TO discussion is a mess

LatinMind

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but does it really need to be? alot of u just hate the guy and its your life, but atleast try to be objective.

Lets look at the past 3 seasons for owens up against a few of the top wr's in the nfl.

owens: 235 receptions 3587 yrds 38 tds

comparable wr's on his level

reggie wayne: 272 receptions 3965 yrds 25 tds
randy moss: 209 recpetions 3054 yrds 37 tds
andre johnson: 278 receptions 3573 yrds 21 tds
chad johnson: 233 receptions 3349 yrds 19
steve smith: 248 receptions 3589 yrds 21 yds

alot of people are trying to say owens has declining skills. based on what? espn? its funny how espn and these "sofa-analysts" never take into account the 4 games romo didnt play, and his first game back that he didnt attempt anything long. and couldnt really throw at all.

they base his declining skills on his numbers, so he had 5 games with inadequate qb play. and was still only 12 rec 302 yrds and 5 tds from 2007's pace?

thurman thomas said it best "look at the ball romo threw 5 yrds out of bounds in owens direction, everybody will count that as a throw in owens direction and say he held up".

so owens says whats on his mind, like the deion interview. so what, its not like 99% of u werent saying the exact same thing in cowboyszone's chatroom. hypocritical much? seems like every week an opposing player was bragging about how they already knew garretts plays before the snap. is that owens fault too? take some pride and fix whats broke. and this yr its obvious the playcalling is what was broke.

but dont go and blame a passionate player because he isnt reserved on what he feels. is what he's saying really that bad?

too many of u flip flop on cowboys players and for what? they're still going to be cowboys next yr.

the cowboys have too many problems to be saying that 1 player is whats tearing the team apart. when the only time u hear something bad about owens is when its a "unname source" or keyshawn sniffing owens jock.

wether u like it or not, the players on the team like him. and thats what matters.the people ur lining up with every week.

if owens is released so what, theres other wr's in the nfl. but most of u dont even know why u hate him. u see a poster with alot of posts bash him and u ride that posters sack. get an origianl opinion of the man before u post.

1 man doesnt rip a team apart. thats impossible. it trickles down from the top.

a owner who is affraid to say bye.
Example: alot of people say he gave a extension to TO but nobody bout is mad about flozells extension?

a coach who nobody respects.

a offensive coordinator who nobody fears.

people like:
roy williams(both of them), marcus spears, bobby carpenter, kevin burnett, ken hamlin, marco colombo, andre gurode, patrick crayton who produce squat. and all are be paid very well.

lets not forget 3 rbs who could start for 90% of the nfl teams having too many big carries being called back by from holding penalties by the OL

too many things are wrong, and its more then 1 person whos causing
problems. and lets not forget fans who embarrass what the cowboys stand for by resorting to annoying tactics that have been reserved for Commander, and eagle fans.

read it, bash it... whatever.
 

diekrazy

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LatinMind;2582317 said:
but does it really need to be? alot of u just hate the guy and its your life, but atleast try to be objective.

Lets look at the past 3 seasons for owens up against a few of the top wr's in the nfl.

owens: 235 receptions 3587 yrds 38 tds

comparable wr's on his level

reggie wayne: 272 receptions 3965 yrds 25 tds
randy moss: 209 recpetions 3054 yrds 37 tds
andre johnson: 278 receptions 3573 yrds 21 tds
chad johnson: 233 receptions 3349 yrds 19
steve smith: 248 receptions 3589 yrds 21 yds

alot of people are trying to say owens has declining skills. based on what? espn? its funny how espn and these "sofa-analysts" never take into account the 4 games romo didnt play, and his first game back that he didnt attempt anything long. and couldnt really throw at all.

they base his declining skills on his numbers, so he had 5 games with inadequate qb play. and was still only 12 rec 302 yrds and 5 tds from 2007's pace?

thurman thomas said it best "look at the ball romo threw 5 yrds out of bounds in owens direction, everybody will count that as a throw in owens direction and say he held up".

so owens says whats on his mind, like the deion interview. so what, its not like 99% of u werent saying the exact same thing in cowboyszone's chatroom. hypocritical much? seems like every week an opposing player was bragging about how they already knew garretts plays before the snap. is that owens fault too? take some pride and fix whats broke. and this yr its obvious the playcalling is what was broke.

but dont go and blame a passionate player because he isnt reserved on what he feels. is what he's saying really that bad?

too many of u flip flop on cowboys players and for what? they're still going to be cowboys next yr.

the cowboys have too many problems to be saying that 1 player is whats tearing the team apart. when the only time u hear something bad about owens is when its a "unname source" or keyshawn sniffing owens jock.

wether u like it or not, the players on the team like him. and thats what matters.the people ur lining up with every week.

if owens is released so what, theres other wr's in the nfl. but most of u dont even know why u hate him. u see a poster with alot of posts bash him and u ride that posters sack. get an origianl opinion of the man before u post.

1 man doesnt rip a team apart. thats impossible. it trickles down from the top.

a owner who is affraid to say bye.
Example: alot of people say he gave a extension to TO but nobody bout is mad about flozells extension?

a coach who nobody respects.

a offensive coordinator who nobody fears.

people like:
roy williams(both of them), marcus spears, bobby carpenter, kevin burnett, ken hamlin, marco colombo, andre gurode, patrick crayton who produce squat. and all are be paid very well.

lets not forget 3 rbs who could start for 90% of the nfl teams having too many big carries being called back by from holding penalties by the OL

too many things are wrong, and its more then 1 person whos causing
problems. and lets not forget fans who embarrass what the cowboys stand for by resorting to annoying tactics that have been reserved for Commander, and eagle fans.

read it, bash it... whatever.

:hammer:
 

Hostile

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Sigh.

35 years old. I'd be thinking about moving on if he were an Eagle Scout, role model, svengali.

His performance isn't being questioned by anyone. It's his mouth and the rest of the package that comes with him being more important than the team.

35. Downhill slide. Amazing athlete. One of the best I've ever seen. Needs to shut up. Can't.

It has nothing to do with hate. I've talked to the guy on the phone. He's very likable. Treated the kids at his football camps well. I respect that.

My team is more important than appeasing him or massaging his ego. It's really just that simple.
 

theogt

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TO's stats with Tony Romo, annualized over a 16 game season:

1172 yards (9th in NFL)
11 TDs (3rd in NFL)
16.7 YPC (3rd highest among top 10 receivers in NFL)
 

chinch

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the only mess is the minds of those in denial about his futility on the cowboys.
 

Hoovie

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I agree with most of your post... but you completely lost me when you started calling out certian players
Lets take a look at those players, shall we:
roy williams(both of them)- I agree with SS Roy, but WR Roy hasn't been on the team long enough to judge. The offensive playcalling was downright horrible twords the end of the season, don't blame Roy

marcus spears- hard to disagree, hasn't lived up to fans expectations. On the other hand, he has started for the past few seasons... so maybe the coaches see something you don't. Also, if your looking for your 3-4 DE to put up big numbers, you have unrealistic expectations.

bobby carpenter- has done next to nothing. Time to either give him a real try or get rid of him.

kevin burnett- Played well enough as nickle LB. Average player.

ken hamlin- This guy solidified our FS position. Underrated. Don't blame him for the trash we've had next to him.

marc colombo- Best Tackle on the team. You TOTALLY missed on this one.

andre gurode- Probowl last season. What is your problem with him?

patrick crayton- Meh, solid #3 WR.
 

LatinMind

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Hostile;2582394 said:
Sigh.

35 years old. I'd be thinking about moving on if he were an Eagle Scout, role model, svengali.

His performance isn't being questioned by anyone. It's his mouth and the rest of the package that comes with him being more important than the team.

35. Downhill slide. Amazing athlete. One of the best I've ever seen. Needs to shut up. Can't.

It has nothing to do with hate. I've talked to the guy on the phone. He's very likable. Treated the kids at his football camps well. I respect that.

My team is more important than appeasing him or massaging his ego. It's really just that simple.

im not talking about u. i still dont understand what u mean by his mouth and appeasing him. when owens talks about the system i dont see him as trying to put himself as the focal point.

the interview he gave after the last loss to philly is a prime example. he used nothing but we. when asked what went wrong with the offense it was about we didnt execute. we need to get nto the offseason and try to fix this. it wasnt about i didnt get the ball this and that. it was about how they failed as a team.

the guy is a stand up guy who just doesnt care about what people think of him. because he knows he a solid person. he works with the kids. he works with charities. u cant ask more out of a player. if thats what people call selfish then they need a new definition. because selfish is one thing he isnt.
 

LatinMind

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Hoovie;2582409 said:
I agree with most of your post... but you completely lost me when you started calling out certian players
Lets take a look at those players, shall we:
roy williams(both of them)- I agree with SS Roy, but WR Roy hasn't been on the team long enough to judge. The offensive playcalling was downright horrible twords the end of the season, don't blame Roy

marcus spears- hard to disagree, hasn't lived up to fans expectations. On the other hand, he has started for the past few seasons... so maybe the coaches see something you don't. Also, if your looking for your 3-4 DE to put up big numbers, you have unrealistic expectations.

bobby carpenter- has done next to nothing. Time to either give him a real try or get rid of him.

kevin burnett- Played well enough as nickle LB. Average player.

ken hamlin- This guy solidified our FS position. Underrated. Don't blame him for the trash we've had next to him.

marc colombo- Best Tackle on the team. You TOTALLY missed on this one.

andre gurode- Probowl last season. What is your problem with him?

patrick crayton- Meh, solid #3 WR.


marcus spears, maybe hes starting because dallas didnt really have anybody better? that doesnt make him anything but says maybe the depth is really that bad on this team.

burnett? he couldnt tackle to save his life. anybody that has seen teams run on dallas nickel can see that.

gurode isnt a probowl player. period. if ur using a probowl as a guide, u failed. roy williams has made the probowl too many time. thats all u need to look at. oh yeah westbrook wasnt the starter last yr in the probowl that should tell u enough.

thing is crayton is being paid like a #2 not a 3.
 

Hoovie

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LatinMind;2582447 said:
marcus spears, maybe hes starting because dallas didnt really have anybody better? that doesnt make him anything but says maybe the depth is really that bad on this team.

Spears stats are in line with most 3-4 DEs. Just b/c fans don't understand what it is that 3-4 DEs actually do we all dogpile on him.

Spears 2008: 35 total tackles, 23 solo, 1 sack
Castillo DE Chargers: 39 tackles, 27 total, 1.5 sacks

burnett? he couldnt tackle to save his life. anybody that has seen teams run on dallas nickel can see that.

38 tackles, 29 solo, 2 sacks... down from last year due to injury

gurode isnt a probowl player. period. if ur using a probowl as a guide, u failed. roy williams has made the probowl too many time. thats all u need to look at. oh yeah westbrook wasnt the starter last yr in the probowl that should tell u enough.

Royboy had name recognition... Andre most certianly does not. Do you have any kind of stats to prove your point... or are you just rambling?
 

ZeroClub

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Owens can be on my fantasy football team any time.

I just don't want him, or the circus that surrounds him, in my locker room.


Punt him like he's hot .... (or something like that)
 

LatinMind

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Hoovie;2582469 said:
Royboy had name recognition... Andre most certianly does not. Do you have any kind of stats to prove your point... or are you just rambling?

i have eyes, u have eyes. u watch games so do i. it doesnt take a HC in the nfl to know when u see bad players. roy and gurode are bad players who make stupid mistakes too much.

period
 

jterrell

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Hoovie;2582409 said:
I agree with most of your post... but you completely lost me when you started calling out certian players
Lets take a look at those players, shall we:
roy williams(both of them)- I agree with SS Roy, but WR Roy hasn't been on the team long enough to judge. The offensive playcalling was downright horrible twords the end of the season, don't blame Roy

marcus spears- hard to disagree, hasn't lived up to fans expectations. On the other hand, he has started for the past few seasons... so maybe the coaches see something you don't. Also, if your looking for your 3-4 DE to put up big numbers, you have unrealistic expectations.

bobby carpenter- has done next to nothing. Time to either give him a real try or get rid of him.

kevin burnett- Played well enough as nickle LB. Average player.

ken hamlin- This guy solidified our FS position. Underrated. Don't blame him for the trash we've had next to him.

marc colombo- Best Tackle on the team. You TOTALLY missed on this one.

andre gurode- Probowl last season. What is your problem with him?

patrick crayton- Meh, solid #3 WR.

I agree with you.
I thought the OP made a quite compelling case base don Owens stats and his production but bringing in other players made it clear he is as biased as those he is directing this towards.

Personally I am about 55/45 in favor of keeping Owens.

I'd like to see him shut up, block all Deion's calls and generally just play but know that is naive and I can live with his mouth. However, I am also a defensive guy. I like running the ball and giving your defense a chance to be fresh. I like physical teams. With Owens gone I think we'd probably run the ball more and perhaps be more ground-oriented. I think our OL is better when we run the ball 50% of the time. 300+ pound guys are seldom as good going backwards as they are forward.

All that said I saw the Giants really struggle when they no longer had that playmaker. And I wouldn't pay more cap cash to cut T.O. than what it costs to keep him. I'd keep him and give him the BP silent treatment before I paid him to play elsewhere.

I have always been glad we didn't add Randy Moss because of all the drama but I darn sure have never enjoyed playing against him.
 

5Stars

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LatinMind;2582477 said:
i have eyes, u have eyes. u watch games so do i. it doesnt take a HC in the nfl to know when u see bad players. roy and gurode are bad players who make stupid mistakes too much.

period


:laugh2: Ah, the old "period" thing!


Book it!
 

RoadRunner

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ZeroClub;2582476 said:
Owens can be on my fantasy football team any time.

I just don't want him, or the circus that surrounds him, in my locker room.


Punt him like he's hot .... (or something like that)

So I gotta ask you, and those that agree with you why you want to pay 9 million dollars to an empty roster spot?

Do you honestly think Jerry is just going to eat 9 million dollars especially when we don't have an immediate replacement?
 

Established1971

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Wow you really looooooovvvvvvvveeee TO. Why is that? Youre insulting your fellow zoners saying they are not objective that it is just hate, well read your own post. Are you objective or is it just love.
 

Clove

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Latin, you're wasting your time man. You're better off trying to convince Bin Laden to take a tour of the White House, than convincing some fans that 1 person can't destroy a team.

1 person can't destroy a team, just like 1 person can't win a Super Bowl for you, if this were the case, having Witten on the team would guarantee us a Super Bowl every year because he's the 1 great player that will take us to the top.

Sounds foolish doesn't it?

Some of you hate players that speak their mind.

My suggestion is, if we don't like players like that, then from this day forward, most of us should basically stop posting from now on, because we definitely speak our minds in here.
 

Maikeru-sama

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The Original Poster has talked to Terrell Owens on the phone and says he's nice....all is well...Hooray!!! J/K Latinmind.

Nice post Hos.

For you stat guys:

Average number of Playoff wins over 2.5 Seasons with the one of a kind and irreplaceable duo Tony Romo and Terrell Owens

0.0

So why exactly are we afraid of cutting this guy?

Again, I don't blame Terrell Owens for all the problems, I just think he is part of the problem.
 

ZeroClub

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RoadRunner;2582554 said:
So I gotta ask you, and those that agree with you why you want to pay 9 million dollars to an empty roster spot?

Do you honestly think Jerry is just going to eat 9 million dollars especially when we don't have an immediate replacement?

Addition by subtraction.

I do believe that the organization is considering cutting Owens.
 

Bleu Star

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LatinMind;2582317 said:
but does it really need to be? alot of u just hate the guy and its your life, but atleast try to be objective.

Lets look at the past 3 seasons for owens up against a few of the top wr's in the nfl.

owens: 235 receptions 3587 yrds 38 tds

comparable wr's on his level

reggie wayne: 272 receptions 3965 yrds 25 tds
randy moss: 209 recpetions 3054 yrds 37 tds
andre johnson: 278 receptions 3573 yrds 21 tds
chad johnson: 233 receptions 3349 yrds 19
steve smith: 248 receptions 3589 yrds 21 yds

alot of people are trying to say owens has declining skills. based on what? espn? its funny how espn and these "sofa-analysts" never take into account the 4 games romo didnt play, and his first game back that he didnt attempt anything long. and couldnt really throw at all.

they base his declining skills on his numbers, so he had 5 games with inadequate qb play. and was still only 12 rec 302 yrds and 5 tds from 2007's pace?

thurman thomas said it best "look at the ball romo threw 5 yrds out of bounds in owens direction, everybody will count that as a throw in owens direction and say he held up".

so owens says whats on his mind, like the deion interview. so what, its not like 99% of u werent saying the exact same thing in cowboyszone's chatroom. hypocritical much? seems like every week an opposing player was bragging about how they already knew garretts plays before the snap. is that owens fault too? take some pride and fix whats broke. and this yr its obvious the playcalling is what was broke.

but dont go and blame a passionate player because he isnt reserved on what he feels. is what he's saying really that bad?

too many of u flip flop on cowboys players and for what? they're still going to be cowboys next yr.

the cowboys have too many problems to be saying that 1 player is whats tearing the team apart. when the only time u hear something bad about owens is when its a "unname source" or keyshawn sniffing owens jock.

wether u like it or not, the players on the team like him. and thats what matters.the people ur lining up with every week.

if owens is released so what, theres other wr's in the nfl. but most of u dont even know why u hate him. u see a poster with alot of posts bash him and u ride that posters sack. get an origianl opinion of the man before u post.

1 man doesnt rip a team apart. thats impossible. it trickles down from the top.

a owner who is affraid to say bye.
Example: alot of people say he gave a extension to TO but nobody bout is mad about flozells extension?

a coach who nobody respects.

a offensive coordinator who nobody fears.

people like:
roy williams(both of them), marcus spears, bobby carpenter, kevin burnett, ken hamlin, marco colombo, andre gurode, patrick crayton who produce squat. and all are be paid very well.

lets not forget 3 rbs who could start for 90% of the nfl teams having too many big carries being called back by from holding penalties by the OL

too many things are wrong, and its more then 1 person whos causing
problems. and lets not forget fans who embarrass what the cowboys stand for by resorting to annoying tactics that have been reserved for Commander, and eagle fans.

read it, bash it... whatever.

Best TO post (anti or pro) I have read in a very long time. :bow:
 

big dog cowboy

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Maikeru-sama;2582621 said:
Average number of Playoff wins over 2.5 Seasons with the one of a kind and irreplaceable duo Tony Romo and Terrell Owens

0.0

So why exactly are we afraid of cutting this guy?
At least we had a chance with TO on the field. Without him, our offense would struggle.

I don't care if we get rid of TO. But a playmaking replacement would need to be added to take his place. With the weapons we have on offense that is a sad statement. I just see us struggle to move the ball consistently without him.
 
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