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Barr Breakdown USC game-Video

Discussion in 'Draft Zone' started by cowboyschmps3, Apr 19, 2014.

  1. morasp

    morasp Well-Known Member

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    Trade back add some extra picks and take the best pass rusher on the board. If there isn't a consensus take the two best options and let them compete. Then you've got some extra picks to get that WR, G/C, LB, and DT
  2. dexternjack

    dexternjack World Traveler Zone Supporter

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    Think ya missed my point. Was saying if Teddy is there at 16, should we take him, not trade away our pick. If we did take him at 16, was saying that Dallas can potentially try and trade back into the late 1st and grab Ford or Nixx.

    Or, I just didn't understand what you were trying to say and I missed your point [IMG]
  3. jobberone

    jobberone Right turn Clyde Staff Member

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    I see Donald as a solid mid first round to higher pick. He has the motor, speed, quickness and agility to play the 3 in our defense. I also think you can put him wide in pass rushing situations. There will be some OTs who will create problems for him and vice versa. The more I look at him the more impressed I am.

    Barr is a situational pass rusher at DE and looks like a Will right now or if he has the instincts a Mike. He'll have trouble shedding blockers his first year. He's a tweener but if they think he'll get stronger then I'd have no problems drafting him. He's a lower round first or upper second IMO but he's higher than that on the mediots lists so.....
    ConstantReboot likes this.
  4. tm1119

    tm1119 Well-Known Member

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    Demarcus Lawrence is downright slow off of the line compared to Barr. Stronger? Yes, but he's not the same kind of pass rusher
  5. DuDa

    DuDa Well-Known Member

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    Barr is not an elite pass rusher yet. He is a great athlete who is learning how to be a pass rusher. Barr ceiling is obviously much higher but DeMarcus Lawrence is a pretty good pass rusher as well.

    Not many players reach their full potential and that worries me when thinking about drafting players like Barr. Don't get me wrong, I really really like Barr I just don't see him being there at 16.
  6. ConstantReboot

    ConstantReboot Well-Known Member

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    I'm all for g
    I'm also impressed by Donald. I would not mind if we take him at 16 if his still available and hope that happens. I think he will flourish in the NFL with his quickness and his smallish size because olinemen would have a hard time using their hands on him.

    As for Barr I see amazing talent. He is very raw with his passrushing skills. But that is something a good Dline coach such as Marinelli can teach. Raw talent you can't, especially with that type of speed. He will certainly need to bulk up to play DE. But I think he fits more within a a 3-4 alignment as a linebacker.
    jobberone likes this.
  7. jobberone

    jobberone Right turn Clyde Staff Member

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    I agree. Right now he's a better fit in the 3-4 but I like versatile players. Give him some playing time at DE in pass rushing situations from either stance and some at the Will. You can't teach speed.
  8. speedkilz88

    speedkilz88 Well-Known Member

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    http://cowboysblog.dallasnews.com/2...sive-end-and-thats-something-im-all-for.html/
    ConstantReboot and jobberone like this.
  9. btcutter

    btcutter Well-Known Member

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    This is what too much time will do. We tend to over analyse a player.

    Barr is a player that has kept up his production despite elevated expectations for last two years (unlike many players). Last year if he had came out he was slotted to be in top 10 but he returned to play another years in college as he understood that that was his 1st yr on the defensive side of the ball. Year two....he did better. Just two years on D!

    I think he will be better than Jordan and maybe even Mingo. Both went top ten. He was consensus top 10 (15) for last two years and now 1 month before the draft we are dropping him out the 1st round?!

    Yes, he played OLB in 3-4....but you can't teach natural pass rushers.....I trust Marinelli to work wonders for this kid. If Marinelli can make our street pick up DL Salvie, Hadyden etc better...imaging him working with a top level talent.

    Will Barr struggle with big OT in NFL? Sure. But he will learn from the best and he's got the talent/tools to get better in a hurry. I think it would be a giant mistake to pass on Barr if he's there at 16.
    unionjack8 likes this.
  10. jobberone

    jobberone Right turn Clyde Staff Member

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  11. jobberone

    jobberone Right turn Clyde Staff Member

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    I don't disagree here although I'd take Donald before Barr without a moment's hesitation. In three years we'll get to see what's up with these two.
    Gaede likes this.
  12. btcutter

    btcutter Well-Known Member

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    I wouldn't be upset if we pick Donald. But I won't trade a pick to move up to get him either.

    He's a player that may have peaked or close t0 maximizing his talent IMHO. Now, that's pretty darn good already and he certainly is doing well. He may defies the odds and become the next Glover or Randle. Good for him.

    With my 1st round pick I like to not only get production in college but high ceiling on the next level as well and that's what Barr gives me. Does he have weaknesses in his game....sure...but does he have the physical talent to overcome them....absolutely with coaching and experience. We won't see what Barr can do unless he get the coaching and strength training he needs. And we won't likely a finished product for 2-3 yrs. But instead of playing LB where he has to think.....Marinelli will tell him " go get the QB and if the RB comes your way then tackle him too !" . Barr will be given the green light to rush without hesitation. He instantly upgrade our pass rushing ability which we sorely need.
    ConstantReboot likes this.
  13. jobberone

    jobberone Right turn Clyde Staff Member

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    I agree with this, too. I would agree that Donald is further on the curve than is Barr. He's also a better player right now and I suspect an impact player from the get go. I do think he will get better. He just doesn't have as far to go. And I also think DE is generally a more impact position just less so in this defense.

    But I don't like to get too wrapped up in where a player lines up as defining him. Players also play different techniques thruout the game so I don't define them by technique either. I see this guy as being a little versatile in being able to line up occasionally outside. He could play some two gap but only if you got forced into it and that's out of position for him. He could play some STs as well.

    I don't see any particular downside in choosing Donald over Barr esp in the first couple of years of their contract.

    I won't be upset if they pick Barr.

    There are some players later in the draft who can play DE. Sutton is fine for a SDE. But I wouldn't disagree with someone saying a pass rusher should be favored over a 3. In this instance not sure there would be a huge difference with most WDEs.

    I'm also a huge believer is synergy along the DL. The more players pushing and disrupting the more likely others will do the same until the total is greater than the sums of the parts. If you look at some of the best DLs you'll see good to great players along that front four.
    Bigdog24 and ConstantReboot like this.
  14. ConstantReboot

    ConstantReboot Well-Known Member

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    Great find and thanks for sharing that article. I'm glad that the Cowboys brought him in to take a look. I think he is very raw. But that can be taught by a good teacher in Marinelli.

    I don't know what people were saying about the video against USC. I saw Barr as a speed rusher who was doubled teamed on occassion to keep him in check. He looked to have very good closing skills but needs coaching to get him up to par in the NFL.

    I remembered when D. Ware was drafted. Everyone wasn't so high on him because he was nothing more than a speedrusher. Lots here wanted Merriman. Look how that turned out.
  15. lostar2009

    lostar2009 Active Member

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    Yea i get your point but 16 is good spot for the cowboys this year. There is potential for a little bit of everyone to be there. I just do not think we can get a first rounder this year from a team looking for a qb...and to trade down would take take away from the quality of selections. The team should stay put this year, that is all I was saying.
  16. dexternjack

    dexternjack World Traveler Zone Supporter

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    Not saying we should shop the pick to a team looking for a QB. I was asking if we should take Bridgewater if he is there and use our later picks to move back into late 1st or early 2nd is all.

    I agree, I like where we sit and don't want them moving up or down from 16. Just get the BPA there and run with it. My whole scenario assumes Teddy is there....do we draft him or go with BPA other than a QB while sitting put.
  17. speedkilz88

    speedkilz88 Well-Known Member

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    Yeah, that article was based off this one from the Cowboys website:
    http://www.dallascowboys.com/news/a...ues-Barr/e66c6747-75c4-42ec-9d46-fb5273655001

    I really don't get the complaints about him being raw. Yes, he is raw. But the guy got 23 sacks at UCLA in his only two years at the position. That's a lot of talent already showing. Just think what pro coaching from Marinelli and pro conditioning could do for the guy. He's also suppose to be a leader in the locker room and the weight room. If the guy was a more polished player the Cowboys wouldn't have a shot at him at #16.
    btcutter likes this.
  18. CowboysYanksLakers

    CowboysYanksLakers Well-Known Member

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    Barr is 6'5 and 250 lbs... I think he can add 5-10 lbs and be a nice RDE.
  19. ConstantReboot

    ConstantReboot Well-Known Member

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    Actually Im giddy of the prospect of being able to get him. I think Dallas would be a perfect place for him and he would be a perfect suite for Dallas. Its like a perfect storm. Sure he is raw. But we have a coach that can help him get better. D. Ware left a big spot to fill in our of D. He will have every opportunity to shine like what Ware did for us. I think he is top ten material. Just hope the Giants don't scoop him up before we do. Or else he could be wrecking havoc with his speed.
  20. speedkilz88

    speedkilz88 Well-Known Member

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