The myth of Dak compared to reality

Discussion in 'Fan Zone' started by Irvin88_4life, Apr 13, 2019.

  1. Irvin88_4life

    Irvin88_4life Well-Known Member

    15,370 Messages
    16,930 Likes Received
    In this research i wanted to use facts to either prove the myth of Dak true or false. I will not be using the "eye" bias but instead lay out the facts. I used Pro Football reference for most of this research. Folks like to say Dak stepped into the greatest position for a rookie QB ( they say rookie because of the offense that QBs like Mahomes have but not as rookies cause they sat on the bench). I also didn't use guys like Brady because he only threw 3 passes as a rookie........only completed 1 of them so 33.3% competition haha.

    First i will list these QBs that people have said are better than Dak with some of the best players on their team and than at the end give all their stats. These are rookie stats and teams only.

    Peyton Manning QB
    Had Marshall Faulk HB and Marvin Harrison WR, didn't have a terrible OL but wasn't great either.

    Andy Dalton QB (Probowl as rookie)
    Cedric Benson HB, A.J Green WR, Jermaine Gresham TE ( was a probowler that year and was pretty good at this time), also had a decent OL. Thats a really good situation for a rookie QB.

    Matt Ryan QB
    Michael Turner RB (All-pro that year), Roddy White WR (Probowl that year) and a pretty good OL although none made the probowl that year.

    Andrew Luck QB (Probowl as a rookie)
    Had Reggie Wayne WR and that's pretty much it.

    Russell Wilson QB (Probowl as a rookie)
    Marshawn Lynch RB (All-pro), Sidney Rice WR, Golden Tate WR, Doug Baldwin WR, Zach Miller TE and had a really good OL with 2 being probowlers and 1 All-pro. Safe to say Wilson had a much better team as a rookie QB, better coach and by far a better defense than Dak had as a rookie.

    Cam Newton QB (Probowl as rookie)
    Steve Smith WR, Greg Olson TE, Jeremy Shockey TE, DeAngelo Williams RB and a decent OL.

    Ben Roethlisberger QB
    Hines Ward WR, Marvel Smith OT, Alan Faneca LG (All-pro that year), Jeff Hartings C (All-pro that year) Jerome Bettis RB. Here is another case where it's pretty clear Ben had a much better team as a rookie QB. In fact this was most likely the best situation for any QB in league history. He also benefited from a great defense and Hall of Fame coaching. By the way his production decreased the next 2 years like some say about Dak but thats false as well.

    Jameis Winston QB (Probowl as rookie)
    Doug Martin RB (All-pro that year), Mike Evans, Vincent Jackson and a pretty good OL but only 1 going to the probowl that year.

    Deshaun Watson QB
    Lamar Miller RB, DeAndre Hopkins WR, Will Fuller WR and had an ok OL. Only played 6 games that year because he got injured but was tearing up the league in those first 6 games.....helps having the talent he had as well.

    Baker Mayfield QB
    Nick Chubb RB, Duke Johnson RB, Carlos Hyde RB, Jarvis Landry WR, David Njoku TE and a really good OL. I know it's the Browns but this is really good talent on offense for a rookie QB.

    Dan Marino QB (Probowl as a rookie)
    Mark Duper WR, Bob Kuechenberg LG, Dwight Stephenson C, Ed Newman RG and also had 2 great backs in Tony Nathan and FB Andra Franklin. This is a really good offense for a rookie QB. Thought it would be fun to use Marino because his rookie season is a top 10 season for rookies.

    Dak Prescott QB (Probowl as rookie)
    Ezekiel Elliott RB (leading rusher), Jason Witten TE, Dez Bryant WR and 3 all-pro OL. This is a good situation for a rookie QB but it's not the best. OL is the strength but Dez and Witten were on the decline.

    Now let's look at these QBs stats and see how they shape up against each other.

    Peyton Manning 3-13 record.
    56.7% completion. 3739 yards passing. 26 TDs 28 INTs. 6.5 ypa. 233 ypg. 71.2 rating. 1 game winning drive and 1--4th quarter comeback.

    Ben Roethlisberger 13-0 record.
    66.4% completion. 2621 yards passing. 17 TDs 11 INTs. 8.9 ypa. 187 ypg. 98.1 rating. 5 game winning drives. 4--4th quarter comebacks

    Russell Wilson 11-5 record.
    64.1% completion. 3118 yards passing. 26 TDs 10 INTs. 7.9 ypa. 194 ypg. 100 rating. 72.7 QBR. 4 Game winning drives. 3--4th quarter cornerback.

    Andrew Luck 11-5 record.
    54.1% completion. 4374 yards passing. 23 TDs 18 INTs. 7.0 ypa. 273.4 ypg. 76.5 rating. 65.6 QBR. 7 game winning drives. 4--4th quarter comebacks.

    Deshaun Watson 3-3 record.
    61.8% completion. 1699 yards passing. 19 TDs 8 INTs. 8.3 ypa. 242.7 ypg. 103 rating. 83.6 QBR. 0 game winning drives. 4--4th quarter comebacks.

    Matt Ryan 11-5 record.
    61.1% completion. 3440 yards passing. 16 TDs 11 INTs. 7.9 ypa. 215 ypg. 87.7 rating. 68.5 QBR. 4 game winning drives. 2--4th quarter comebacks.

    Jameis Winston 6-10 record.
    58.3% completion. 4042 yards passing. 22 TDs 15 INTs. 7.6 ypa. 252.6 ypg. 84.2 rating. 61.1 QBR. 3 game winning drives. 2--4th quarter comebacks.

    Cam Newton 6-10 record.
    60% completion. 4051 yards passing. 21 TDs 17 INTs. 7.8 ypa. 253.2 ypg. 84.5 rating. 58.1 QBR. 1 game winning drive. 1--4th quarter comeback.

    Andy Dalton 9-7 record
    58.1% completion. 3398 yards passing. 20 TDs 13 INTs. 6.6 ypa. 212.4 ypg. 80.4 rating. 46.9 QBR. 4 game winning drives. 4--4th quarter comebacks.

    Dan Marino 7-2 record.
    58.4% completion. 2210 yards passing. 20 TDs 6 INTs. 7.5 ypa. 200.9 ypg. 96 rating. 2 game winning drives. 1--4th quarter comebacks.

    Carson Wentz 7-9 record.
    62.8% completion. 3782 yards passing. 16 TDs 14 INTs. 6.2 ypa. 236.4 ypg. 79.3 rating. 49.4 QBR. 1 game winning drive. 1--4th quarter comeback.

    Dak Prescott 13-3 record.
    67.8% completion. 3667 yards passing. 23 TDs 4 INTs. 8.0 ypa. 229.2 ypg. 104.9 rating. 78.8 QBR.
    5 game winning drives. 5--4th quarter comebacks.

    So as you can see Dak hasnt had the best situation as a rookie QB and beats most every rookie QB in every stat. So the myth these doubters and haters keep spewing from their mouths about Dak is just that. It's false and a blatant lie. For all the Dak supporters y'all already knew this and are ahead of the others.
    Whirlwin, jwooten15, Luther and 28 others like this.
  2. buybuydandavis

    buybuydandavis Well-Known Member

    8,029 Messages
    6,927 Likes Received
    I'm sold. Dak's totally better than Dan Marino and Peyton Manning.
  3. ShortRound131

    ShortRound131 Well-Known Member

    8,517 Messages
    27,932 Likes Received
    Why are you posting about rookie years? So what?

    ABQCOWBOY Regular Joe....

    47,724 Messages
    14,712 Likes Received
    By taking this position with the "eye" test, you in fact are exibiting a bias. You understand that yes?
  5. pansophy

    pansophy Well-Known Member

    1,851 Messages
    1,768 Likes Received
    RGIII had a rookie breaking year as well and then never played nearly as well again. Could make an argument that is true for Dak as well, so to pull out his rookie year and not look at his following 2 years is biased in itself.

    I think people that doubt Dak primarily doubt him because he is an inaccurate passer. 3rd and 10+ is always a give up screen unless it is at the end of the game. Call people haters if you want but most people see inaccurate passing as a concern, and Dak's play since his rookie year hasn't eliminated that a problem.

    If you look at his 3rd and long data he has a good completion percentage but a poor 1st down success rate. That has been true since his rookie year. I saw some things towards the end of last year I hadn't seen before, mainly sideline throws in the 10-20 yard range that could keep defenses from clogging the middle. I'm still hopeful but I don't understand the hurry to pay him a ton of money. I'd like to see what year 4 brings unless they think they will have to pay even more then.

    I'd say we have a 50/50 shot at being set at QB for a long time versus straddled in cap hell.
  6. JJHLH1

    JJHLH1 Well-Known Member

    2,629 Messages
    5,710 Likes Received
    Dak is a very solid QB. He’s also extremely clutch. We are fortunate to have him. Proud he’s our QB.
  7. CowboysWillRise

    CowboysWillRise Well-Known Member

    7,735 Messages
    11,158 Likes Received
    Because many believe he succeeded despite of himself due to being placed in a perfect position.

    At least that is my assumption on the OPs thread.

    I think it has become somewhat popular belief that most qbs we drafted would have been comparable. Then there is the theory Dak is the only qb who needs talent around him....
    keysersoze, Mr_C, chagus and 7 others like this.
  8. Irvin88_4life

    Irvin88_4life Well-Known Member

    15,370 Messages
    16,930 Likes Received
    Daks 2nd and 3rd year were very similiar, well at least in scoring.

    Also this myth he is inaccurate is false. Just look at his ypa and completion percentage. It doesn't show a dink and dunk passer or inaccurate.
  9. pansophy

    pansophy Well-Known Member

    1,851 Messages
    1,768 Likes Received
    Players are only as good as their weakest skill. Dak succeeded his rookie year in the middle of the field. Year 2 defenses clogged the middle and Dak struggled because he was inaccurate outside the hash -- instead putting that on Dak there was talk of Dez, Witten, and Beasley all declining the same year.

    Dak may have finally thrown defenses out of clogging the middle with the help of Cooper. That keeps up and he'll be fine. Good enough to win with and great under mental pressure. We'll see.
  10. CouchCoach

    CouchCoach Well-Known Member

    14,648 Messages
    24,267 Likes Received
    That looks like a lot of work went into preaching to the choir about his rookie season. He had a great rookie season.

    However, what about when he lost Elliott the following season or started off without Cooper this past season?

    The question I have is what kind of QB is he? The kind that lifts the talent around him or needs to be lifted? Nothing wrong with being the latter as most of them are and if Marino had allowed himself to be lifted, he might have a ring. Elway allowed that or he wouldn't have one.

    With Prescott as the franchise QB, they are going to have to focus more on the team around him and have some luck with their health. That's OK because there aren't a lot of the other kind of QB's to go around and he is in the top half of the QB ladder.
  11. CouchCoach

    CouchCoach Well-Known Member

    14,648 Messages
    24,267 Likes Received
    Just a question and maybe a show of hands. Has anyone changed their position on Dak Prescott with all of these threads about him? Anyone?

    And it is not accurate to say he is an inaccurate passer. He is an inconsistent passer and misses some QB 101 passes, that does not show up in any stats, just the eye test. And they all miss passes but some of the ones he misses are the same type ones he missed in college. And maybe he will get better, I just haven't seen that yet.
  12. ShortRound131

    ShortRound131 Well-Known Member

    8,517 Messages
    27,932 Likes Received
    Sorry not trying to be cranky... you too OP.

    I just don’t understand the endless need to rehash and argue the past. Shrug
  13. Nav22

    Nav22 Well-Known Member

    7,621 Messages
    5,403 Likes Received
    It’s always been hilarious to me how Dak’s stats/W-L record/success somehow “doesn’t count” because of Zeke.

    As if QB is the most important position on the field for 31 NFL teams, but not the Cowboys.

    Someone tell Barry Sanders that he SUCKS because RBs win games all on their own, and he never won crap!
  14. Yobwocs

    Yobwocs Well-Known Member

    167 Messages
    340 Likes Received
    Dak had a superb rookie year that ranks among the best. He had a downfall in his 2nd year and people wondered if he was RGIII part 2. But he stormed back to prove he wasn't a fluke in his 3rd year, and his heroic efforts yielded an 8-2 record to end the year, and the talk around him suddenly got really heavy. Now everybody in the media is talking about him like he's a main steak QB. The conversation in sports talk is currently now: "How much money does Dallas pay him?" So this heavily bashed QB is getting conversations about him be like: "How good can Dallas be with Dak?" or "Where can Dak take the Cowboys?" Underestimate him if you want, but he's beaten the entire NFC except for the Panthers and the Rams, so the trashtalking arrogance of other teams laughing off Dak makes me laugh. He'll just beat you again next year... and yes, I'm looking right at you.. Eagles fans. You guys are terrible, and deluded.
    Last edited: Apr 13, 2019
  15. RoboQB

    RoboQB Well-Known Member

    3,542 Messages
    4,271 Likes Received
    I love the claim that Dez was on the decline coming into that year... smh.
    Yeah, and Witten was so bad back then that they begged him to come back
    midseason last year... again, smh and lol.

    The glaring omission of RG3 is, well, glaring... lol.

    And the dreaded hate towards the "eye" test. Oh and don't forget ignoring the
    differences in today's game compared to the1980s and 1990s... sheesh.

    It was an interesting read, and I appreciate the effort, but this screams "agenda".

    I still believe Dak is a work in progress. I'm no hater, but I'm not getting out the anointing oil just yet.
    WillieBeamen likes this.
  16. Rockport

    Rockport AmberBeer Zone Supporter

    12,794 Messages
    10,036 Likes Received
    I only use the eye ball test. Dak wins. Discussion over.
  17. buybuydandavis

    buybuydandavis Well-Known Member

    8,029 Messages
    6,927 Likes Received
    Any example of a QB with 3 1st Team All Pros on the oline and the league leading rusher, also 1st Team All Pro? No? Didn't think so. 1st Team All Pros. They don't grow on trees.

    A brief search and I didn't find a team since the merger.

    Saying that Witten and Dez were "on the declline" is one HOF player and an All Pro the last time he had a QB. That's what they were on the decline from. Dez even squeezed onto the Pro Bowl.

    For comparison, during the SB years for Aikman, the oline didn't get more than one 1st Team All Pro nod in any single year.
    aria, Swagger, Proof and 3 others like this.
  18. CowboysWillRise

    CowboysWillRise Well-Known Member

    7,735 Messages
    11,158 Likes Received
    Yeah I get it, but its the offseason and its loooooooong.
    ShortRound131 likes this.
  19. Ranching

    Ranching Well-Known Member

    19,787 Messages
    50,936 Likes Received
    Imagine what he could have done if his head coach didnt suck?
    Mr_C, glimmerman, DandyDon52 and 6 others like this.
  20. pansophy

    pansophy Well-Known Member

    1,851 Messages
    1,768 Likes Received
    This would argue that he is a dink and dunk passer in a league that is not...
    Dodger12 likes this.

Share This Page