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Why Hasn't Dalton Shultz Signed A Long Term Contract Yet

Discussion in 'Overtime Zone' started by Vinnie2u, Apr 7, 2022.

  1. CowboysExchange

    CowboysExchange Well-Known Member

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    I could argue that Schultz dominated Philly w 4 tds and that philly was a playoff contender.

    But everybody on God's green earth that actually watched the games knows that Philly was dessimated by injuries for the 1st 4-5 games and couldn't beat Sam Houston college when we played them the 1st game.

    The 2nd time we played was the last game of the season and they rested all of their starters

    But 4 tds against a playoff team sounds like a dominant performance.

    Those other 31 teams coaches arent sdupid.

    He's a 4-5 TD a year player that thrives against weak teams.
    Last edited: Apr 12, 2022
    Flamma likes this.
  2. CowboysExchange

    CowboysExchange Well-Known Member

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    I woulda went right out and snatched up Jared Cook for 5 million who is a veteran and a gamechanger.

    I woulda took that 5.8 million savings and used towards signing Cedrick Wilson who was a Gamechanger.

    Then I almost have 2 gamechangers for the price of 1 non gamechanger.

    I'm not looking for a Te to catch 70 balls or duplicate Schultz or Wittens reception stats.

    I just need a Te that can catch about 40 balls per year and about 15-20 when it really matters. I need a big jumping red zone target.

    I'm moving the ball between the 20s with my wrs and rbs.

    I'm not overpaying a Te that (doesn't draw much coverage) but my wrs can't get open (repeat that again)

    Then I'd try to get Woods in the draft. Then ya got a proven veteran cook teaching a rookie woods. If they can't go up and get a ball I'm not paying more than 5 million

    I'd rather use Noah brown at te
    Last edited: Apr 12, 2022
  3. CowboysExchange

    CowboysExchange Well-Known Member

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    I just don't believe the way we use our tes is a winning formula.

    I don't believe in using the same 12/11 personnel scheme every week.

    And I don't think throwing checkdown passes to tes with 10.9 yard averages is a winning formula either.

    #82 was a pretty good possession receiving te in his prime and overtargeting him got us NO WHERE. The more receptions he had the less we scored and Lost

    I think I'm the only fan in this forum that wanted to keep Martellus and move on from Witten.

    0 Superbowls
    0 Conference Championships
    1 te playoff TD in 25 years in a losing effort
    0-1 game winning plays by a DC tight end in 10+ years.
    No consistent or good drafting and no trading or fa tes
    No Competition at the position for 15 years
    No talent at the position for 8+ years
    4-5 tds a year avgs by our te core for years
    Our #2 te played 35% of passing snaps and avg'd under 5 receptions a year

  4. CowboysFaninHouston

    CowboysFaninHouston CowboysFaninDC

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    I don't think Cook is a game changer. he is also 35.....and he is only going to be slower and getting worse. so having another less-than-Witten is not going to help the team. I think Schultz is effective in his role and in our offense we need some security blanket like him for Dak. Romo had Witten. Aikman had Novacek, and before that the security blanket was Cosbie......

    There was no reason we couldn't sign wilson as we have the cap room. we didn't need extra cap to sign him, we just didn't want to pay his price. I don't think Wilson is a game changer. he is a good 3rd WR, that can start if necessary while the starters get back. even if we signed Cook and let Schultz walk, we wouldn't sign Wilson, that was evident from begining.

    and like I said, its over paying by 2-3 M, given I think Schultz is better than Cook. much more effective.

    and we probably will draft a TE. that looks like the plan. given no long term deal was offered to Schultz....but how do you know we get Woods in draft? how do you know he is going to be good? draft hasn't happened and we don't know how its going to work out.
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  5. kskboys

    kskboys Well-Known Member

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    Yeah, this might be true, but what you're missing is that the franchise tag not only gives us a year to evaluate Schultz, it also gives us time to look for another talented TE.
  6. kskboys

    kskboys Well-Known Member

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    And if you think Shultzy can't block, Cook's blocking makes his look like Larry Allen!!!!!!!

    Cook is a WR playing TE.
  7. CowboysExchange

    CowboysExchange Well-Known Member

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    Cook made the game winning td catch against us last year but it was negated by a penalty lol

    And hes made game changing and game winning catches every year.

    He made the miraculous game winning catch against us in the playoff game against Green Bay

    Cook catches alot more deep balls and 50/50 balls and draws defenders away from the wrs even at 35

    Schultz doesn't come close to having the complete receiving skillsets as cook. He doesn't draw the same coverage either. So it's like comparing an apple to an orange. Neither are the greatest blocker.

    I wouldn't bring in cook to throw him a bunch of wide open screen/checkdown passes on 1st and 2nd down and try to overtarget him like Schultz or Witten either.

    Winning in the NFL is predicated upon making big plays and the catches that matter.

    Gronk didn't have the greatest season from a production standpoint when he started at Tb but come playoff time and in the Superbowl he made 2 tds.

    The quality of the te catches far outweighs the quantity of catches when it comes to tes. Imo

    How vital is a Te that has made 0 game changing plays and only scored 2 tds in 12 games vs non Division opponents????

    If we utilized Schultz like Gronk or Cook got utilized he'd prolly have like 30-35 catches

    Alot of Schultz non checkdown production is just a byproduct of our wrs not being able to get open and the fact that he's drawing alot of blanket coverage and no top cover guys and only avg 10.9 per reception doesn't make a great case for using the franchise tag or utilizing him as a main target either

    But I do see some of your points and yes it's highly doubtful that a Te is is gonna get drafted and start right away. It's usually about a 2 year window on a Te so we prolly should have been drafting tes 7-8 years ago
    Last edited: Apr 13, 2022
  8. Hook'em#11

    Hook'em#11 Well-Known Member

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    Because he knows there's no future for the Super Bowl in Dallas. Not now.. Get another good season under his belt and he will possibly get to a team that actually cares and tries to make the Super Bowl.
  9. CowboysExchange

    CowboysExchange Well-Known Member

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    Wilson stepped up and made some clutch plays last year that won us a game or 2.

    7 million for a #3wr trying to get a #2 wr contract is pricey though I Agree.

    The point I was trying to make is I'd rather have 2 guys that can step up and win a game or 2 for us for nearly the same price.

    I don't want a witten'esque te that can lead the league in rinky dinky 10 yard receptions between the 20's that's overtarged and over involved in our passing attack.

    I want an alpha te that can go up and get a contested ball in the red zone and make some big plays that win games.

    Schultz is the 5th best receiver on any given play when he's on the field with only wrs and rbs. He's just not drawing much coverage.

    I'd rather have Rudolph for 5 million, Howard for 3 million, Jesse James for 3 million or any other mediocre te catching 30 balls a year than Schultz catching 78 balls for 11 million

    I'm not gonna scheme my offense and skilled player Snapcounts around a mediocre te that has no business being on the field on 3rd and 16 or 3rd and 26 or in the red zone unless he has those skillsets.

    I don't think Schultz stats were as detrimental as some are suggesting.
    Last edited: Apr 13, 2022
  10. CowboysFaninHouston

    CowboysFaninHouston CowboysFaninDC

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    yeah. I am not sold on a 35 year old TE at the end of his career, because of a couple of catches you picked out. what about the rest of his game? didn't schultz catch a few game winning TDs? you prefer cook. I get it. but I am not sold. the answer is drafting one and covering your bases until you draft one. if Cook was all that, then these other teams who also tagged their TEs, would jus take the same route. the fact that Cook is still available, says a lot.

    comparing Cook to Gronk....Gronk was Elite and even now among the best. this is not fair to Gronk. and if Gronk would be willing to come here (which he is not), I would take him over Schultz 8 days a week.
  11. CowboysExchange

    CowboysExchange Well-Known Member

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    Im not comparing Cook to Gronk. Just the way they are utilized. They don't catch alot of gravy screen passes like that.

    Are you gonna be happy if Schultz catches 78 balls next year??? Is it a winning formula????

    On paper Schultz was better than Gronk and Cook.
  12. CowboysFaninHouston

    CowboysFaninHouston CowboysFaninDC

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    I am not saying Wilson didn't step up. he did. he had a few good games. I was hoping if/when we let cooper go that we will try and keep Wilson. I thought his range was going to be in the 5-8M range and he got 7M. I was disappointed we let him walk, given we have 25M in cap space. we created a need where we didn't have to. Stephen went cheap with Wilson, which tells me they are not about winning and they are about making money, increasing profits.

    and I want an Elite TE, but they all have 15+M contracts. unless you can find me an Elite TE, schultz is in the second group of TEs below elites....

    I would rather stay away from Howard as at this point he is a has-never-been. barely a back up TE at this point in his career and just a name that got drafted high and people still cling to some fantasy that he will be any good.he was the 3rd TE on his team. taking approach of cheap TEs like the ones you listed, is no different than our current cheap approach of WR......Rudolph has been worse than Schultz. and in our offense would have become a 7th option (sarcasm). I am not advocating for schultz, or want us to give him a large contract. its just that he is best of the bunch of the FA TEs and its not a question of money as we have cap space. our owners, just decided to go cheap this year. I wouldn't mind having Cook as a second TE. it would be a great move on our part going into the draft. I wouldn't have minded signing a center or guard in FA and not have to go in draft with a bunch of needs in so many positions. but that's Stephen and Jerry for you.
  13. CowboysExchange

    CowboysExchange Well-Known Member

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    I'm guessing you don't like Cook because of his age and blocking. He's prolly not that Ironman everydown possession receiving te #82 was (10 years ago)

    But I doubt many would say Schultz has better red zone, deep ball, or vertical skillsets???

    Schultz is more one dimensional than Cook as a pure receiver imo.

    There's only so much pie to go around. If you want a winner at a key position you have to establish a winning culture or you have to pay them, draft them, or aquire them. Or piece their skillsets in a contributory system together like ne does or we did our rbs last year

    Gronk played for 10 million and he's still a winner.

    But you can't overpay for a mediocre te (not a winner) and go cheap at wr (not a winner) also. imo

    Buts it's way easier to replace a wr or rb in the draft than a Te.

    I think Cook would be an awesome pick up to use on 3rd down and in the red zone. He can make those plays that the Jason Wittens and Dalton Schultz of the world never coulda woulda shoulda

    But we've never done it

    Of course we haven't been very relevant either. Js

    I'll take cooks plusses and minuses over Schultz's Schultz's plusses and minuses

    You put 3 steaks around him at wr like last year and I betcha he'd make Schultz look like the Waterboy

    I just hope the Rams don't snatch him up for a measely 5 million.
    Last edited: Apr 13, 2022
  14. CowboysExchange

    CowboysExchange Well-Known Member

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    You either got a winning formula or ya don't

    I think our formula is to do what we've always done at te which is emulating an everysnap Ironman checkdown te

    I think a contributory te group is gonna be vital going forward
    based upon or failures from the Past

    I'm not a fan of Schultz as being the one and only te. There's too much meat left on the bone when ya get down to the red zone and ya need an Aaron Hernandez or Jimmy Graham.

    Or it's 3rd and 16 and you want to use a Te vs a 4th wr
    Last edited: Apr 13, 2022
  15. KJJ

    KJJ You Have an Axe to Grind

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    I wouldn’t bet on it.
  16. CowboysFaninHouston

    CowboysFaninHouston CowboysFaninDC

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    Gronk went cheap, because he made his money. he wanted to play with brady and he wanted another title. its not about the money. He would never ever come to dallas to play with Dak. never.

    Cook is not good in blocking. same as Schultz.

    at this point, he is not the deep threat or vertical threat that he once was and he played with Stafford. with Dak he would be much less. his catch rate is not that good anymore, which tells me he is having trouble getting separation.

    I really wanted us to keep wilson and that would have been a good core to have for the next three years. letting wilson walk was a mistake.

    there is a reason Cook is still sitting out there. there is a reason the other teams tagged their own TEs and not sign cook to cheaper contract. I think Schultz is a bit under rated. he can do more, if Moore and Dak can utilize him.

    personally I take Schultz over Cook at this point. even on a one year contract.
  17. CowboysExchange

    CowboysExchange Well-Known Member

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    Both have skillsets you could piece together and make a Winner with but neither are stand alone everysnap tes. Imo I'll give Cook an edge because he's actually done it and has more complete receiving skillsets

    One kinda picks up where the other leaves off.

    That's like saying we'd rather have Zeke than Pollard. When ya know we COULDNT BE SUCCESSFUL without BOTH

    More integration with the te core altogether would be better imo I'd use more 4 wr sets and dual RB formations also.

    Sprinkle looks more like a jumper then Schultz

    We got a bunch of dead weight practice squad te backups holding down roster spots to execute the 12 personell and Terrance Steele has better production at te js
    Last edited: Apr 13, 2022
  18. CowboysExchange

    CowboysExchange Well-Known Member

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    I just don't think Schultz is that feared as a receiving threat. I think defenses dared us to beat them with our tes which led to more opportunities for completions for Schultz and less to our better wrs.

    We went 6-6 against non Division opponents and were 1 play away from losing to San Diego and New England who shoulda won those games.

    On the Cook TD that got negated and the diggs pick 6 or lack of getting a first down. Belichek made some questionable coaching moves that cost ne the game. Both opponents had a big upper hand.

    I think if we had gone 4-8 against non Division rivals and finished 10-8 we wouldn't be having alot of the conversations we are right now. It's coulda woulda shoulda I know but let's face the facts that our division was pure trash when we played them and went 6-0

    Washington was missing Logan Thomas and several key players too. Not that it mattered but we weren't the typical 12-6 team
    Last edited: Apr 13, 2022
  19. Carson

    Carson Well-Known Member

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    The teams that usually spend high in free agency aren't contenders outside of the Rams who have almost zero draft picks
  20. CowboysFaninHouston

    CowboysFaninHouston CowboysFaninDC

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    some of that has to do with Moore. some of that has to do with Dak. some of that has to do with OL.....teams started to figure out they can pressure us with 4, 5 up front and even stop the run and don't need to allocate 7 players to create pressure. that allowed them to play deeper, and drop 6,7 into coverage and take the WRs out of the game and thus force throws underneath. Dak became gun shy as he was afraid to take risks the second half of season and got worse as it went along. on top of that our running game was struggling and thus a lot more passing and same thing, predictably teams rushed 4, or 5 and flooded the lanes.

    we didn't do well against better teams, except maybe Chargers and NE, but both of them early in the season. we just weren't good all around in second half of the season except against division teams that were under manned or playing back ups.


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