Why the "Dak is elite" narrative is so flawed

[MountaineerCowboy]

OMG not this again.

he is not a loser...he just didn't win a championship...so he is not a champion. know the difference.

and what did Marino do? was it his fault? compare that to Dilfer.....I asked this before. if at the time, not having a crystal ball and you had a choice to choose one that would help your team win a championship. which would you choose?

I probably know your answer. you have a time machine. you would go to the future, would see dilfer won one, then you would come back and choose Dilfer and call him a winner

And I have told you plenty of times I would chose Marino.

If a crystal ball was available I would chose Dilfer.

I don't know why you keep bringing that it. It doesn't change the fact that Marion never lead his team to a championship.

 

[morat1959]

Yeah I’m sure Dak should take some pointers from the likes of you…

Whoever puts Ryan Fitzpatrick and MVP in the same sentence or references such nonsense should never be taken seriously again.

Same goes for those who put Dak and MVP in the same sentence.

 

[Doomsday101]

If Hall Of Fame isn’t elite in your book then I’d suggest you should reevaluate .

I did not say HOF player is not elite. I do think there are guys in the HOF like Namath and frankly I don''t think Warren Moon was elite But by and large yes I think HOF players including QB are elite.

 

[MountaineerCowboy]

At least you understand your role here. I admire someone who recognize their place.

And your role is getting butthurt at everything I post then getting schooled by me.

Imagine THAT being your role

 

[Diehardblues]

And your role is getting butthurt at everything I post then getting schooled by me.

Imagine THAT being your role

 

[Denim Chicken]

Dak broke some franchise records in 2021. I'm not here to deny that. What I will deny, though, is the significance and relevance of those records.

QB stats in 2021 are very disproportionately inflated, even compared to ~15 years ago. Take a look at this:

In the 2005-2006 season

• 11 QBs passed for more than 20 TDs. One threw for 30+TDs (C. Palmer).
• Not a single QB threw for over 4,500 yards. Only two QBs threw for over 4,000 yards.

In the 2006-2007 season

• 10 QBs passed for more than 20 TDs. One threw for 30+TDs (P. Manning).
• Not a single QB threw for over 4,500 yards. Only two QBs threw for over 4,000 yards.

"Greatness" is relative to the the era of NFL that a QB plays. Style of play and pass-happy rules in 2021 makes the NFL a drastically different league than it was even 15 years ago.

In the 2021-2022 season

• 19 QBs passed for more than 20 TDs. 9 threw for 30+TDs.
• 6 QBs threw for over 4,500 yards. 10 QBs threw for over 4,000 yards.

And for those who will invariably try to "get me" by pointing out the 17 game schedule this year, more QBs threw for 30+ TDs in 2020 than 2021 and more QBs threw for over 4,000 yards in 2020 than 2021.

If he were teleported to 2005 and became the Cowboys starting QB, Dak would throw for 19 TDs and ~3,400 yards. That's just the reality. He'd be the equivalent of Kerry Collins or Gus Frerotte. A $40 million Gus Frerotte LOL!

People need to stop conflating gaudy passing stats to greatness. Greatness is much more nuanced than the # of passing TDs a guy has. Great players have "it" when the pressure is on. Dak doesn't.

Watch this video.. it summarizes what I'm saying very well

This is a silly was of looking to the question. So instead of comparing Prescott to his contemporaries (like comparing Qbs since 2016, for instance) you attempt to compare 2 seasons 14 years apart, somehow under the incorrect supposition that anyone is making the argument that the franchise records he broke is the evidence of his greatness (I have not seen anyone make this argument). In fact, I'd like you to find more than 5 posters that would even call Dak elite--there is a new thread daily trying to say he's not, but is anyone actually arguing that he is? I don't think so.

If you look at QBs since 2016, you'll find Prescott top ten is most relevant categories (wins, yards, passer rating, comp %, int %, yards per game)

 

[MountaineerCowboy]

Well, that's mature

 

[Ranched]

These threads are comical.

How about it? Filled with whining trolls.

LOL. Probably looks like him too!

 

[G2]

How about it? Filled with whining trolls.
LOL. Probably looks like him too!

It's gotten pretty pathetic.

 

[CowboysFaninHouston]

And I have told you plenty of times I would chose Marino.

If a crystal ball was available I would chose Dilfer.

I don't know why you keep bringing that it. It doesn't change the fact that Marion never lead his team to a championship.

so is Marino a loser? or is he not a champion? where did you end up on this?

 

[thechosen1n2]

I just cannot take a Cowboys/Yankees/Lakers fan seriously.

It screams that you just like whoever is most popular and trendy.

I get that. Im a Cowboys, Lakers , Rangers fan...The first 2 Ive been fans of since 78/79, and I dont change. (Well Lebron wearing purple and gold made me want to stop) Ive been a Rangers fan since 86/87.

Though I know my fandom is legit, I can understand your take. The appearance is can raise questions.

 

[MountaineerCowboy]

so is Marino a loser? or is he not a champion? where did you end up on this?

If you're didn't lead your team to a championship you retire a loser.

I don't mean a loser as in your stink or you're not good enough. Loser to means simply means you didn't win.

Maybe you think setting your family up for life makes you a winner, or great stats, or a HOF career. And that's perfectly okay.

Personally, I think winning makes you a winner.

 

[SultanOfSix]

I remember Jerry saying we do not need an oline we have Tony Romo

This right here "GM" Jones in a nutshell.

 

[mattjames2010]

If you're didn't lead your team to a championship you retire a loser.

I don't mean a loser as in your stink or you're not good enough. Loser to means simply means you didn't win.

Maybe you think setting your family up for life makes you a winner, or great stats, or a HOF career. And that's perfectly okay.

Personally, I think winning makes you a winner.

LOL again, it's not golf. Please dude, just stop embarrassing yourself and find another hobby. This isn't for you.

 

[MountaineerCowboy]

LOL again, it's not golf. Please dude, just stop embarrassing yourself and find another hobby. This isn't for you.

I can't help but feel like the people that don't believe winning makes you a winner are nothing but participation trophy people themselves that feel like they need to defend others that feel short.

 

[mattjames2010]

I can't help but feel like the people that don't believe winning makes you a winner are nothing but participation trophy people themselves that feel like they need to defend others that feel short.

How many more times does this need to be explained to you? The game is a team sport with multiple moving factors and luck within every single game. Pinning wins and losses on a single player is absolutely idiotic and removes all context and factors that went into it.

Imagine pounding the table screaming that Foles and Dilfer are the REAL winners and Marino is the loser. Stop digging yourself into a deeper hole. It's embarrassing, we all view it as embarrassing, and with each passing post it just gets worse. Learn to know when to stop and call yourself out for being stupid and improve.

 

[atlantacowboy]

Dak broke some franchise records in 2021. I'm not here to deny that. What I will deny, though, is the significance and relevance of those records.

QB stats in 2021 are very disproportionately inflated, even compared to ~15 years ago. Take a look at this:

In the 2005-2006 season

• 11 QBs passed for more than 20 TDs. One threw for 30+TDs (C. Palmer).
• Not a single QB threw for over 4,500 yards. Only two QBs threw for over 4,000 yards.

In the 2006-2007 season

• 10 QBs passed for more than 20 TDs. One threw for 30+TDs (P. Manning).
• Not a single QB threw for over 4,500 yards. Only two QBs threw for over 4,000 yards.

"Greatness" is relative to the the era of NFL that a QB plays. Style of play and pass-happy rules in 2021 makes the NFL a drastically different league than it was even 15 years ago.

In the 2021-2022 season

• 19 QBs passed for more than 20 TDs. 9 threw for 30+TDs.
• 6 QBs threw for over 4,500 yards. 10 QBs threw for over 4,000 yards.

And for those who will invariably try to "get me" by pointing out the 17 game schedule this year, more QBs threw for 30+ TDs in 2020 than 2021 and more QBs threw for over 4,000 yards in 2020 than 2021.

If he were teleported to 2005 and became the Cowboys starting QB, Dak would throw for 19 TDs and ~3,400 yards. That's just the reality. He'd be the equivalent of Kerry Collins or Gus Frerotte. A $40 million Gus Frerotte LOL!

People need to stop conflating gaudy passing stats to greatness. Greatness is much more nuanced than the # of passing TDs a guy has. Great players have "it" when the pressure is on. Dak doesn't.

Watch this video.. it summarizes what I'm saying very well

Well, this and the fact Dak got to face bottom 10 defenses for 9 games plus the Philly JV squad in the finale. I think its very apparent that his stats are padded and he struggles against anybody with a pass rush.

 

[mattjames2010]

And I have told you plenty of times I would chose Marino.

If a crystal ball was available I would chose Dilfer.

I don't know why you keep bringing that it. It doesn't change the fact that Marion never lead his team to a championship.

If Marino was on a team with the Ravens 2000 defense, he would have won a Super Bowl. HURR DURR.

We're making progress here.

 

[MountaineerCowboy]

How many more times does this need to be explained to you? The game is a team sport with multiple moving factors and luck within every single game. Pinning wins and losses on a single player is absolutely idiotic and removes all context and factors that went into it.

Imagine pounding the table screaming that Foles and Dilfer are the REAL winners and Marino is the loser. Stop digging yourself into a deeper hole. It's embarrassing, we all view it as embarrassing, and with each passing post it just gets worse. Learn to know when to stop and call yourself out for being stupid and improve.

You can explain it all your heart desires, but you're not going to change my mind. Winners win and losers lose.

Keep trying though.

 

[MountaineerCowboy]

If Marino was on a team with the Ravens 2000 defense, he would have won a Super Bowl. HURR DURR.

We're making progress here.

He wasn't, so he didn't.

So it's irrelevant, like you.