Bryan B doesn't think Dallas will sign any Tackle Free Agent

Discussion in 'Fan Zone' started by Romonater, May 2, 2013.

  1. stasheroo

    stasheroo Well-Known Member

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    Another contributor to years of futility and failure.

    If you were happy with his contributions last year, just say so.

    Don't hide behind semantics.
  2. stasheroo

    stasheroo Well-Known Member

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    Good news.

    Make the cut and be forced to get a deal done with Clabo.

    If this team can spend $1.3 million on a special teams tackler, they can pay Clabo's asking price.
  3. DenCWBY

    DenCWBY Well-Known Member

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    This for sure.
    Also no team gets through a season without injuries on the line. If anything a Clabo upgrade would provide depth and during the December run, you don't want to start shuffling your line around any more than you have to.
  4. Idgit

    Idgit If you food, you gonna be ate. Staff Member

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    Yeah, but criticized by whom? A bunch of teenagers with ban-Jerry avatars and the local Dallas media who have a vested interest in trying to make Valley Ranch look like a circus.

    On the other hand, there are a number of people who have beens saying all offseason that the problems last year were most significant at C and RT. And what does the team do? Draft the best C on their board in the first round after maneuvering to get into position to do so, and then contract people after the draft about addressing RT in FA.

    Now, that might not be aggressive enough for you, and I understand that. But we've got salary cap limitations. Would you agree that, were it not for the bogus $10M cap penalty, Tyson Clabo would have a star on his helmet, too? I think there's a good chance he would.

    Yes, this same group. Though I don't recall them saying the group last year was the answer. I think last year they were doing some hole plugging and giving some players value try-outs at a couple of positions because there was a much more obvious and important personnel need in the secondary.

    It's been mentioned, but Callahan is in year two. During that short time, we've brought in two FA OGs and drafted a first round C to go with our top ten draft pick of a LT. Yes, categorically, I like Bill Callahan as an OL coach. And I think it's straight-up ridiculous to close your eyes to his potential for fixing an OL just because you don't like the way the draft broke or because you think we should have more cap room than we actually do to bring in more expensive FAs.
  5. stasheroo

    stasheroo Well-Known Member

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    Until its done, it's not done. I'm not assuming that they'll do the right thing considering they haven't for years.

    When you sign, pay, and start two free agent guards, that's exactly what you're saying, in actions if not words. And neither showed they were an answer at either spot.

    And what at all did Callahan show us?

    Who got better?

    What players developed?

    Who looked any better than before?

    I'm hoping he shows us something. And he needs to.

    As for cap room?

    When you have enough to tender a JAG like McCray $1.3 million, you had better have the money to pay a huge upgrade at starting RT.

    You're a bunch of idiots otherwise.
  6. jjktkk

    jjktkk Well-Known Member Zone Supporter

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    The Oline was bad last year. But injuries played a part in that. I know your part of the whiners brigade, but if you tried to be a bit more realistic, you should realize, because of injuries, that it was awfully difficult to evaluate your projected starters on the Oline. As far as players developing, I have heard mutiple reports, that Leary has improved during the offseason, so theres that. I would believe, because of the Free news, that a vet. Olinemen will be added pretty soon. Instead of whining about the Oline in May, why not wait and see the finished product in September? If the same problems exist this time next year, I'll be right there with you complaining about the Oline.
  7. FLcowboy

    FLcowboy 2016 was a gift, 2017 is a mission Zone Supporter

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    Stepping back to 2011, Free was an above average tackle. albeit on the left side. Kosier and Dockery were the guards. In 2012, Bernadeiu (sp) and Livings were signed, and Free was moved back to the right side.

    If Costa is at Center, and Frederick a guard, does Free become a better player because of that? I think so. Whether Free is left or right tackle also might made a difference. Jerry was keen on moving Smith to the left tackle spot because he wanted a franchise left tackle. Maybe he already had one. Maybe a serviceable left tackle, and a franchise right tackle was the answer.

    Free has till the first of June to decide if he wants to play for less, or watch for nothing.
  8. conner01

    conner01 Well-Known Member

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    lloking from a cap perspective getting free to take a pay cut and keeping him is a better solution. but if he refuses a pay cut and is cut we will have no choice but sign a rt even if just to be the swing tackle
    they are looking ahead at singning lee,cater and dez and free could help or hurt our ability to do that. from that perspective having to cut free is the worst option
  9. conner01

    conner01 Well-Known Member

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    can't wait till the first og june. a decision has to be made now in order to find a replacement . you can still designate him a june 1 cut but the decision is needed very soon

    ABQCOWBOY Moderator Staff Member

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    I guess I'm part of the whiners brigade as well because I've seen all to many wait and see Mays, only to be witness to craptastic September OL production. It would be one thing if this were a season or three but we have had OL issues but this problem has existined on this team for about 15 years. I guess I can go it alone on the Whiners brigade because this team does not deserve any slack from me or any other fan where the OL line is concerned IMO.
  11. jjktkk

    jjktkk Well-Known Member Zone Supporter

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    I understand the frustration, I really do. But I don't get the whining about the Oline, when we haven't even seen this years version.

    ABQCOWBOY Moderator Staff Member

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    I get that but so what. This team does not rate any slack in this area. Years and years of neglect, compounded by mismanaged cap has gotten them and the fan base to where we are now.

    If you want to say you are content to sit back and see how it works out, that's OK. I don't have a problem with that.

    If you want to say that other fans are whiners because they have grown tired of watching this team make the same mistakes on the OL for over a decade, I have a problem with that. It's not like the benefit of the doubt hasn't been afforded this team for a very long time. The fans are tired of seeing the same same. I can understand that too and if they are done with the benefit of the doubt, I can't really blame them for that.
  13. Beast_from_East

    Beast_from_East Well-Known Member

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    Yea, it sounds like Marinelli is where Jerry got the idea that the DL is the strength of the team.

    Sorry, but I don't buy that at all.
  14. jjktkk

    jjktkk Well-Known Member Zone Supporter

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    A decade? This Oline was was pretty solid just a few years ago. The problem started when the Oline got old/injured, whatever you want to call it. Jerry, because of his failure to develop Olinemen, tried to change it on the fly, and we as fans, are still seeing this transformation to a, hopefully, better Oline.
  15. Hoofbite

    Hoofbite Well-Known Member

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    By themselves they might mean nothing. The Vikings were at the top of the list. Of course we would know that's likely a result of being a run-oriented team who still really couldn't be stopped in that area.

    The collective though is pretty damning and disregarding a handful of collectively bad aspects is being willfully ignorant to how bad they were. If everything says they're bad, they're bad. The only reason it didn't show up in the passing game was because of the QB.

    All those grand offensive stats came from the QB. The same QB who's been running for his life constantly over the past 3 seasons.

    TOs are killer. The team was towards the bottom of the league on both sides of the ball. They need to improve in this area, I agree.

    That doesn't change my opinion that the OL needs to be better.

    So you're content? You want it upgraded but you're neither disappointed or pleased so far? Where would you be had they not drafted Frederick and where would you be had they drafted an OG or signed one so far?

    I can tell you where I'd be. A good OG, preferably an OT at this point would make me pretty happy. Replacing half the dead weight would please me because I'm quite certain that is what I said it would take a while back.

    Without Frederick, I'd be disgusted. I'm still not pleased because RT is a huge hole and I realize that 4 guys who need to be replaced can't be replaced by 1. Perhaps with a new RT one of the OG could be serviceable with strong play beside him but 4 guys who have instill zero confidence turning into 3 is step int he right direction but not quite enough for me to actually think the results will be dramatically better.

    Where you at?

    Adding another RB after losing one. Adding a redzone target would be great if this team didn't have any. They have plenty. Dez, Miles, Witten are all guys who can get open and Dez can take the ball from any player out there.

    Martellus was supposed to be a huge redzone target, he didn't even get on the field half the time.

    None of that has to do with the OL either. If I'm disappointed in the OL up until now, you come back with Dallas having drafted a backup running back and a backup tight end?

    No, I don't trust the FA acquisitions. They weren't that good.

    I have trust in one player and that's Tyron. Other than that, I have hope that Frederick is the player the team thinks he is and a whole lot of concern that much of the same horrid line that went out there last year is going to be out there again.

    And no, at best you can't they say they have ignored the OL.....which is far from making it a priority on the level that they have made the WR, CB, and TE positions......which is what should have been done when it was blatantly obvious that the guys up front couldn't get it done. And that's almost across the board, not just 1 or 2. In 2011 only Tyron was consistent across the whole season. Since that time they have now drafted two 1st round OL. Thankfully. Although even if they hadn't this discussion taking place right now would be little different.

    Callahan hasn't even seen a player he drafted for this team on the field yet. And it's not so much that I don't trust Callahan. He can be great coach and that's fine. Houck was the best OL in the game before Callahan arrived.....or so that was the common perception until it was clear that the OL was horrid.

    But it's the very fact that Callahan is viewed as the best OL coach that makes me skeptical of this team's OL. The front office thinks they can supplement talent with tutelage. "Coach 'em up, Callahan". It's one thing to bring in young promising talent to teach and develop. It's another to acquire seasoned vets who are pretty marginal, at best, and ask the guy to turn them into starting quality players.
  16. stasheroo

    stasheroo Well-Known Member

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    How do you feel now that Clabo has, in fact, signed elsewhere?

    Better, or worse?
  17. Idgit

    Idgit If you food, you gonna be ate. Staff Member

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    These threaded discussions get unwieldy, so I'm going to condense it back down to this segment. I agree with you that the QB makes the offense look a lot better, btw. I'm thrilled we extended him, and I think the team should ride him as hard as they can.

    As for the OL, I've said all offseason that upgrading RT and C were what needed to be addressed. I'd have been ok with a move that put Costa back in and C and made Bernadeau a full time C to push him if we'd added an OG and fixed RT in VFA or the draft. I'm ok with Frederick replacing Costa and us addressing RT some other way, too. I'm even ok with giving Parnell his shot at RT, but we need a better backup plan in place than we've got now in case he fails, because there's a decent likelihood he'll either fail or one of our two starters misses time with injury at some point.

    We're upside down on Free's contract, and shouldn't be beholden to it if we can get rightside up. If he restructures, I could be ok with that depending on the restructure. I'd prefer we make him a June 1st cut and just get in someone who can play RT and OG in a pinch do be a backup.

    At OG, in general, I believe it's a position where you can get by with ok players if you have the C and the OTs. I think Livings was fine for us. I think Bernadeau looked like a backup player on a decent unit, though I do make a small allowance for him early in the year because he really didn't have time in the starting lineup, he did have a surgery, and his play did improve. I think the team thinks Leary could be a developing player, and, if they do, I'd like to see them give him a shot now.

    So, yes, I'm content at OG. All that said, you look to upgrade wherever you can. And Brandon Moore is sitting out there with experience playing at a high level in just this system. He can be brought in affordably, I believe. And he could either knock Livings off the roster if a young guy shines in camp, or he can start at RG if a young guy does not shine in camp. That means he's not necessarily a progress stopper. And he can be added without juggling the makeup of the OL too much (given his experience with Callahan). That makes a possible interior OL of Livings, Frederick, and Moore. We could do worse.
  18. HanD

    HanD Well-Known Member

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    no one is hiding behind semantics. if you have an agenda and don't like him say so, don't lie about his contributions or lack of contributions. The guy is well respected league wide. The talent he had was subpar and injured. Not only that but both tackles switched positions with two new guards being added to start the season. My analysis of his effort here is still undecided based on one season, not multiple. If you've already made your conclusions, that's fine.
  19. stasheroo

    stasheroo Well-Known Member

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    Not 'lying' at all. You tell me what great contributions he's made since he's been here? Who or what got better under Callahan?

    He was at one time. Last year sure didn't help his reputation.

    Guards that he signed off on being added here. Not a vote of confidence thus far.

    I'm undecided as well, but unimpressed thus far, so I'm not calling Callahan part of 'the solution' just yet.
  20. jjktkk

    jjktkk Well-Known Member Zone Supporter

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    Not thrilled about it, but unless they bring some other vet. OT, Its Free or Parnell as your RT.

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