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Hill: Monte Kiffen won't force cover 2 scheme...interviewed w/JG and JG today

Discussion in 'Fan Zone' started by WoodysGirl, Jan 10, 2013.

  1. Risen Star

    Risen Star Likes Collector Zone Supporter

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    5.3 sacks.

    QB killer.
  2. perrykemp

    perrykemp Well-Known Member

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    I don't disagree.

    My point is this -- Spencer was IFFY on coming back even had the team stuck with the 3-4 due to the expectation that it will take $10m/year to resign him and he is basically 30 years old.

    The risk is resigning him at $10m/year even get's bigger when you add up he is closing in on 30, he played lights out in his contract year, and he you would be switching him to a 4-3 DE where he will be lining up across from hulking right offensive tackles just about 100% of the time who weigh 40-75 lbs more than him.

    It's a heck of a lot of risk for someone who is going to garner a ton of money on the open market as a 3-4 OLB.

    Yes, theoretically anything is possible with Spencer.... in the end, however, I believe his huge contract will not be worth whatever the Cowboys think he'll be able to contribute with his hand on the ground all the time as a 4-3 DE.
  3. Yoshimitsu

    Yoshimitsu Lurch

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    Spencer would be a powerful DE. Part of the reason he never had as many sacks as Ware was because he had more responsibilities dropping in coverage and playing the run. With him rushing the QB every snap his totals will go up. The only problem is the business side. How much money will he command?
  4. cowboysooner

    cowboysooner Well-Known Member

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    I won't be shocked by Kiffen using a 3-4 at times. If Bellichick can use whales in a 4-3 anything is possible.

    But I seriously doubt that if this was the plan that we would have attacked last offseason and honestly the last 7 in the same manner. You can change coaches and even get better ones but you have to keep the same scouting sytem- talent evaluation system. That system should maximize what the coaches you have want to do.

    Pittsburgh is Pittsburgh no matter if they have a guy as a walk around head coach who used to be a Tampa 2 defensive coordinator.
  5. Hostile

    Hostile Tacos are a good investment Zone Supporter

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    I'm going to say it this way.

    If Monte Kiffin were headed to Philly to be their new DC, I'd be damned worried. I don't give two hoots in hell about his age. Let others fixate on that. I wouldn't be certain they couldn't play for him or that he couldn't coach them.

    I refuse to fly the other direction just because he's coming here.

    I'll say it again, he is not even in the top 5 of guys I wanted, but there is not a doubt in my mind that he is one of the top DCs ever.
  6. perrykemp

    perrykemp Well-Known Member

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    I think he'd be a decent pass rushing 4-3 DE. I have no idea how we'd hold up against the run lined up across from RT play after play. A lot of the smaller 4-3 DEs get by on quickness -- think Mathis and Freeney. Spencer is a power player -- he's not particularly quick.

    Again, I think he'd be a decent 4-3 pass rushing DE. Nobody really knows how he's do against the run.

    Do you want to spend $10/m a year on a guy with those kinds of questions? A proven top-end 4-3 DE can be had at $10m/year. Why take a chance on unproven?
  7. Hostile

    Hostile Tacos are a good investment Zone Supporter

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    Good post.

    You know, I have mentioned Kiffin with Lebeau and Jim Johnson. Hoodie is the 4th guy that makes that grand slam. Everyone told me the Patriots Defense sucked in 2011. Look where they ended up in 2012. The guy is a master.

    Shame on me for leaving him out of the trinity.
  8. Yoshimitsu

    Yoshimitsu Lurch

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    He would be fine. Study the film and watch how powerful he is. You don't become a very good run stopper and not be powerful. Anthony Spencer is very underrated around here.
  9. Risen Star

    Risen Star Likes Collector Zone Supporter

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    I wouldn't want to pay him to find out. Too risky. Too expensive.
  10. perrykemp

    perrykemp Well-Known Member

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    I think Anthony Spencer was probably the best 3-4 LB in the entire NFL this year. I'm not underrating him at all.

    I'm just saying it's very risky to spend $10m/year on a guy who will be moving to the trenches full-time for the 1st time since he was in college. It's a whole another world playing on the DL fulltime.
  11. StanleySpadowski

    StanleySpadowski Active Member

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    The problem with Spencer is that he is not a pass rusher who can beat a tackle. You can count on one hand the times Spencer has beaten one one-on-one in his entire career.
  12. perrykemp

    perrykemp Well-Known Member

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    I was thinking the same but haven't looked at video to know for sure. I don't recall him lining up across from a RT and beating that guy for sacks much this season.
  13. Chocolate Lab

    Chocolate Lab Run-loving Dino

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    I wish people would quit saying this, especially supposed smart analysts like Sturm.

    A nickel defense with a four-man front is not a 43 defense. Lots of teams let their pass rushers get in a three point stance in the nickel but that's very different from your base defense being a 43.
  14. Risen Star

    Risen Star Likes Collector Zone Supporter

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    It's also risky to pay a guy coming off of a career year. He's doesn't have another even close to it.

    If they ever charged him with QB killing, he'd get off for lack of evidence.
  15. Fletch

    Fletch To The Moon

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    This! Pay the man. We lose Spencer, we lose on defense.
  16. cowboysooner

    cowboysooner Well-Known Member

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    Talent is not talent in any scheme. A great man to man corner may be lost in zone coverage, can't tackle or have any ball skills. Ronde Barber can play zone all day long but if you ask him to turn and run with Mike Wallace it's church.

    Anthony Spencer is the best or second best to Woodley 3-4 SOLB in the NFL. It is quite possible perhaps probable that he'll have real trouble as a base defensive end since those guys usually have 25lbs on him and longer arms. Getting off of a block from Witten is different that getting off of a block from Tyron Smith.

    Lavonte David was a beast with Gerald McCoy and Roy Miller in front of him taking up blocks. He'd have a hard time in a 3-4 with Lissmore as his nose. Geno Atkins would have a hard time as a 2 gap defensive end in Pittsburgh despite being a remarkable talent for the Bengals.

    Sure JJ Watt can do anything you ask him to. Patrick Willis, the same. But those guys are the exception not the rule. Lots of players are better with their second team because they were miscast in their role with their first team.
  17. Idgit

    Idgit Ice up, son. Ice up! Staff Member

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    That's the thing, though. Spencer's been a really good player the whole time. This year was statistically more significant because the sack number was higher. But the guy's been a force and a very steady player since the day he was drafted. It's only because of a poor decision on our part we're looking at paying him in the teeth of his best statistical season coming off of the franchise tag. We shouldn't be in this position in the first place.
  18. Yoshimitsu

    Yoshimitsu Lurch

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    I agree the contract situation and dynamics of it is a risk. It's only one because of the other terrible contracts that have this team strapped. Guys like Doug Free.
  19. Sportsbabe

    Sportsbabe Well-Known Member

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    That's what disturbs me. I'm so tired of recycling retreads. We need new vision and new blood. That's why we will always struggle. We don't prepare for the future. Old things pass away ... when are we going to step into the newness of life. There is too much young talent out there with young minds and young ideas.
  20. cowboysooner

    cowboysooner Well-Known Member

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    Great post. How many times did we line up in the 4-3 or 4-2-5 when the opponent was not in 3 wides?

    Not many.

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