When to cut bait

[burmafrd]

I think McQ might end up at guard if he is unable to do the job at tackle. he has the attitude and the size to be a good one. Marten- just seems weak.
Proctor did not look good at all subbing for Gurode. Berger seems to be coming on and might make a decent guard. But now we have to be looking at drafting another tackle next year since if we do not resign Colombo then Free will be starting there and we still need a good backup tackle.

 

[TwentyOne]

You cannot keep young guys around too long that are not starters if you think they have zero chance of ever filling in adequatley when the starters go down.

Case in point....the Cowboys spent way too much time developing Nate Jones and Jacque Reeves to get nothing out of them...by that I mean....after 4 years, if you needed one of them to play they should have been able to perform at a higher level than either did. The young CBs we have now ALREADY sound like an upgrade, and they have not even been around 4 years.

So I said that to say this...if the Cowboys don't think Procter, McQuistan, Berger, Martin, Free can ever step in, then they need to move on. Martin and Free have not been given as much time as McQuistan, so they deserve another year. I thought the O-line played bad last year when Gurode went out, so if Proctor is not better than last year, we need to move on. But McQuistan has been around long enough for the Cowboys to make a good evaluation if he can truly help us.

Same thing with a couple of guys at WR...Hurd and Austin have been around long enough.....since the Cowboys have put the time in developing them, I would expect that both are ready to contribute. Stanback will and should be allowed one more year....I think next year is when we need him to contribute.

As far as the DL goes...I think they pretty much know what they want to do....Canty will be extended.....but the Cowboys need to find out about Hatcher....they know all they need to know about Spears...so either they like Spears or they don't....if they don't....they cannot continue to give him the bulk of the playing time at the expense of finding out what they need to Hatcher....that is very critical storyline that not many people are keying on.

Obviosuly Carpenter was a 1st round pick...so they are going to give him every chance to show something this year...but he won't get anymore time after this year...either he has to show he can help...or he will be gone. I am pulling for him because Zach Thomas won't be around forever, and it would be nice for Carpenter to slide right in. I am also pulling for Burnett because he is our best cover LBer. He is in the last year of his deal and will be given every chance to show he is worthy of a 5 year extension.

What do you guys think and have I missed anyone?

You cut them when you have to.

You make a selection in what team you train which player - first second etc... If you don't have enough resources to train players at the third team they have to go on there own. when the roster has to be trimmed (because of league rules) you cut those players who are not good enough in your opinion.

in position drills you have only max. 7 (maybe 8) players at one position. one more or less doesn't make a different. its not like you have for example 40 cbs and your db coach ist mentally overwhelmed.

i don't see a problem here.

else i think the bill parcells rule is really a good idea. means: after three years you know what you have. after that keep or cut the player.

 

[Velvet Jones]

our 2nd and 3rd stringers got their arse handed to them... and Super Bowl contending teams at least need to be able to run the ball, play defense, and be solid on special teams all up and down the roster... not expecting lights out play from back up qbs... but the other parts of the team should be solid if you plan to play late in january

With all those dots to add pause, I felt like I was reading a post from Captain Kirk.

Seriously, we played another Super Bowl contending team. They played their starters longer. And our Special Teams sucked major kack (Reeves was a good contributer on ST). You are right that contenders need to be balanced in Off, Def and ST, but I am just unsure how lossing this past Sunday shows that we are unbalanced on Off or Def? And since... Reeves... was a good ST player... how... does he... merit mention when... our ST was... horrible?

 

[Angus]

The only time a player should be cut is when there is another player out the on the market that can perform better. Given that Dallas is on the tail end of the waiver wire, I wouldn't hold my breath.

Not the only time. Sometimes a player is just a bad apple that will spoil the lot if not let go immediately, just as Carter was.

Landry's 3 year rule was only a stretchy tape measure, not a firm yardstick, and depended on several things. Players that showed promise could get a longer time, and did. Besides, Landry considered 5 years the proper developmental time for a quarterback, not 3 years. So all things are relative, including the time for waiving a player.

 

[cowboyrock]

With all those dots to add pause, I felt like I was reading a post from Captain Kirk.

Seriously, we played another Super Bowl contending team. They played their starters longer. And our Special Teams sucked major kack (Reeves was a good contributer on ST). You are right that contenders need to be balanced in Off, Def and ST, but I am just unsure how lossing this past Sunday shows that we are unbalanced on Off or Def? And since... Reeves... was a good ST player... how... does he... merit mention when... our ST was... horrible?

Here's what you keep missing.Reeves,D.Davis and Nate Jones all were here last year. and the special teams stll was terrible. at some point dont we have to say it's the coaching?

 

[adbutcher]

You have to keep the 53 guys who will help you the most.

This team is trying to win a Super Bowl.
Teams no longer have 3 deeps of quality NFL players.

You just keep the best 53 and yes some of those late slots will go to guys based on potential.

Reeves just left to be a starter in this league. Jones was a special teams guy. We didnt have better players on the roster while they were here so you aren't making much of a point imho.

Dallas will keep its best 9 or 10 OL. If guys like Free or McQ are in that group they will be here unless someone cut on some other team can be signed to supplant then.

 

[AsthmaField]

If we cut McQuistan, he'll be with Parcells in Miami before the ink is dry on his walking papers.

 

[Prossman]

But it is insane to cut a guy after his 3rd or 4th year if everyone behind them is worse than them. Dallas has been looking to upgrade wr but they will be better served waiting until next years draft/ free agency period because the draft class is better and Roy Williams should be a free agent. Brady james didn't come into his own until his 4th year athough he started to show signs in his 3rd. Rome wasn't built in a day, so we are better served to be patient than not. Prossman

 

[JohnnyHopkins]

You cannot keep young guys around too long that are not starters if you think they have zero chance of ever filling in adequatley when the starters go down.

Case in point....the Cowboys spent way too much time developing Nate Jones and Jacque Reeves to get nothing out of them...by that I mean....after 4 years, if you needed one of them to play they should have been able to perform at a higher level than either did. The young CBs we have now ALREADY sound like an upgrade, and they have not even been around 4 years.

So I said that to say this...if the Cowboys don't think Procter, McQuistan, Berger, Martin, Free can ever step in, then they need to move on. Martin and Free have not been given as much time as McQuistan, so they deserve another year. I thought the O-line played bad last year when Gurode went out, so if Proctor is not better than last year, we need to move on. But McQuistan has been around long enough for the Cowboys to make a good evaluation if he can truly help us.

Same thing with a couple of guys at WR...Hurd and Austin have been around long enough.....since the Cowboys have put the time in developing them, I would expect that both are ready to contribute. Stanback will and should be allowed one more year....I think next year is when we need him to contribute.

As far as the DL goes...I think they pretty much know what they want to do....Canty will be extended.....but the Cowboys need to find out about Hatcher....they know all they need to know about Spears...so either they like Spears or they don't....if they don't....they cannot continue to give him the bulk of the playing time at the expense of finding out what they need to Hatcher....that is very critical storyline that not many people are keying on.

Obviosuly Carpenter was a 1st round pick...so they are going to give him every chance to show something this year...but he won't get anymore time after this year...either he has to show he can help...or he will be gone. I am pulling for him because Zach Thomas won't be around forever, and it would be nice for Carpenter to slide right in. I am also pulling for Burnett because he is our best cover LBer. He is in the last year of his deal and will be given every chance to show he is worthy of a 5 year extension.

What do you guys think and have I missed anyone?

This is a very difficult thing to do, cutting bait. Especially when you have put so much time and effort into acquiring and prepping the "bait". It just goes to show you how valuable the talent acquisition and coaching portions of football are. Are the coaches we currently have better than those previous? Is Houck a Master at his craft where perhaps Sparano was only a "sufficient baiter"?

 

[Angus]

This is a very difficult thing to do, cutting bait. Especially when you have put so much time and effort into acquiring and prepping the "bait". It just goes to show you how valuable the talent acquisition and coaching portions of football are. Are the coaches we currently have better than those previous? Is Houck a Master at his craft where perhaps Sparano was only a "sufficient baiter"?

And remember, Houck has seen McQuistan only this year. No three year trial for him under Houck.

 

[NoLuv4Jerry]

if you read one of the articles that was printed today...it said dallas sources have indicated that reeves and jones would be 7th or 8th on the cb depth chart if they were in camp today. this is what i am talking about...we have guys that are rookies that ALREADY the team feels are better than guys that we kept around for 5 years. again, we got LUCKY that mike jenkins fell in the draft and pac man has been an off field nigthamre so far in his short career. so i started this thread to examine some other areas of the team and pose the question of who has had long enough to show what they can do. hurd and austin have to show this year. some of these ol have to show this year. spears needs to show that it is worth benching hatcher for a 3rd year in a row and never really finding out what hatcher can do. burnett/carpenter need to show the organization that there will be life after zach thomas. in other words...a lot of our backups were 1st day picks and/or have been in dallas for 3+ years, and it is time for them to show now because we cannot have guys on a 5 year plan only to find out they are really not that good

 

[Big Dakota]

We have a ton of draft picks next April. Time for some of those guys to step up or their replacement might get drafted.

The pressure will continue to grow on the last 10 guys on the roster. This roster is going to be crazy talented for the next several years.

 

[Seven]

if the Cowboys don't think Procter, McQuistan, Berger, Martin, Free can ever step in, then they need to move on.



We'd have to get Adbutcher, Hos and CC to suit up. Throw in TB and his cousin Petitti. Rack for insurance.
My God, man...........that's a lot of bodies.

 

[Big Dakota]

if the Cowboys don't think Procter, McQuistan, Berger, Martin, Free can ever step in, then they need to move on.



We'd have to get Adbutcher, Hos and CC to suit up. Throw in TB and his cousin Petitti. Rack for insurance.
My God, man...........that's a lot of bodies.

You're not taking into consideration Crazy can play 3 positions at once

BTW, where the heck has CC been? Camp maybe?

 

[Seven]

You're not taking into consideration Crazy can play 3 positions at once

BTW, where the heck has CC been? Camp maybe?

:laugh2: I should remember these things.

He's been around.............sparingly but yeah, I'm not sure.

 

[MONT17]

I understand what u r sayin and that's where the line the cowboys only draft backups comes from. Look at og and mlb on this team 2 very easy positions to fill in the draft the cowboys have signed like 6 guys to fill those spots in recent years. At some point u have to draft young players who can start if not u sign zach to replace akin or big to replace rivera yearafter year after year and u wonder why everyone so bent on getn a big time wr to replace terry glenn, its from yrs and yrs of over evaluation its the culture of the Cowboys. I know why Bill did it his ego and I understand why Jerry did it he didn't have Jimmy. I so far up the cowboys arse I don't have time to compare what they do to other teams but watchin green bay I tend to wonder about the bench talent we need to step up

 

[CaptainQuint]

should be given extra time, because his career at Weber State was so brief,
and because they moved him around so many times...and because Parcells was so fascinated with his footwork...or something. And I think he doesn't cost much to keep. Carpenter also has been moved too much, and the linebackers ahead of him aren't perfect. After 3 years, you guys probably would have thrown Romo overboard, too.

 

[DaBoys4Life]

i Like the patriots way of business I'm not to high on the 3 year rule. System > players.

 

[NoLuv4Jerry]

I understand what u r sayin and that's where the line the cowboys only draft backups comes from. Look at og and mlb on this team 2 very easy positions to fill in the draft the cowboys have signed like 6 guys to fill those spots in recent years. At some point u have to draft young players who can start if not u sign zach to replace akin or big to replace rivera yearafter year after year and u wonder why everyone so bent on getn a big time wr to replace terry glenn, its from yrs and yrs of over evaluation its the culture of the Cowboys. I know why Bill did it his ego and I understand why Jerry did it he didn't have Jimmy. I so far up the cowboys arse I don't have time to compare what they do to other teams but watchin green bay I tend to wonder about the bench talent we need to step up

i don't want to speak for you....but I think you are saying that we make drafting a WR more complicated than it has to be....and I agree 100%. The Packers line 5 guys up and let them play. I don't when they got them or how they got them, but they let them play. The Giants Super Bowl hero was a guy that might not even make the team....but there he was on Super Bowl Sunday making one of the greatest catches in Super Bowl history. The Giants have drafted Sinorice Moss, Steve Smith, and Mario Mannigham over the last 3 years....all 2nd round picks...it looks like they missed on Moss...but Smith made plays last year and I think he will be good...and Manningham certainly was worth a 2nd round pick. Heck even the Steelers have been using premium picks the last couple of years on WR. I hope what we are doing works out, but at some point you just have to put they guy out there and let him play. You cannot tell me Marquise Colston, as a 7th round pick, was flawless. But Sean Payton put him out their and he has been productive while playing through his mistakes. We cannot continue to nitpick everything about Stanback as a reason not to let him get some snaps. He needs to play in 4th quarters of blowouts....he needs to play entire halves of preseason games.....he needs to play. We were lucky in the 90s to line up with Micheal Irvin and player X on the other side. With Nocacek working the middle. But this is a different era of football. And to put maximum pressure on a defense you need to spread the field at times and put them on their heels.