Which has been better: CB or S?

[RS12]

Have we given up a play over 30 yards yet? If so, it doesn't seem like it. For years it seemed we got toasted at least 3 times a game.

Broaddus mentioned in one of his columns yesterday that particularly in GB Marowelli rushed only 3 or 4 and dropped 7 or 8. Resulting in fewer chunk plays and a need for opposing teams grind with just underneath stuff.

 

[Craig]

Jones moving church and wilcox to SS has made a big difference. Just because Claiborn has been their best player, ill go with CB. I dont really separate the two though. Just like i dont separate tackles from ends.

 

[Old'Boyfan]

During Sunday's game Aikman mentioned several times how GB's receivers weren't getting open and replays proved that point. It was real impressive given the poor pass rush. It seems that all our DB's have stepped up their game, across the board. I'd be hard pressed to say which, safety or corner, has been the best.

 

[Rogerthat12]

Jones moving church and wilcox to SS has made a big difference. Just because Claiborn has been their best player, ill go with CB. I dont really separate the two though. Just like i dont separate tackles from ends.

Carr to RCB has helped as well.

 

[Idgit]

Safeties for me. The whole secondary has played well, as everybody is saying, but putting Heath and Jones in the slot when Church and Mo went out and Rodgers having all day to throw and still living to tell about was impressive. Jones is that guy with range and coverage ability we've been looking for for years. He's quietly putting together a really nice sophomore season.

Overall, though, it's been the tackling from both position groups that I've been impressed with. We're making teams dink-dunk between the 20's and then tightening up when it counts. Other than the blown coverages when we were blitzing early, we're not giving up big plays. Not having a 100 yard receiver on us at the bye here has been impressive given some of the guys we've faced.

 

[pancakeman]

Big plays have been made by both safeties and corners, but what is most impressive of late is that opponent QB's just don't find anyone to throw to (even if their protection substantially shuts down the rush). Credit across the board for that. It's not that the best of the secondary is that good—it's that the worst of the secondary is that good. No weak links to pick on.
It's been said, but not enough, that Brown has been a sparkling draft gem, though overshadowed by Dak.

 

[ConstantReboot]

Safety play has really improved. But the corner play has also done its job. You hardly see teams anymore throwing up jumpballs for easy touchdowns against us. We are just a hard team to pass against because were forcing QBs to scramble or go to their outlets. Thats a testament on how great our defensive backs have been playing. Byron Jones play especially have elevated this defense. He may not be flashy. But taking away the deep ball and TEs allows for Church and Wilcox to roam more freely. This has turned into INTs and disruptions against our opponents.

 

[Fla Cowpoke]

I think the corners have been better. The safeties have had a few missed plays and busts.

No, on to more important things: where is your game review @FuzzyLumpkins ?

 

[Denim Chicken]

The ranginess of Byron Jones has allowed the CBs to play more aggressive.

 

[BAT]

Scale of 1-10 for each player, 10 being excellent.
Safeties: Jones 9.5, Church 8, Wilcox 5 = 22.5 total
Corners: Claiborne 8.5, Brown 8, Carr 5.5 = 22 total
They are real close but love what our safeties are doing with cover and tackling responsibilities. I give safeties the edge.

Would give Mo a 9 and Brown a 7.5 (hitter but coverage can improve). Cant stand Carr, consider him weak link but would still give a 6.

But Wilcox has been the biggest improvement, next to Mo. Wilcox is actually playing fly paper man coverage and regained his ability to explode into ball carriers AND make the tackle. He gets a 7 from me. Edge to safeties. Coaching change to Jackson has paid monster dividends.

 

[Doomsday101]

Would give Mo a 9 and Brown a 7.5 (hitter but coverage can improve). Cant stand Carr, consider him weak link but would still give a 6.

But Wilcox has been the biggest improvement, next to Mo. Wilcox is actually playing fly paper man coverage and regained his ability to explode into ball carriers AND make the tackle. He gets a 7 from me. Edge to safeties. Coaching change to Jackson has paid monster dividends.

I agree with you and while the man coverage is playing great I'm shocked at the Cowboys zone coverage. I have watched so many years of seeing us get shredded when playing in zone. Guys pointing fingers because someone blows the assignment. This season I am seeing discipline in the secondary guys are maintaining their responsibilities
The ability to play zones in Marinelli defense is critical.

 

[Zekeats]

rushing 3 and dropping 8 to cover 5. That is what has been getting things done to be honest. At some point though when you play the elite QBs you are going to need to rush more and trust your guys to cover 1-1.

 

[CWR]

I think, as a whole, the CB's have done better, but only slightly, as both units have done very well:

Mo has been a blanket more often than not and has forced QBs/receivers to attack the slot (Brown) TE (Jones) or other side (Carr). When he is targeted he is getting his PBU's or playing extremely aggressively and making the tackle at the point of attack. He is also closing in on defenders on flat routes and screens better than I've ever seen him do it before.

Carr has been Carr. At times blanketing his guy, other times getting beat. He's had far less PBU's than Mo and plays less physical, but is a very solid number two. He is awesome in Zone, imo, where Mo shines in man.

Brown, let me tell you. He is the real deal. I watched two separate plays where he closed in on the receiver on short pass routes to the flat, where he was playing slot and covering mid field. I mentioned this in the GDT. He has been beat, but he's a rook. He plays fierce and is a sure tackler. But he closes in on the ball with elite vision and speed.

For the S unit, Jones is a pro bowler. He doesn't get int's but Wilcox just got one, so if anything, what does that tell you? He blankets TE assignments and can remove WRs from the game. He had two key PBU's last game and never quits on a play. His range covers up the deficiencies of Wilcox, allowing Wilcox to stay within his own game, smaller area of assignment (zone), and not have to overreach, or overplay/overthink which often times in the past got him beat.

Church is our most underrated defender and has been absolutely awesome this year. Also a sure tackler, and is finally making reads with somewhat consistency. His angles to the ball holder have been much better and he is putting himself in position to make plays in the open field.

Overall, Fuzzy, this unit (DBs) is an above average unit. If we had any sort of exterior pass rush (or even consistent interior) we would be a top 5-7 defense, with the DB's we already have.

We must attack DE in next year's draft and free agency, along with SS and CB2/3 (Mo should be re-signed, and Carr, too, for the right [small] price).

So ecstatic with our DBs

Also, music to my ears @FuzzyLumpkins, that we're getting another one of your gems this week (Fuzzy's Thoughts)

Hellz to the yeah!!! Can't wait

Yes sir! Great post, is Church a free agent also?

 

[CWR]

Broaddus mentioned in one of his columns yesterday that particularly in GB Marowelli rushed only 3 or 4 and dropped 7 or 8. Resulting in fewer chunk plays and a need for opposing teams grind with just underneath stuff.

One of the few seasons I can remember bend dont break actually working.

 

[Trouty]

Yes sir! Great post, is Church a free agent also?

Yes, Rise, he is. He will be 29 in his 2017 season. I think we should re-sign him (@bkight13 would be able to tell you a good package for a player of his caliber), but we need to attack SS in the top 3 rounds or a top SS in free agency.

Church has been a damn stud, if you ask me, Rise (this season). And S age better than CB (you often see older CBs transition to FS) so if he continues to have a good year, he may want decent money (3-3.5aav). We need an elite SS and an elite DE. We must find either in free agency or draft. If we get those two, we are immediate SB contenders, it's not even close. And that's with the linebackers we have.

Amazing DB's that are physical can do wonders helping out the LB core. We have Lee, and god willing, Jaylon. If Jaylon recovers, it's a wrap, dude.

ETA -- (not at you @CowboysWillRise -- we must attack defense this coming offseason (draft). We must be players in free agency, as well. We cannot sit back while others sign big names. Not when we are this close. We have a fantastic core and one or two key signings (not talking about going the NYG's route, a lttile more subdued) will put us over the hump

 

[big dog cowboy]

CB.

Still not a Wilcox fan.

 

[JBell]

There is no one you can pick on for easy first downs.

Claiborne and Carr will make your outside receivers work. Brown is playing like a five year vet while manning the slot.

Jones will lock up your TE/Slot WR or erase any deep throws in deep center field.

Church is being asked to play less man coverage and using his instincts and tackling ability to make plays.

It's a great formula right now. And when we get Scandrick back, that'll give us the depth needed on Sundays in case one of our CB's gets hurt again. Don't wanna see Heath playing slot CB ever again.

With that said, I'm giving the edge to the safeties. All three CB's have played really well, but Church has had some game-altering turnovers and Byron Jones has been the MVP of the secondary.

 

[darthseinfeld]

Which unit has been better in your view?

On the one hand you have the S with primarily Jones Church and Wilcox,

on the other you have Claiborne, Carr, Brown?

I have an opinion but I am going keep it to myself for now other than to say I think both units are playing at a high level.

I'll give my opinions on how I think they are doing in Fuzzy Thoughts which I should have out by tomorrow.

Hard to say really. The CBs have looked very strong in a variety of ways and have had some impessive games against very strong WR's

However, I do wonder if part of it is if they are playing with more confidence thanks to Jones play in at Safety. They seem to be much aggressive this year and I think the aggressivness has been key

Honestly dont have an awnser for you

 

[reddyuta]

Easily Byron jones,we have been crying out for an athletic Free safety who can make plays for more than decade.

 

[Hailmary]

I view both units as one.