off effecting some of his throws.
Getting his elbow up is challenging after that.

So that's what I see. It's all doable, you have to remember a 2 year QB is getting dissected here as if he's a 10 year vet. The Romo comparisons are ridiculous to even assume.

The deep field throws is another overused phrase. Same with not being able to throw a back shoulder fade. It's BS. If he has protection and time to throw he can throw a fine pass. He also would benefit from an elite WR/TE.
He’s being dissected because of the issues that were raised more visibly last year. How do you respond with the criticism of the better defenses stacking the box forcing Dak to beat them over the top?

Daks struggles like in Denver were well before Elliott was suspended or Smith hurt. And he’s not always going to have all of the talent on the field like in his struggles without Elliott.

We’re hopeful this works itself out but there’s some legit concerns worthy of dissection and discussion especially if we continue not having more success in our passing game .

And yes, having more elite recievers is also a concern especially with the concerns we have at QB and why we are being critical of this bunch of unproven recieving corps.

Is it too early in his career to draw conclusions ? No, because some of these concerns are not all about the talent around him.

Dak has some great assets he brings to the table but these passing skills or lack of them would be a legit concern to any team.
 

G2

Taco Engineer
Messages
24,426
Reaction score
26,192
He’s being dissected because of the issues that were raised more visibly last year.
How do you respond with the criticism of the better defenses stacking the box forcing Fak to beat them over the top?
Daks struggles like in Denver were well before Elliott was suspended or Smith hurt.
And he’s not always going to have all of the talent on the field like in his struggles without Elliott.
We’re hopeful this works itself out but there’s some legit concerns worthy of dissection and discussion especially if we continue not having more success in our passing game .
And yes, having more elite recievers is also a concern especially with the concerns we have at QB and why we are being critical of this bunch of unproven recieving corps.
Is it too early in his career to draw conclusions ? No, because some of these concerns are not all about the talent around him.
Dak has some great assets he brings to the table but these passing skills or lack of them would be a legit concern to any team.

Things are blown out of proportion. Last season he had more attempts and INTs. Obviously effecting his percentage and rating. But he only threw 20 yards less per game compared to his rookie season. The entire offense was struggling. If you can't see the lack of offensive support as being a substantial symptom then you're not being realistic. It also doesn't help when your supposed to be No. 1 WR melts down all season long. Dak has work to do, but it's not as bad a soap opera as some of you suggest.

It's funny. Not too many are even willing to see all of the problems on offense, they just pick what they want.
 

Diehardblues

Well-Known Member
Messages
55,286
Reaction score
36,436
Things are blown out of proportion. Last season he had more attempts and INTs. Obviously effecting his percentage and rating. But he only threw 20 yards less per game compared to his rookie season. The entire offense was struggling. If you can't see the lack of offensive support as being a substantial symptom then you're not being realistic. It also doesn't help when your supposed to be No. 1 WR melts down all season long. Dak has work to do, but it's not as bad a soap opera as some of you suggest.

It's funny. Not too many are even willing to see all of the problems on offense, they just pick what they want.
It’s all part of the discussion. I agree some go too far as there is always extremes. And those of us who are questioning this recieving Corp are doing just that.

In the end it’s all about winning. If we get back on the winning wave that won our hearts over with Dak initially some of this criticism will stop or at least be less meaningful or relevant.
 

NotForLong

Well-Known Member
Messages
8,577
Reaction score
9,605
Dak reads defenses and goes through his progressions pretty well for a second year QB actually. But by all means continue to repeat those false claims.
You casually slide in for a second year QB. You make it sound like he should get a participation award. So which is it.

My claims aren't false. It's you who chose to give him the benefit of the doubt. I am simply stating reality. It was in his college evaluation and I still heard it repeated this year in training camp.

Dont shot the messenger. I own a Dak Jersey. Go Cowboys. Great rookie record. Leader. Dez was a energy suffocating bully. Falcons game.

But he still has weaknesses. And just because every time I point them out as being a factor in any hypothetical discussion on this message board. You all get triggered and spew hateful insults. In some way to demonize me and discredit my opinion as invalid.

A lot of the arguments you use are a hopeful forecast.

You dismiss reality and jump to a natural progression argument. You take a "there's no way he can fail" aproach based on him being Dak. When in reality its him, Daks deficiencies which will hold him back.

I am hopeful for him this year. But in no way can he be considered great. The NFL has his number but I believe the Cowboys will reinvent themselves to suit Daks strengths.
(Which has nothning to do with Wr route Running or speed or hands) none of that BS they are spewing.

No its gonna be an offense that exploits the 20 yds off the line of scrimmage.

We are gonna be a methodical juggernaut
 

NotForLong

Well-Known Member
Messages
8,577
Reaction score
9,605
Jones also said this

Stephen Jones To Dak Prescott: Be an MVP and You’ll Get Paid:
Jones addressed this type of development by saying: “We all see what some of the other guys are who aren’t Aaron Rodgers, who aren’t Matt Ryan [are getting paid].

How Dak does will play a big part in the kind of offer the Cowboys would be willing to pay. No doubt the Cowboys management is showing confidence in Dak and believe in him but they will still want him to go out and perform to a high level.

https://www.opptrends.com/stephen-jones-to-dak-prescott-be-an-mvp-and-youll-get-paid/
If Dak is ever in the MVP discussion again. It's going to be on the shoulders of Zeke. Next time there's an award to be given out it will go to Zeke
 

glimmerman

Well-Known Member
Messages
29,999
Reaction score
29,875
Dak will really have to melt down before the experiment is over. Everyone expected so much in his second year because of his rookie year. Let’s face it. That was gonna be about impossible for him to do. He threw what? 4 picks all year. Who does this in there rookie year. He and this team march right into the playoffs.

I know I expected better play from Dak last season but I also expected better from the whole Offense. Wanted no injuries to our O-Line and didn’t want to see the looming and inevitable suspension happen either. No TD for almost 4 games. We had a better Defense than the rookie season and could have possibly made it through the first round of the playoffs had we made it.

With the way defenses started playing us last season after having film to study. I do put some of last year on our staff for not making some changes. And maybe the Offense was riding the wave of what Dak did the season before and the effort maybe not there by some.

No excuse this year, we will see soon enough what he can do with another year of experience. New hungry to prove themselves WR with a route guru working with them. Expect growing pains early.
 

NotForLong

Well-Known Member
Messages
8,577
Reaction score
9,605
Things are blown out of proportion. Last season he had more attempts and INTs. Obviously effecting his percentage and rating. But he only threw 20 yards less per game compared to his rookie season. The entire offense was struggling. If you can't see the lack of offensive support as being a substantial symptom then you're not being realistic. It also doesn't help when your supposed to be No. 1 WR melts down all season long. Dak has work to do, but it's not as bad a soap opera as some of you suggest.

It's funny. Not too many are even willing to see all of the problems on offense, they just pick what they want.
You actually picked everything you wanted to support Dak.

But continuously blame others.

You sound like a single mother making excuses for her son
 

HungryLion

Well-Known Member
Messages
26,557
Reaction score
60,459
You casually slide in for a second year QB. You make it sound like he should get a participation award. So which is it.

My claims aren't false. It's you who chose to give him the benefit of the doubt. I am simply stating reality. It was in his college evaluation and I still heard it repeated this year in training camp.

Dont shot the messenger. I own a Dak Jersey. Go Cowboys. Great rookie record. Leader. Dez was a energy suffocating bully. Falcons game.

But he still has weaknesses. And just because every time I point them out as being a factor in any hypothetical discussion on this message board. You all get triggered and spew hateful insults. In some way to demonize me and discredit my opinion as invalid.

A lot of the arguments you use are a hopeful forecast.

You dismiss reality and jump to a natural progression argument. You take a "there's no way he can fail" aproach based on him being Dak. When in reality its him, Daks deficiencies which will hold him back.

I am hopeful for him this year. But in no way can he be considered great. The NFL has his number but I believe the Cowboys will reinvent themselves to suit Daks strengths.
(Which has nothning to do with Wr route Running or speed or hands) none of that BS they are spewing.

No its gonna be an offense that exploits the 20 yds off the line of scrimmage.

We are gonna be a methodical juggernaut

I’ve never thrown a personal insult at you. So blameshifting that onto me, isn’t really based in reality.

So don’t accuse me of not being realistic, while making false claims about my behavior.

I clearly stated the, for a second year QB, part for a reason. Nobody “slid” anything in. It was clearly written in my post. Saying I “slid” it in, makes a false assumption about my intentions for saying it. Which couldn’t be further from the truth.

1. It’s pertinent to any Dak discussion to mention he is a second year QB because the nature of the NFL is such that no second year QB excels at reading defenses and going through progressions. That is something that gets improved on over years of playing QB in the league.

2. You made a blanket statement that Dak can’t
Read defenses and doesn’t go through his professions. You did not provide any nuance to the claim, only stating that he cannot do either of those things. Except Dak can do those things, and Dak does do those things pretty well for a QB with his experience level. That is the reality. Saying he absolutely cannot and does not is not reality at all. So again, you preaching to me about reality based arguments is kind of rediculous when I was responding to your post that was false.

If you want to actually break down Dak’s ability to read defense and go through progressions that’s fine. But just outright saying he can’t and doesn’t is false and anybody who watches QB play knows it.

Does he need to improve on those? Of course. But Dak doesn’t play QB in a vacuum. Some of us chooose to judge his performance knowing he is a second year player, playing the toughest position in the league and one that typically takes even the best quarterbacks years to grow and improve into the players they become.
 

DFWJC

Well-Known Member
Messages
59,342
Reaction score
48,190
I know we say it every year, but the season can’t get here soon enough!

Go get ‘em Cowboys, and that means Dak too.
:flagwave:
 
  • Like
Reactions: G2

G2

Taco Engineer
Messages
24,426
Reaction score
26,192
You actually picked everything you wanted to support Dak.

But continuously blame others.

You sound like a single mother making excuses for her son
You're not very good at this. If you're going to conveniently leave out the part where I said Dak needs work, just move on. Your narrative is obvious.
 

Doomsday101

Well-Known Member
Messages
107,762
Reaction score
39,034
If Dak is ever in the MVP discussion again. It's going to be on the shoulders of Zeke. Next time there's an award to be given out it will go to Zeke

If Dak is mentioned as an MVP then it would be because his play is worthy of discussion. No doubt Zeke is a big part of the offense and a focal point of the defense, just as Emmitt in the 90's was a focal point for defense. he did not win rushing title 4 rushing titles for nothing including 3 years in a row. Dallas wants to be a balanced offense with the run and the pass and Zeke provides that aspect to this offense.
 

glimmerman

Well-Known Member
Messages
29,999
Reaction score
29,875
Sample size just not big enough yet. He played great one year. And average the second. Is he in a decline? Did he hit his ceiling? Was it a bump? Is he gonna play better? We won’t know until this year. I know he will need a supporting cast. He isn’t doing this alone. Starts with the staff. Dak needs to do work. Make defenses pay when they stack the box. And they will do it everytime until they consistantly beat it. That was our Offenses problem last year.
 

Doomsday101

Well-Known Member
Messages
107,762
Reaction score
39,034
Sample size just not big enough yet. He played great one year. And average the second. Is he in a decline? Did he hit his ceiling? Was it a bump? Is he gonna play better? We won’t know until this year. I know he will need a supporting cast. He isn’t doing this alone. Starts with the staff.

No doubt this in my view is a big year for Dak. Coming off a lackluster season he has to make improvements within his game and he also has to work with few new faces at WR and TE, he will need to take charge with these guys and work with them to get them on the same page while dealing with high expectations that will be placed on him. I'm glad we do have Zeke because Dak will have a plate full on his hands and if he can come though with a great season then he will have shown himself as the new face of the franchise.
 

kskboys

Well-Known Member
Messages
44,399
Reaction score
47,279
Your wrong. Dak is terrible down field.

If not he would consistantly make teams pay for stacking the box. But he's not. Teams still stack the line. Elliott is such a weapon that teams have to stack the box but Dak is no threat at all so there is no fear from opposing teams.

That is my proof.
I thought you wanted facts?
 
  • Like
Reactions: G2

aikemirv

Well-Known Member
Messages
16,211
Reaction score
9,713
I'm keeping an open mind about Dak.

Was his regression in the back half of last year because he has reached his peak and is only downhill from here? Or did he have PTSD after that debacle in Atlanta?

There are tens of millions of dollars at stake in the answer to this question.

People here have regarded him as the next great Cowboys franchise QB. I'm not one of them.

People here have written him off as a bust and useless. I'm not one of them either.

I will make a final judgement after 2018 with another year of evidence. Let's see what happens.


I am about the same place but, open mind with a side of pessimism or lack of expectation.

There really is nothing more to discuss. 8 weeks til trial by fire opening with Panthers, NYG (who he as consistently struggled with), and Seattle.
 
Top