What happens if (or when) Moore and Garrett don't see eye to eye

[Sydla]

I never disputed that he uses his power more, but all the owners have the same power when it comes to their team it's how it's used. Snyder was every bit what Jones was until he ultimately stepped aside until this draft.
Jones has never disputed the collaborative effort within the organization except to say he breaks all ties. I don't know what owner don't have that power.


There are collaborative decisions when it comes to everything
Garrett reminded us that Jerry Jones owns the Dallas Cowboys when asked who makes the final decisions on things, but he was specific to say that it was a collaborative effort. The brain-trust is an important group.

No owner is as involved in the day to day operations that the Jones are. That's simply a fact.

Saying something is collaborative but then admitting that Jerry makes the final call on basically all football decisions doesn't actually support the case you are trying to make here.

 

[CowboyRoy]

My gut says JJT is kind of spinning what happened (or his source which could be Garrett or someone close to Garrett). I suspect Jerry wanted Linehan gone, went to Garrett to ask if he agreed and Garrett, being the puppet he is, largely agreed. So in one perverted sense, you could argue that Garrett "wanted" him fired when in fact, Garrett just went along with Jerry's decision.

As you pointed out, Garrett kind of admitted in his statement that it wasn't his sole call. He also stated clearly that Jerry has final say on everything.

Jerry, himself, is also quoted as saying he "reserves the right to change his mind" on Linehan prior to the firing. If Garrett was making the call, why does what Jerry and his mind think matter?

Correct. Jerry decides what he wants and asks garret if he agrees. Of course he does to make it seem like they decided together.

But now why would Garrett come out publicly stating there would be no big changes?

Almost makes it seem like he has little say.

Or he waits for jerry to tell him what to do and he simply assumed there would be no changes because he didn’t hear otherwise.

Either way it’s clear he didn’t lobby for Linehan to be fired and for Moore to be hired. If he had he never would have announced no big changes.

 

[CowboyRoy]

Like I said, I ignored it either way. It can keep coming at me if it wants. My capacity to ignore nonsense is pretty impressive.

As you’re still mischaracterizing things I’ve actually said in the post I’ve replied to here, I made the right call.

How about answering a question:

Why did Garrett come out publicly stating there would be no major coaching changes?

 

[DandyDon52]

Moore works for Garrett. They know each other well and get along. Garrett just promoted Moore on his staff. The offensive coaches collaborate. It’s a shame it doesn’t fit the agenda, but it’s true.

I dont see how that can be true idgit. I read that JG had asked for play calling duties back, so he wanted to be OC again.
I think the jones boys fired linehan and promoted Kellen to OC, and they hired Kitna.
I dont think JG had any say in these 2 hires and the firing of linehan.

 

[DandyDon52]

Either way it’s clear he didn’t lobby for Linehan to be fired and for Moore to be hired. If he had he never would have announced no big changes.

Well there is a reason,
1. they may want other teams to think cowboys offense is going to be the same, which if true, means we wont see anything new till
1st game of the season.
2.JG could have said that to undermine Kellen, HC says only small changes to same offense, so kellen will feel like that is
what he should do.
But the truth is we dont know what is going on, lol and there is no telling what will go on.

I do know it is not a healthy situation to have a HC who wants to be OC, have a young OC forced on him, and then they are supposed
to work together. It is more likely that they work against each other and that isnt good.
The other thing is JG probably sees kellen as a threat to his job as HC, If Kellen did good with the offense, he could be the
next HC, if he does poorly or average, or offense still struggles, then he is no threat to JG and his job as HC.

JG was clever in getting the HC job, and we all know he has been clever in keeping that job, so it seems to me
he would want kellen to be average or worse to keep his job as HC.

Just think what if Kellen made the offense a top offense, and then some other teams offered him a HC job for big money,
what would the jones boys do?? I think they would make him HC of Dallas for price other teams were offering.
And Kellen if just offered more money to stay here as OC, would he pass up a HC job else where to be JG's OC ??
I dont think he would.

 

[CowboyRoy]

Well there is a reason,
1. they may want other teams to think cowboys offense is going to be the same, which if true, means we wont see anything new till
1st game of the season.
2.JG could have said that to undermine Kellen, HC says only small changes to same offense, so kellen will feel like that is
what he should do.
But the truth is we dont know what is going on, lol and there is no telling what will go on.

I do know it is not a healthy situation to have a HC who wants to be OC, have a young OC forced on him, and then they are supposed
to work together. It is more likely that they work against each other and that isnt good.
The other thing is JG probably sees kellen as a threat to his job as HC, If Kellen did good with the offense, he could be the
next HC, if he does poorly or average, or offense still struggles, then he is no threat to JG and his job as HC.

JG was clever in getting the HC job, and we all know he has been clever in keeping that job, so it seems to me
he would want kellen to be average or worse to keep his job as HC.

Just think what if Kellen made the offense a top offense, and then some other teams offered him a HC job for big money,
what would the jones boys do?? I think they would make him HC of Dallas for price other teams were offering.
And Kellen if just offered more money to stay here as OC, would he pass up a HC job else where to be JG's OC ??
I dont think he would.

So your saying that Garrett purposefully lied?

Ok then why did he deny saying it the next day?

 

[DandyDon52]

Jason's gonna gush over kellen's grasp& play calling in the very first game of the season's post presser, just wait&watch

no he wont, he wont say anything about kellen unless asked, and then it will be a prepared garrett statement.
Kellen is a threat to JG as HC, he isnt going to speak about him unless he is forced to.
it will be "we" not "kellen"

 

[DandyDon52]

So your saying that Garrett purposefully lied?

Ok then why did he deny saying it the next day?

I dont know what your referring to, lay out some more details.

 

[Idgit]

I dont see how that can be true idgit. I read that JG had asked for play calling duties back, so he wanted to be OC again.
I think the jones boys fired linehan and promoted Kellen to OC, and they hired Kitna.
I dont think JG had any say in these 2 hires and the firing of linehan.

I hadn't heard where JG had asked for play calling back, but would be interested to see it, if it was posted. I don't doubt he wants it back, because I don't think it sat well with him when it was given to Callahan. And I think he liked Linehan's play calling in particular and was comfortable with him doing it.

I think the debate on the OC was more about Moore v. Nussmeier. I believe Garrett has discretion as long as it was an internal hire as Jerry wasn't going to bring anybody in on a long term deal.

 

[Idgit]

How about answering a question:

Why did Garrett come out publicly stating there would be no major coaching changes?

He didn't.

 

[CowboyRoy]

I dont know what your referring to, lay out some more details.

Day 1: Garret says no major coaching changes
Day 2. Jones blasts garret publicly saying he alone has not made that decision
Day 3. Garret is asked by reporters why he said that, he claims he never said it or doesn’t remember.
Day 4 Linehan is fired

 

[Sydla]

He didn't.

Semantics. He said he didn't expect any significant coaching changes.

"We don't anticipate any significant changes on our staff," Garrett said Monday on 105.3 The Fan, per ESPN's Todd Archer.

Then Daddy Jones talked to him and Jason was again reminded who was in charge and who would make the call on any coaching changes.

 

[CowboyRoy]

He didn't.

You really have no clue do you? No wonder you get it all wrong.

Let me find it for you.

 

[Idgit]

This was explained by Broaddus that Linehan was given more power and eventually let go . It was also said Garrett wanted Linehan fired. They almost did it early in the season.

Yeah, I know that Talking Cowboys alluded to stuff going on behind the scenes early in the season last season. Pretty clearly, there was a power struggle among the offensive coaches after the 2017 season that Linehan won. Only to then lose his job when the changes he was responsible for didn't work and they had to go out and use a pick to bring in a WR1 and change OL coaches mid-season like they did. I was hoping we'd get some background when Beasley left (I thought he might run his mouth a bit for us), but not so much.

 

[CowboyRoy]

Semantics. He said he didn't expect any significant coaching changes.



Then Daddy Jones talked to him and Jason was again reminded who was in charge and who would make the call on any coaching changes.

Saved me the trouble.

 

[Dre11]

No owner is as involved in the day to day operations that the Jones are. That's simply a fact.

Saying something is collaborative but then admitting that Jerry makes the final call on basically all football decisions doesn't actually support the case you are trying to make here.

It most definitely make sense just because he makes the final decision or stand out in front of everyone does it mean to decision wasn't a collaborative one. And Snyder most definitely was involved in the day-to-day operation of the Washington Commanders football operation until it blew up in his face

 

[DandyDon52]

I hadn't heard where JG had asked for play calling back, but would be interested to see it, if it was posted. I don't doubt he wants it back, because I don't think it sat well with him when it was given to Callahan. And I think he liked Linehan's play calling in particular and was comfortable with him doing it.

I think the debate on the OC was more about Moore v. Nussmeier. I believe Garrett has discretion as long as it was an internal hire as Jerry wasn't going to bring anybody in on a long term deal.

I read it here, back around time kellen was made OC.
And it is all speculation, we only have tidbits of info, and we make conclusions on things.
I never heard of Nussmeier.
I do think Kellen having been around the jones boys for years, and linehan always said he was smart etc, I think they always had an intention
of trying him as a coach , and possible OC at some point.
They know him, and maybe like him and feel comfortable working with him.

The other reason for me saying JG wanted to be OC again, is what jerry said about if JG interferes, to come see him about it.
Why would jerry say that if JG had no desire to design or call plays again?
Jerry knows JG, and that he loved being OC and did not like being replaced by linehan, and also it insinuates JG interfered with linehan.

 

[Sydla]

Saved me the trouble.

Here's how it went down.

Garrett said he didn't expect any changes to the staff. He then walked that statement back literally 5 hours later saying no decision had been made (likely because Jerry and/or Stephen had a talk with him). Two days later, on Jan 16th, Jerry went on the radio and said no decision had been made on Linehan and that he should know because he's the final say [on coaching changes].

Two days after that, Jerry fired Linehan. A week or so later, they hired Moore. Jerry also said at that time, that if Moore isn't given some free reign here, that he will go to Jerry directly and they'll fix that.

So in reality, it's pretty damn clear that Jason was neutered in this process. Sure, he had "input" but Jerry was going to do what Jerry wanted.

 

[CowboyRoy]

He didn't.

"We don't anticipate any significant changes on our staff," Garrett said Monday on 105.3 The Fan, per ESPN's Todd Archer.

 

[Idgit]

Semantics. He said he didn't expect any significant coaching changes.

That isn't semantics. It's a material difference.

I've already said that I believe the decision to let Linehan go had been made earlier, and that they were expecting to announce it after the Senior Bowl. That's a fairly common courtesy at this level, as they bring the coaches with them and let them look for new jobs while still technically employed. While at the same time the team can interview for their replacements. Garrett's 'we'll take a look at everything, but I don't expect any significant changes at this time' and Jerry's cringey 'I reserve my right to change my mind based on what's available at the Senior Bowl' are consistent with that speculation.

Whatever happened between Jan 15 and Jan 18 where the team decided to just come out and say Linehan was getting replaced, I don't know, but something obviously changed, because Jerry changed his tune. If I were guessing, Linehan probably didn't like Jerry wagging his tail about firing him the way he did in the quote provided, and just pulled the rip cord. And that caught Jason by surprise as (IIRC) he was talking to a morning show that day and still keeping the company line.

That's pure guesswork on my part, but whatever it was, I don't believe they didn't intend to change out the OC before the end of last season anyway. It's pretty obvious that they gave Linehan his shot (during the 2017 offseason) and the offense dropped the ball and they ended up scrambling.