This Team Will Flip The Switch

[casmith07]

My reactions to Jason Garrett are not knee jerk. They are based on his entire body of work as an offensive coordinator, and his limited success as a head coach.

What qualifies him to be where he is?

Was he a good QB Coach? He was the Dolphins QB coach in 2005-2006. 2005 is the FIRST year he was even a coach. Keep this in mind 2005!!!

I don't see anything he did in those TWO years as a QB coach that would qualify him to be an offensive coordinator in Dallas in 2007.

The offense has taken steps back from 2007 to 2010...

He is promoted to HEAD COACH.... FOUR YEARS as an offensive coordinator, SIX TOTAL years as a COACH... and he is a HEAD COACH now?

Please tell me where in the history of the NFL where a coach became a head coach after first becoming a position coach six years prior.

Tell me where someone became an offensive coordinator after just 6 years of coaching experience, let alone head coach...

He isn't qualified and IT SHOWS. Is he intellectual? Sure. Does he say the right things? Sure. Do we have evidence that he knows what he is doing? No we do not.

Part of the problem the last few years has been the offense. Everyone wanted Wade fired, but Jason should have been fired too.

The offense is a mess after 4 years under Garrett. We hired a retread offensive line coach in Houck.

Look what Rob Ryan did when he came in as coordinator. He brought in some of his coaches that he had experience with, and hired a new defensive line coach. He wanted to get a new secondary coach as well, but I think he was hired as a defensive coordinator.

Garrett hires his brother and some of his friends from his limited coaching tree.

Garrett has struggled to get wide receivers involved in the game since Terrell Owens was here... We still see those struggles.

I'm sorry man, the guy just isn't qualified. I think someone sold Jerry a raw deal here. He probably felt dumb letting Sean Payton go, and didn't want to miss out on an up and coming young coach.

Maybe Garrett is that, but he really isn't ready and it shows. Our offense is so vanilla and predictable. This guy doesn't have years of developing a scheme to put players in position to beat top defensive coaches (or even an offensive line coach...)

We better do something at offensive coordinator next year.

Hire a head coach who gets fired who used to be an offensive coordinator ala Norv Turner.

Hire one of the leagues top offensive coordinators who is going to be replaced.

Hire a top college head coach who is offensive minded.

Hire a top offensive position coach.

It's disgusting how quickly Jason Garrett was promoted before he should have been.

I disagree on this. I think Jason Garrett is an excellent leader. I think he has the look and the makeup for head coaching, easily. I also think that despite what some people think, he is a capable coordinator, because he's shown it.

I think that he needs some help learning how to make adjustments in-game, however. He doesn't do well making in-game adjustments and while we didn't get a chance to do much of anything on Sunday, in our previous losses we've seen it happen: A failure to adjust to the Patriots loading the box, a failure to adjust to having a 24 point lead against the offensively inept Lions (the real headscratcher), along with other games in the past -- the loss to GB on the road in 2009 comes to mind, where we were running shotgun a mind-boggling amount of times.

Many of the other losses have been because we just simply don't have the offensive line to get the job done against bigger, stronger defensive front 7s (Minnesota in the playoffs). The offensive line is also the reason for the offensive regression that you mention since 2007, in my opinion. It's clear with the roster churn that it isn't as if Jason Garrett wanted to keep going with lumbering, aging players along the offensive line from 08-10. But the churn happened entirely too late.

So now we have what we have, which is a work in progress. But, that still doesn't excuse Garrett from not gameplanning around any of the few strengths that this line and this offense has. There's a reason why the freeze draw has worked so well over the years - because teams are definitely playing the pass first against our guys like Austin, Witten, and now Bryant and Robinson. We also have two backs (Jones and Murray) who are more than capable of picking up 5-10 yards in a flash out of that draw. To me, it's very frustrating that it took until Week 8 to really bring that draw back.

At any rate, what I'm saying is that Jason Garrett is the right guy for head coach, IMO, but he shouldn't be averse to hiring an offensive coordinator if the right guy comes around after this year.

 

[TheDude]

I disagree on this. I think Jason Garrett is an excellent leader. I think he has the look and the makeup for head coaching, easily. I also think that despite what some people think, he is a capable coordinator, because he's shown it.

I think that he needs some help learning how to make adjustments in-game, however. He doesn't do well making in-game adjustments and while we didn't get a chance to do much of anything on Sunday, in our previous losses we've seen it happen: A failure to adjust to the Patriots loading the box, a failure to adjust to having a 24 point lead against the offensively inept Lions (the real headscratcher), along with other games in the past -- the loss to GB on the road in 2009 comes to mind, where we were running shotgun a mind-boggling amount of times.

with all due respect, I have no idea how you can "prove" to be an excellent coordinator and be incompetant at making adjustments. As coachscout puts it, its about schemes now and how you adjust to conteract them.

Many of the other losses have been because we just simply don't have the offensive line to get the job done against bigger, stronger defensive front 7s (Minnesota in the playoffs). The offensive line is also the reason for the offensive regression that you mention since 2007, in my opinion. It's clear with the roster churn that it isn't as if Jason Garrett wanted to keep going with lumbering, aging players along the offensive line from 08-10. But the churn happened entirely too late.

Again 5 years and just now he begins to redesign the line. And is outsmarting everyone by keeping the king of liking plodding line - Houck. Even talking him out of retirement. This is a leader?

So now we have what we have, which is a work in progress. But, that still doesn't excuse Garrett from not gameplanning around any of the few strengths that this line and this offense has. There's a reason why the freeze draw has worked so well over the years - because teams are definitely playing the pass first against our guys like Austin, Witten, and now Bryant and Robinson. We also have two backs (Jones and Murray) who are more than capable of picking up 5-10 yards in a flash out of that draw. To me, it's very frustrating that it took until Week 8 to really bring that draw back.

At any rate, what I'm saying is that Jason Garrett is the right guy for head coach, IMO, but he shouldn't be averse to hiring an offensive coordinator if the right guy comes around after this year.

Again, the best leaders know their limitations and hire people who can make the org better. He has been struggling for a few years with similar issues and learned nothing. This smells of egos I have been exposed to that come from Ivy league guys who think they are "the smartest guy in the room." "no one can out plan me." If I fail its because you suck.

 

[Pottsville Maroons]

He is promoted to HEAD COACH.... FOUR YEARS as an offensive coordinator, SIX TOTAL years as a COACH... and he is a HEAD COACH now?

Please tell me where in the history of the NFL where a coach became a head coach after first becoming a position coach six years prior.

Tell me where someone became an offensive coordinator after just 6 years of coaching experience, let alone head coach...

Well, depending on how you count his 2 years as player/coach before immediately being named the Giants' Defensive Coordinator, where he served for 5 years before becoming the first Head Coach of the Dallas Cowboys, Tom Landry comes close to answering your question. I'm NOT trying to draw comparisons, just answering your question.

I'm not usually very negative about the Cowboys, but regarding your original post, this team has shown it has trouble finding the wall, much less the switch that needs to be flipped.

 

[bigE79]

Exactly. I hate these fans who are so quick to judge and blame. I hate them more than I hate philly, skin, and giant fans....

more than i hate yankees fans...

What id like to know is where the hell they all came from.Anytime we lose a game,more clowns come to the board pretending to be cowboy fans just to start ****,when we all know their trolls.

 

[TheDude]

Well, depending on how you count his 2 years as player/coach before immediately being named the Giants' Defensive Coordinator, where he served for 5 years before becoming the first Head Coach of the Dallas Cowboys, Tom Landry comes close to answering your question. I'm NOT trying to draw comparisons, just answering your question.

I'm not usually very negative about the Cowboys, but regarding your original post, this team has shown it has trouble finding the wall, much less the switch that needs to be flipped.

Football has changed a little since 1960

 

[Pottsville Maroons]

Football has changed a little since 1960

His parameters were "in the history of the NFL". Given that, I felt my answer was valid. Again I'm not trying to make comparisons.

 

[TheDude]

His parameters were "in the history of the NFL". Given that, I felt my answer was valid. Again I'm not trying to make comparisons.

Fair, glossed over that. My apologies

 

[UVAwahoos]

His parameters were "in the history of the NFL". Given that, I felt my answer was valid. Again I'm not trying to make comparisons.

Not answering to you in particular bc you're not comparing eras, but many many other have used the Landry comparison.

This is a completely different era. Coaches make millions now, and have unlimited access to resources that aid them in getting things right. Beyond that, there is a line of competent, proven successful individuals behind Ginger right now that would know full well what to do when up by 24 points, or when protecting a close lead on the road vs. New England. I could care less that Landry was give 5-6 seasons to get it right. This isn't 1960. Heck, this isn't even 1990 anymore. Garrett took over a ridiculously stacked team from that 2006 season, and he has gone and destroyed it.

 

[shockandroll]

I will put it this way.

The offense can flip the switch. The offense is the room and the switch itself is the offensive line.

They can be a toggle light switch or a dimmer light switch. Right now they are the latter. And until the offensive line is composed of the right combination of linemen, effort and execution, the room will remain dim. That does not preclude the offense from getting the job done. It just means that they will have a much harder time feeling their way around each game until that dimmer becomes a toggle.
I never gave an opinion of when they would gel. They are not going to gel? Never? Ever? Got any Powerball number suggestions?
Kosier has ability, but I believe his injury is hindering him right now. The interior of the line will be the weakest link. The rookies require strength training to get them up to NFL speed. Costa is going to need more technique to keep defenders out of Tony Romo's face pressuring him up the gut.

These are fixable, but the final combination may not all be on the current roster. I hope so. Cohesive offensive lines are best when they have gotten to know each others strengths and weaknesses. This one is almost clueless. Whatever the end result, there will be required growth.

And more freaking offensive line coaching for sure. As a former center, that's what grates on me most of all. I'm not expecting miracles. Nor do I expect to witness the birth of a tackle-to-tackle all-pro line pop out of nowhere. I do expect Houck to do a better job with both Free and Smith. They are allowing way too many inside moves. That's technique training (or lack there of).

Great responses! How do you put multiple posts in one response like this? I'd like to be able to disagree with more people at the same time!

 

[shockandroll]

Didn't you make a thread last week saying that our only real worry is the OL?

When Sunday comes and we don't "roll the seahawks", what will you come up with then?

I can't wait to see.

What if we do roll them, what will you're posts be?

 

[shockandroll]

Garrett was a back up QB most of his career and as such, he was on the headset sending in the plays. He had to understand the offense in case he had to go play. He's been an OC for several years now, his father was a coach and a scout, his brother is a coach. Experience is not the issue for Garrett, he's been around the pro game since he was a kid, literally, even with the players and at practices.

Forget his coaching resume, he knows what he's doing in terms of motivation, organization and X's and O's. He has one flaw though, game day adjustments. He has proven to be very stubborn in his game plan and play calling, I really do no think this is debatable.

I think he'd be great if he was the HC and mastermind of the offensive scheme, while allowing someone else to handle the game day calls and adjustments. I don't think he'll do it and that's a shame. Perhaps he'll master the game day stuff one day, time will tell.

 

[TheDude]

Garrett was a back up QB most of his career and as such, he was on the headset sending in the plays. He had to understand the offense in case he had to go play. He's been an OC for several years now, his father was a coach and a scout, his brother is a coach. Experience is not the issue for Garrett, he's been around the pro game since he was a kid, literally, even with the players and at practices.

Forget his coaching resume, he knows what he's doing in terms of motivation, organization and X's and O's. He has one flaw though, game day adjustments. He has proven to be very stubborn in his game plan and play calling, I really do no think this is debatable.

I think he'd be great if he was the HC and mastermind of the offensive scheme, while allowing someone else to handle the game day calls and adjustments. I don't think he'll do it and that's a shame. Perhaps he'll master the game day stuff one day, time will tell.

The world is littered with failed leaders who did not know their limitations aor too stubborn to change. This is not an admirable trait on only buys you a certain amount of time. The world is dynamic. The inability to be dynamic leads to failure - self imposed

 

[TNCowboy]

was sean lee hurt last week?

Probably. It's been a common occurence his entire football career.

 

[casmith07]

with all due respect, I have no idea how you can "prove" to be an excellent coordinator and be incompetant at making adjustments. As coachscout puts it, its about schemes now and how you adjust to conteract them.

I believe he is great at designing plays and gameplans in the film room and in practice throughout the week. I believe that he struggles when the rubber meets the road.

As it has been said: "everyone has a plan until they get punched in the face."

Again 5 years and just now he begins to redesign the line. And is outsmarting everyone by keeping the king of liking plodding line - Houck. Even talking him out of retirement. This is a leader?

If you were able to properly comprehend what I said, you'd realize that what I was saying that it was not until he was the head coach that he was able to take control of the roster the way he saw fit. I believe Wade gave deference to old vets over young guys because that's how he was, similar to Parcells having Romo ride the bench for years before finally getting a shot after watching the likes of Vinny Testaverde and Drew Bledsoe out there.

Again, the best leaders know their limitations and hire people who can make the org better. He has been struggling for a few years with similar issues and learned nothing. This smells of egos I have been exposed to that come from Ivy league guys who think they are "the smartest guy in the room." "no one can out plan me." If I fail its because you suck.

There is no question he has to get better. But I disagree with your ego statements and everything else.

 

[TheDude]

I believe he is great at designing plays and gameplans in the film room and in practice throughout the week. I believe that he struggles when the rubber meets the road.

As it has been said: "everyone has a plan until they get punched in the face."

And fighters make adjustments and come back swinging, switch to southpaw, not stay with the original gameplan. The thinkers analyze that the "it was a fluke, my plan was perfect - reset and go again"

If you were able to properly comprehend what I said, you'd realize that what I was saying that it was not until he was the head coach that he was able to take control of the roster the way he saw fit. I believe Wade gave deference to old vets over young guys because that's how he was, similar to Parcells having Romo ride the bench for years before finally getting a shot after watching the likes of Vinny Testaverde and Drew Bledsoe out there.

you can always tell when you hit a nerve, the veiled insults come about. Most people will acquiese that Garrett has had free reign over the offense even in the Phillips years, more often than not we could assume garrett had say in some personnel decisions (TO, Barber, etc.). If you do agree with the this, then his lack of Oline changes before this year is a mark ion him.

If he was only able to change the oline this year (which I don't beleive he was previously handcuffed), then it was his and his alone decision to talk houck out of retirement to help coach a Zone-blocking/Kubiak system with more agile/less bulky linemen, of which houck has no experience and less success. Yet another failure.

I am not worked up about this game, when you look at the collective failures and re-occurring problems (red-zone, running, etc) I know what Jason Garrett as OC brings....3-4. If Jason Garrett was effective, he would see that he needs someone to bring a new perspective to his shortcomings....and maybe 1 coach who can teach a shotgun snap that doesn't look like it was shot from a sand wedge.

There is no question he has to get better. But I disagree with your ego statements and everything else.

Fair, however I think the fact he is still learning on the job and still can't get "execution" is a reflection of something. If you objectively watch other teams, they just don't have the same "flukes" and constant WLWLWLWL runs. The Patriots, Steelers, Ravens, Saints, Packers, even the new Lions and 9ers just play different. Until last week, the defense was playing in a comparative way, so i am not worried there. the offense is always the unknown (Commanders, Pats, Lions, etc).

 

[DallasEast]

Great responses! How do you put multiple posts in one response like this? I'd like to be able to disagree with more people at the same time!

Try the multi-quote button. It's located between the "Quote" and "Quick Reply" buttons. Just click each multi-quote button for each message you wish to respond to, then click the "Reply" button at the top or bottom of the webpage.

 

[CCBoy]

And fighters make adjustments and come back swinging, switch to southpaw, not stay with the original gameplan. The thinkers analyze that the "it was a fluke, my plan was perfect - reset and go again"



you can always tell when you hit a nerve, the veiled insults come about. Most people will acquiese that Garrett has had free reign over the offense even in the Phillips years, more often than not we could assume garrett had say in some personnel decisions (TO, Barber, etc.). If you do agree with the this, then his lack of Oline changes before this year is a mark ion him.

If he was only able to change the oline this year (which I don't beleive he was previously handcuffed), then it was his and his alone decision to talk houck out of retirement to help coach a Zone-blocking/Kubiak system with more agile/less bulky linemen, of which houck has no experience and less success. Yet another failure.

I am not worked up about this game, when you look at the collective failures and re-occurring problems (red-zone, running, etc) I know what Jason Garrett as OC brings....3-4. If Jason Garrett was effective, he would see that he needs someone to bring a new perspective to his shortcomings....and maybe 1 coach who can teach a shotgun snap that doesn't look like it was shot from a sand wedge.



Fair, however I think the fact he is still learning on the job and still can't get "execution" is a reflection of something. If you objectively watch other teams, they just don't have the same "flukes" and constant WLWLWLWL runs. The Patriots, Steelers, Ravens, Saints, Packers, even the new Lions and 9ers just play different. Until last week, the defense was playing in a comparative way, so i am not worried there. the offense is always the unknown (Commanders, Pats, Lions, etc).

Oh for sure, you understood where Cas was going.... Some fighters have a glass jaw, or only show up against lower ranked boxers also. But even with great boxers, even Roberto Duran stated: 'No MAS!'

A single match, boils down to a single event....and all who make a statement, don't quickly fall in line with yet another sterotype or reach failure because it took 'brain power' for you to get a message out of it. Even if wrong...

Myself, I'd take a second to give thought to a Veteran Officer back from the Middle East. An Officer graduated from West Point, and currently in Law School...as at least piecing together the requisite background information to read further into that message. Don't confuse description with a ruffling of feathers handle...just saying.




As to Jason Garrett's controlling is own destiny and deserving of your own distrust...maybe you should revisit actual time lines and then put an overlay of cap room, lockout, and then players available when the 'grocery' store opened for business on Garrett's charge account.

 

[TheDude]

Oh for sure, you understood where Cas was going.... Some fighters have a glass jaw, or only show up against lower ranked boxers also. But even with great boxers, even Roberto Duran stated: 'No MAS!'

A single match, boils down to a single event....and all who make a statement, don't quickly fall in line with yet another sterotype or reach failure because it took 'brain power' for you to get a message out of it. Even if wrong...

Cas said "everyone has a plan until punched in the face" - I agree with that, if you bothered to read other than jumping to some perceived slight of your idol, I said people react differently to being hit. Many make adjustments on the fly, abandon what doesn't work, etc. Others stick to the plan and continually find them selves bloody and make excuses that the execution of the plan was off, not the plan itself.

Myself, I'd take a second to give thought to a Veteran Officer back from the Middle East. An Officer graduated from West Point, and currently in Law School...as at least piecing together the requisite background information to read further into that message. Don't confuse description with a ruffling of feathers handle...just saying.

My issue is immediately calling out some as reading comprehension challenged in a condescending way when I offered no such barb.

On a side note, due to your above comment, you really warrant no response. However, I will be VERY clear for you and everyone else here just so your ilk who may think you have some clout with 8K posts understand something. I tip my hat, and will for ever be indebted to the men and women who serve this country and put their lives on the line for our freedom. It is a travesty that once they are back this country tends to forget about them over time and VA hospitals and supprt systems are pretty dismal for their sacrifice. I would urge everyone to consider the "Wounded Warriors Project" as a charity if it is currently not on your radar, it does great work and if you are considering a charity before year end.

That said, this is a football forum and quite frankly a military, political or eductaional background is not a prerequisite to have a stranglehold on correct opinion about football. If he has met Jason Garrett and watched him prepare and make adjustments on the sidelines, etc., I apologize and may defer if positioned with facts and not speculative opinion. You have no idea of my background, but if you think a former military, Law student will have any debate about any topic in the bag, you are quite frankly a sycophant and trying to impress someone for some reason. For you and only your edification, my degree is higher than a JD.

As to Jason Garrett's controlling is own destiny and deserving of your own distrust...maybe you should revisit actual time lines and then put an overlay of cap room, lockout, and then players available when the 'grocery' store opened for business on Garrett's charge account.

I have read that Garrett is impressive and an influential leader by many of those who pose as having connections or met the man.

First - If after 5 years, he has not been able to influence the GM about needs or trying to reshape philosophies, etc in that time - that is a mark against his influencitial skills. We have been under the cap every year and had room to spare and , according to Adam, could have restructured many contracts to create room for a variety of players.

Second - There are serious issues that this team continues to have that other middle of the pack and other teams do not. Red Zone calls, shotgun snap are just 2 issues. The latter is an attention to detail of which his supporters said he was a taskmaster. A snap being lofted like a sandwedge is NOT crisp.

Third - Assuming he is looking to change the OLINE philosophy and move to a more atheletic line, I submit one WOULD NOT keep Hudson Houck, who is the antithesis of that style AND talk him out of retirement no less. This may be most troubling becasue assuming the line does get cohesion this year, the have to learn a new coaching philosophy/technique next year. It really is indefensible. In business, if you are changing styles, you hire the head first. You don't take an Army General and tell him to develop a naval/sea strategy.

Any response from you regarding this topic will be met with silence as I am busy and you are not worth the time. I thought the record needed to be straight on slighting a real hero (no sacarsm) about a insignificant football opinion on a message board. I would assume he didn;t feel as disrespected as you seem to think he was. If he was then - enjoy.


[URL="http://www.jimwegryn.com/Names/Dogs/spikechester.jpg"][/URL]

 

[alancdc]

yes, they will

the "SWITCH" is called "seattle"

if they were playing green bay or pittsburgh this week would you have the same confidence?

no way

Certainly need to be 7-4 after these next 4 games.

 

[birdwells1]

Great responses! How do you put multiple posts in one response like this? I'd like to be able to disagree with more people at the same time!

That's funny right there, I also would like to know how to do that.