What improvements have been made to the D-line since Marinelli got here?

[perrykemp]

We loaded up on skill guys and Oline. Now the Dline sucks. It has NO young, eligible talent. It would if Gregory wasn't an idiot, but he is.

Listen, the Cowboys drafted OL 3 times in the first round over a 4 year period.

That's been paying dividends on offense for sure, however, there is a price to be paid for over-loading on one unit like that.

The DL hasn't had a first round pick since Marcus Spears in 2006... 10 years ago.

 

[manster4ever]

We just haven't improved at all talent wise. We make similar dumpster dive free agent signings that last 1-2 years before we release them and sign a similar free agent. How long are we gonna keep doing that? I'm not saying it's Marinelli's fault. Maybe he's extremely unlucky. But it's not working. We can't go into every season expecting Marinelli to make miracles out of an untalented D-line. I'd rather bring in a lesser coach like Rob Ryan (not him but someone like him) who could at least try to get creative with what we have. We keep expecting to play this straightforward defensive approach with a bunch of guys who shouldn't even be on an NFL roster. Either bring in a coach who will try to get creative or bring in some actual talent. I'm tired of seasons being derailed because of an awful D-line.

Yes SIR. It's the talent IMO and we damn well have to do something about it. Bummed there aren't more FA's out there but it's barren. That said, the draft is LOADED with good, young D.Ends. We could get two in the first 3 rounds quite easily and that's without the Romo picks through a trade.

Night just got worse. Pitt just smothered an inept K.City team for a sloppy, win.

 

[manster4ever]

Listen, the Cowboys drafted OL 3 times in the first round over a 4 year period.

That's been paying dividends on offense for sure, however, there is a price to be paid for over-loading on one unit like that.

The DL hasn't had a first round pick since Marcus Spears in 2006... 10 years ago.

Preaching to the choir my friend...this is my stance as well. Read up the page...Rod doesn't have NEAR enough to work with.

 

[JoeyBoy718]

The bottom line is, we're gonna keep losing if we continue to have an awful D-line. Dak is great but he shouldn't be expected to carry the team like Rodgers is. We're not built for that. We're built to ground and pound teams with a dominant O-line, a ferocious RB and a poised QB. We're not designed to get into shootouts. But we can't avoid getting into shootouts if our defense consistently gives up 90 yard drives to elite QBs every time they get the ball. The playoffs is full of elite QBs. If we're not gonna get some talent on this defense, then we need to get creative. Marinelli would be a great coach if he had some guys on the D-line that could out-muscle the opposing O-line. But he doesn't. And if we're not gonna do better than 7th round picks and George Selvie-esque signings, then we might as well bring in a coordinator who might try to outsmart the opposing offenses.

 

[JoeyBoy718]

And regarding Randy Gregory and Greg Hardy, here's the thing about troubled players... You don't take a troubled player to fill a position of need. You take a troubled player at a position you've already got covered with the expectation that you'll get nothing out of them. For example, you take a Jay Ajayi or a Thomas Rawls when you already have Zeke. That's what smart teams do. It's low risk, high reward. If they pan out, you have some depth and some trade bait. If they don't, who cares. But you don't go into a season expecting Greg Hardy and Randy Gregory to be your savior at the most crucial position on defense.

 

[manster4ever]

And regarding Randy Gregory and Greg Hardy, here's the thing about troubled players... You don't take a troubled player to fill a position of need. You take a troubled player at a position you've already got covered with the expectation that you'll get nothing out of them. For example, you take a Jay Ajayi or a Thomas Rawls when you already have Zeke. That's what smart teams do. It's low risk, high reward. If they pan out, you have some depth and some trade bait. If they don't, who cares. But you don't go into a season expecting Greg Hardy and Randy Gregory to be your savior at the most crucial position on defense.

Ding, Ding, DING. That's what the Pats do. It's pretty elementary but Jerrah likes playing GM and he just isn't. I've read MANY accounts that he pushed for Hardy and Gregory both. The real football men didn't want either and they were right. I hope he has that garbage cleared out of his system but I doubt it. Jerrah always pictures himself as a 'gambler' and wild catter.

 

[JoeyBoy718]

Ding, Ding, DING. That's what the Pats do. It's pretty elementary but Jerrah likes playing GM and he just isn't. I've read MANY accounts that he pushed for Hardy and Gregory both. The real football men didn't want either and they were right. I hope he has that garbage cleared out of his system but I doubt it. Jerrah always pictures himself as a 'gambler' and wild catter.

Yep. I'm cool with troubled players as long as we don't need to rely on them. Seattle took a chance on Frank Clark when they already had some solid DEs. He got 10 sacks in his second season.

 

[ilykdrama]

Jerry just loves "flash" more than hard workers that have ability and want to learn. He thinks he can get Hardy and Gregory on a discount and it ends up biting us in the ***. He's an ego maniac that's finally getting fazed out.

Defense wins these games. No QB, WR, RB combination can give you 35 points guaranteed in a playoff game. I hate Jerry and our entire front office after games like these.

 

[Killerinstinct]

I think everyone can agree that a lack of consistent DE play is destroying the potential of this team. As far as I am concerned if they traded every draft pick to end up with two DE's that can avoid suspension and make a difference it would be a successful draft.

 

[MrPeanutbutter]

Personnel on defense is a problem. It can get better, but it needs to be a focus in the draft.

 

[CyberB0b]

If they could get Cheech and Chong to lay off the hippie lettuce and steroids, they would have two bookend DEs.

 

[Gameover]

We need to let Claiborne walk, let him tease some other team.

I think Rod gets the most out of his talent.

 

[bsbellomy]

Surely, a coordinator should try to persuade the higher ups to bring in players via draft and free agency to improve his unit. Our O-line wasn't built over night. Each of our 3 superstars were drafted in different years. "It's a process." So what process has Marinelli been working toward?

He came in as D-line coach in 2013. We spent 0 picks on D-line in that year's draft. We got rid of Kenyon Coleman, Marcus Spears and Victor Butler. We replaced them with Nick Hayden and George Selvie.

He became defensive coordinator in 2014. We traded our 3rd round pick to move up in the 2nd to get Demarcus Lawrence. We also drafted Ben Gardner and Ken Bishop in the 7th round. We got rid of Demarcus Ware and Jason Hatcher. We brought in Jeremy Mincey, Henry Melton, Terrell McClain and Jack Crawford.

Marinelli was extended 3 years in 2015. We drafted Randy Gregory in the 2nd and Ryan Russell in the 5th. We got rid of Anthony Spencer as well as recent acquisitions George Selvie (2013) and Henry Melton (2014). We signed the troubled Greg Hardy.

This past season, 2016, we drafted Maliek Collins in the 3rd and Charles Tapper in the 4th. We got rid of Hardy after one year and Mincey after two. We brought in Benson Mayowa and Cedric Thornton.

That's it after 4 years. Highest drafted DL was Demarcus Lawrence. We took a chance on Randy Gregory via draft and Greg Hardy via free agency. Other than them, we either ignored DL altogether in the draft or waited until the later rounds. Our free agent signings were usually dumpster dives or reclamation projects that didn't last more than a year or two.

I'm happy that we purged our defense and moved on from veterans like Ratliff, Ware, Hatcher and Spears, but we failed to do anything to replace them. 4 years later and all we have to show is the hope that Maliek Collins becomes a decent player and that Demarcus Lawrence's back isn't career threatening.

And that's just D-line. I'm not even talking about other positions. Though Marinelli is the coordinator for the entire defense, I'll cut him some slack for LBers and secondary but definitely not for D-line. The only player that consistently plays well, Sean Lee, was brought in long before Marinelli got here. Heck, the most successful DLman in the past 4 years was Jason Hatcher.

So, what exactly has Marinelli brought to the defense the past 4 years other than having to make miracles out of garbage?

Good post, thanks for putting the effort into your research. Lawrence just looks like a huge swing and a miss at this point. Gregory you can't put on Marinelli. At this point it sucks to say that it looks like we have to start from scratch, with maybe the exception of Collins. Also none of us are really sure how much input he has on the drafting process. But he has not done a good job of developing guys we're drafting, but I think we agree all these guys have significant limitations.

 

[JoeyBoy718]

I think Rod gets the most out of his talent.

I don't disagree with that, but when are we gonna get some talent? Sure, Rid hasn't gotten anything to work with since he got here, but he also has a habit of passing on players because they don't fit his scheme or because he thinks an offensive player would help the defense more than a defensive player would.

 

[Kaiser]

So, what exactly has Marinelli brought to the defense the past 4 years other than having to make miracles out of garbage?

The year Marinelli became DL coach our best linemen were Nick Hayden and Jeremy Mincey.

Does anyone seriously want to argue we haven't improved on that?

 

[Aven8]

Not sure what he's done talent wise as the cubbard has been bare. Outside of Lee most of the players are Jags. Collins and Jones look like players and I've always liked Carr. Oscan is overpaid and over rated, and Crawford is just overpaid. He's awful!

The team really hasn't given him anything....they've had to go cheap because all the money is on offense. Once they lose Romo hopefully that will change.

 

[Chuck 54]

Easy to blame the defense and think that's why GB won.

Giants had the best D money could buy with a great DL.
They sacked Rogers 5 times and he still threw for 362 yards and 4 TDs while they scored 38 points.

Dallas sacked Rodgers 3 times and he threw for 356 yards and 2 TDs while they scored 34 points.

I'm not saying we don't need more CBs and better DEs, but you're kidding yourself if you think Rodgers would have been stopped by a better defense. He looked better vs NY than vs Dallas, and that defense was the best the NFC had to offer.

Last team with the ball was going to win, and in overtime, only way we beat Rodgers is if we win the toss and score a TD.

 

[JoeyBoy718]

The year Marinelli became DL coach our best linemen were Nick Hayden and Jeremy Mincey.

Does anyone seriously want to argue we haven't improved on that?

Mincey led our D-line with 6 sacks that year. Mayowa led our D-line with 6 sacks this year. Hayden won the starting 1DT position that year. Thornton wasn't able to win the starting 1DT position this year.

 

[Chuck 54]

Not sure what he's done talent wise as the cubbard has been bare. Outside of Lee most of the players are Jags. Collins and Jones look like players and I've always liked Carr. Oscan is overpaid and over rated, and Crawford is just overpaid. He's awful!

The team really hasn't given him anything....they've had to go cheap because all the money is on offense. Once they lose Romo hopefully that will change.

I'd move Crawford back inside with Collins and Crawford. I'd make DLaw drop some weight and move to the right side with Tapper and whomever we can find this offseason, and I'd drop Irving in at Left DE with Mayowa. Crawford is not a DE.

 

[Aven8]

I'd move Crawford back inside with Collins and Crawford. I'd make DLaw drop some weight and move to the right side with Tapper and whomever we can find this offseason, and I'd drop Irving in at Left DE with Mayowa. Crawford is not a DE.

Crap I left out Irving...our 2nd best player!