Deadliest U.S. sniper murdered at a gun range in Erath County

Discussion in 'Off-topic Zone' started by k19, Feb 2, 2013.

  1. dexternjack

    dexternjack World Traveler

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    Valid points and in no way do I want ex-military to feel out of place. I have a brother in the Marines and a brother-in-law who flies helis out of Miramar. You have no idea how much I value our military.

    For those who have mental disorders from war, they need help, not just from us, but from the government. My point is..don't put a person who has that disorder in a situation that can grow out of hand quickly, i.e. do not be in a firing range with a gun in his hand. Get him some counseling first and make sure they are on the right path.

    The sex offender was probably out of place but was trying to make a point with an example that would get across quickly. I did not mean to infer young girls(pedophilia), was for those men who engaged with 15-16 yr olds. It is still a crime.

    ABQCOWBOY Moderator Staff Member

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    I don't know enough about the story to say if he was diagnosed or not. That's part of the sad and unfortunate story I guess. I only know what I heard reported, which was, both were from the same home town and that the parents of the Marine in question asked Kyle to try and help him.

    This entire thing is unfortunate and I'm sure that a clinical diagnosis would have probably been the best case scenario but that's part of the problem I think. What we have is a lot of Vets trying to help other Vets because there is not enough help out there for them. You end up with the very best of intentions but the results, at least in this case, were horrible.

    It is a tragedy. No question.
  3. ninja

    ninja Numbnuts

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    "The help they need..." which is what? There is no one size fits all. The doctors themselves don't even know what to do imo. There is no cure, no magic pill or medicine. The symptoms may lay dormant for a long time and then all of the sudden come to the surface. Mental illness is a cruel disease; even if you identify it, there isn't a whole lot that can be done in a lot of cases. Some of these soldiers may have had hidden issues even before entering the service.

    Yeah, the government has a responsibility to a point. Uncle Sam can throw money at the issue (and he does). But, that doesn't guarantee anything. I don't know the answers. And I don't think the medical field knows a whole lot more. If the patient refuses treatment, there ain't squat you can do. What good is paying a therapist, if the patient doesn't show up?

    Sad dilemma. I don't have the answer.
  4. CanadianCowboysFan

    CanadianCowboysFan Lightning Rod

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    Arguably your best post ever.
  5. Cajuncowboy

    Cajuncowboy Preacher From The Black Lagoon

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    They are often just shrugged at because of the very thing you mentioned. They don't know what to do with it so they do nothing. And because of that they often feel isolated and cornered. When that happens they lash out and they revert to what they know. And in too many cases it's violence. The admin has diverted so much funding into black holes yet one of most valuable assets, our vets, suffer.

    I don't have the answer either but there should be a lot more focus on these kinds of things than there currently is.
  6. BraveHeartFan

    BraveHeartFan We got a hat. I want a ring.

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    Extremely sad and terrible situation. My heart and prayers go out to the family and friends of those killed.
  7. arglebargle

    arglebargle Well-Known Member

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    Veterans have had problems with funding for support services for decades. Everyone wants to talk the talk, but they don't want to pay the bill. It's extra difficult with the long deploments and increases in survival with serious injuries.
  8. Hoofbite

    Hoofbite Well-Known Member

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    The hard part with PTSD is that it's associated with other psychiatric conditions such as depression, anxiety and substance abuse. You're basically dealing with a conglomerate of some of the most debilitating individual mental illnesses that are out there.

    I think they could do more although I'm not entirely informed on everything that it is they do. As I said above, I know someone who every day has to deal with trying to secure benefits for these guys. I've heard stories about veterans who fought years ago, some as many as decades, who are struggling to receive benefits because their injuries sustained in combat apparently weren't convincing enough.......I guess. IIRC, one guy I was told of still has shrapnel from his time and he's fighting like hell to get his benefits to come through even though he fought a long, long time ago.

    To be honest, I think the US has largely ignored many of their vets which is a pretty sad thing to have to say about the country you live in. Not all of course but there are guys out there who are honestly struggling and it just shouldn't be the case.

    I think with PTSD they need to have intense follow up periods after service. Mandatory counseling and assessment for all sorts of mental illnesses and substance abuse disorders. Do they have this currently, I honestly don't have an idea. They need to teach these guys how to reintegrate into society and provide them with the support network and access to medical attention that they deserve.

    Perhaps they need to transition these guys from combat zones to areas where there isn't fighting going on, possibly in another country, and have them "unwind" and acclimate to life without gunfire before bringing them home. Provide them with the structure and routine that they are used to but in an environment where they aren't constantly under the threat of attack.

    They could probably limit the duration of a single stop to a greater extent as well. Rotate them and get them to mentally "come back" a little bit. Again, this is an area that I don't have a lot of knowledge in so maybe these efforts are made. If they are, I'm not sure the type of results they're looking for are being realized so maybe they should step up the attempt a little bit.

    Like you, I don't have the answer either. I can only throw out some ideas but I think something absolutely has to be done for these guys. I couldn't imagine being a parent and having to suffer through a deployment only to see my child come back unable to cope, ultimately harming someone else or even themselves. You think you're out of the woods and then the worst possible outcome hits you square in the mouth. It's saddening to think that people have to deal with this.
  9. Garland powerplay

    Garland powerplay Active Member

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    interested to find out true motive, read reports there was a bounty out from Iraqis ,enemies etc..
  10. a_minimalist

    a_minimalist Well-Known Member

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    his memorial is actually at Cowboys stadium; which is pretty cool to see the stadium used for something like this
  11. davidyee

    davidyee Maple Leaf

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    89 Likes Received not the sole failure of the Unites States.

    Canada has an equal if not worse problem. Where as your vets get much more publicity and recognition for their sacrifice here in Canada it's paid minimal lip service.

    We have a good Remembrance Day, but that is it. There are many vets suffering from the Afghanistan conflict, but we don't get media visibility.

    It's a thankless job quite frankly to be in the service. Untold risk and very little personal reward. To end your time of service fighting your own country for benefits is an insult if truth be told.
  12. BringBackThatOleTimeBoys

    BringBackThatOleTimeBoys Benched

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    Not so obvious fallout from this: vets have a higher unemployment rate than the general US population....this is going to increase hiring fears, even though only a small percentage have acute PTSD. :(
  13. Denim Chicken

    Denim Chicken Well-Known Member

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    It's hardly thankless, this Country worships the military.
  14. burmafrd

    burmafrd Benched

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    really. I guess some might think so. Respect yes from say 80% of the population.
    Worships? Don't know what country you live in but its not the US.
  15. Phoenix

    Phoenix Well-Known Member

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    Greggo has been live-tweeting the funeral procession today. Simply amazing to hear of all the good folk out to pay respects.

    Look him up on Twitter to catch up:

  16. 5Stars

    5Stars Here comes the Sun...

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    They held his service at Cowboy Stadium. (hope Jerry did not charge them any money).

  17. CowboyMcCoy

    CowboyMcCoy Business is a Boomin

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    Wouldn't this be primarily because they face challenges in terms of qualifications for other things like academia and high end paying jobs in the job market? I know. Some will take offense to this. But look who signs up for service after high school. It's the ones who have no place else to go and those who didn't get accepted to academia, et cetera, in the first place. I find this to be no surprise at all.

    I should point out that I'm speaking in terms of generalities before anyone's reflex tells me their specific, personal scenario. I know this isn't an across the board number, but neither is unemployment.
  18. CowboyMcCoy

    CowboyMcCoy Business is a Boomin

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    Some do for some reason.
  19. Cajuncowboy

    Cajuncowboy Preacher From The Black Lagoon

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    I guess you don't understand the difference between respect and honor and worship.
  20. CanadianCowboysFan

    CanadianCowboysFan Lightning Rod

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    I hope you are wearing kevlar to deflect the hail of bullets and missiles/missives about to come your way.

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