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More Dwight Howard Rumors...**signs with Rockets**

Discussion in 'Sports Zone' started by ABQCOWBOY, Jun 17, 2013.

  1. ABQCOWBOY

    ABQCOWBOY Moderator Staff Member

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    Was listening to a report the other day and they were saying that one of the things that works against the Lakers or really, any California team, is the State Tax Rates. They were saying that an additional 30 Mil, after taxes would be closer to 15 Mil. In a state like Florida or Texas, you don't have that problem but, You do have very high Property Taxes but heck, in Cali, you have that anyway so that additional 30 Million is not as big of an incentive as you might think.
  2. Joe Rod

    Joe Rod When Keeping it Real Goes Wrong

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    Dwight is like David Robinson with worse free throw shooting and a much worse attitude imo. He can be a major force for a team winning a championship, but he will never get them over the hump as their "go to" guy. Until Dwight accepts that, he will be more of an obstacle to winning a ring than an asset and his teams will suffer for it.
  3. jterrell

    jterrell Penguinite

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    The main issue with Dwight is health.

    He is the best rebounder in the game when healthy.
    His interior defense is certainly better than all but a few guys and his rebounding puts him up with the best overall defensively.

    He does need to grow up and it'd be nice if he added some offensive elements to his game but make no mistake he is very, very valuable to any franchise.

    the lakers went from an open joke to a very competitive team as howard got his back in order. even sans kobe they were a difficult team to face the last half of the season.

    there are only 5 or 6 legit big guys in a given season and DH is definitely that plus some provided he isn't having back issues.

    i think he leaves the lakers and takes less money to do so just to shut people up about money. truth is the money difference isn't much anyways after an early opt out and taxes. it really is negligible.

    i think the clipper and rockets are favorites for him.

    i think the lakers will s&t him to get a start on rebuilding. they'll likely label it a 1 year turn-around project with kobe out hurt.

    whatever happens i hope it happens quickly come july. i dont want another 2 months of DH rumors.

    BTW, Houston isn't trading Harden for him. Can't see that happen in any way for any reason.
  4. Muhast

    Muhast Newo

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    Expect the Hawks to be major players in FA. They have close to $40 million in cap space, far more than any other team. They are targetting Howard/Paul both.

    If they miss out on either/both they are eyeballing Igoudala,Monta Ellis,and pretty much every good player available. They signed Budenhoser(former Spurs assistant) and their GM is trying to seriously revamp the roster.
  5. RastaRocket

    RastaRocket Sanka, Ya Dead Mon? Ya Mon.

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    It just needs to be a sign and trade because you would have bird rights transferring. Contracts would not need to "work" because if you have his bird rights then you can go over the cap. But there is no way LA would agree to a sign and trade with Miami for Bosh.
  6. jterrell

    jterrell Penguinite

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    Broussard reports Dallas is slight favorite and returning to Lakers not going to happen.

    Says DH likes Carlisle's system more than what Rockets run and wants to be the teams superstar. Likes Cuban's plan to pick his teammates in 2014.

    We'll see. I assume Mavs had 10% chance at best but again I can see why the Cuban argument could appeal to DH's ego.
    How many superstars get GM say and team has cap cash to add a max player?
  7. jterrell

    jterrell Penguinite

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    No. Neither team can make that trade because they are well over the luxury tax threshholds.

    DH can not go to Miami.

    from Larry Coon
    Starting in 2013-14, teams cannot receive a player in a sign-and-trade transaction (see question number 89) if their team salary is above the apron at the conclusion of the trade.
  8. ABQCOWBOY

    ABQCOWBOY Moderator Staff Member

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    I kinda think it comes down to the question of "What do you want to be when you grow up?" DH is saying that he doesn't want to play for D'Antoni, which I can understand, but if the Lakers make a move for another coach, would that reason change?

    DH did this exact same thing in Orlando. He threatened them multiple times, then stayed. I'm not saying he will do this now but I suspect this is more about trying to get a coaching change then anything. DH would be crazy to leave L.A. IMO. The Lakers are an organization that are not content to just field a good team. They want to win championships every year, which means that they are going to make moves to improve the team. As I have stated in previous posts, the Lakers are going to have cap and a considerable amount of it in the next couple of years. If he decides to stay, the Lakers will surround him with talent, just as they did with Chamberlain, just as they did with Kareem, just as they did with Shaq. If you really want to be one of the great Centers in the History of the NBA, then L.A. is the best place to get that done. It's not to say that he can't do it in another city but honestly, very few other franchises are going to do what L.A. will do to make sure he competes for championships year in and year out.

    JMO
  9. ABQCOWBOY

    ABQCOWBOY Moderator Staff Member

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    Latest trade rumor is Golden State trade for Harrison Barnes and Klay Thompson in exchange for the rights to DH.
  10. RastaRocket

    RastaRocket Sanka, Ya Dead Mon? Ya Mon.

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    LA would never agree to that trade. Golden State will need to include Bogut or Lee.
  11. ABQCOWBOY

    ABQCOWBOY Moderator Staff Member

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    They might agree to it. They certainly need the outside shooting of a guy like Thompson and Barnes is a guy who hasn't even started to tap his abilities in the NBA. at 6'8", he could be the third scorer at SF or he could play the 2 and create real matchup problems. You figure that if Kobe comes back, he won't be able to play the entire 82 game schedule. Barnes has a lot of the same skills Kobe does and could fit well. If the Lakers decided to sit Kobe and then turn him lose, Barnes could develop into the starter. They are not pieces that will be the dominating factors in a championship team, at least at this point, but they could be key pieces to a team like that. Lakers could elect to keep Gasol for his low post scoring and rebounding and then bring in a defensive rebounding center. Don't be surprised if the Lakers might look at Andrew Bynum. He's likely to be available now that Philly had traded for Nerlens. I could see the Lakers doing a deal for those two players.
  12. jterrell

    jterrell Penguinite

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    LA can't trade DH anywhere. He selects his destination then LA can try to make a sign and trade work.

    Unless DH decides he wants to go to GS anything else is just LA media nonsense.
    As of now GS doesn't even have a meeting set with DH apparently.
  13. ABQCOWBOY

    ABQCOWBOY Moderator Staff Member

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    That's not true. He's not free and clear till after July 1.

    DH could certainly put the Kibosh on any trade by simply refusing to extend but technically, the Lakers own his rights till July 1st.
  14. DFWJC

    DFWJC Well-Known Member Zone Supporter

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    There is a salary cap now....the most restrictive one ever. It is an entirely different era.

    However, LA will always have the allure that most other franchises can't match.

    As far as them trying to do all it takes win a title in the current era--I think many other teams can make the honest claim that they would do just as much as LA.

    But, as I said, LA does hold a built-in advantage of being in one of the two best markets and also having an almost unmatched history.
  15. DFWJC

    DFWJC Well-Known Member Zone Supporter

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    Paul is staying with the Clippers. Period.

    But it sounds like Atlanta is one of three teams in the running for DH if he leaves LA:
    Houston, Dallas, Atlanta.
  16. ABQCOWBOY

    ABQCOWBOY Moderator Staff Member

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    There has been a Salary cap for awhile now. While I would agree that it is more restrictive, I would not agree that other teams would or have shown that they can and will do as much as the Lakers would. In this very restrictive cap era, the Lakers paid a substantial amount, above and beyond the cap last year, almost 45 Million I believe. That would go up to just south of 70 if they did it again this year and that is a lot of money but, consider that unlike any other team in the NBA, the Lakers have a unique TV deal that pays them 3 Billion. The Lakers have more capital and have shown that they are willing to spend it.

    The Lakers will spend what it takes to surround a great player with talent in order to win championships if that player proves he is worthy of being a foundation piece.
  17. jterrell

    jterrell Penguinite

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    Nothing I said was untrue as you admit.
    Again, this borders on intellectual dishonesty. DH and his agent have stated they aren't extending and have in fact refused to do so.
    They don't need to kibosh anything, that's already happened.
    That is why there are zero rumors of any trade prior to Monday night.

    This will be a NEW contract, not an extension because that way makes him more money.

    DH is going where he wants. Lakers have zero leverage or power. The S&T rules have changed mightily in the new CBA.
    Lakers fans need to grasp the obvious. They have an aging, injured team with a mediocre at best coaching staff and no cap room.
    Lakers fans are delusional which makes quite a bit of sense after hearing LA media.

    LAL will be fortunate to get something useful from Houston, ATL or Dallas when DH bolts.

    91. Why would teams or players want to do a sign-and-trade?
    Teams benefit because they can get something in return for players they would otherwise lose to free agency. For players the benefits are limited. Under previous CBAs a player who qualified could receive a full Bird contract and go to the team of his choice, which encouraged the player to seek a sign-and-trade once he decided to play elsewhere. Under the current CBA a player receives the same contract via sign-and-trade (four years, 4.5% raises) that he could get by signing with his new team directly, and can receive a larger Bird contract only if he stays with his previous team. In addition, it is much simpler for the player to sign directly with his new team, as a sign-and-trade has to be agreed to by three parties rather than two. A player is really only forced to seek a sign-and-trade if he wants to go to a team that is capped-out (or doesn't have enough cap room to give the player his full starting salary) and can't sign him directly.

    Another factor encouraging a player not to seek a sign-and-trade is that his new team might be weakened by losing players or draft picks in the trade. So while a sign-and-trade is a useful tool when the team does not have the cap room to sign the player directly, the player and his new team have little reason to seek a sign-and-trade when the player can be signed without involving his previous team.
  18. jterrell

    jterrell Penguinite

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    Money is a very small factor in the equation.
    Teams over the luxury threshold *(4m above cap) are SEVERELY restricted in acquiring talent.

    Essentially limited to a 3m exception yearly and trades that fall within 10% salary differences or trades to teams with cap space that still maintain cap space after the trades.

    The Lakers haven't shown they'll spent Nets or Knicks money but who cares... those two are spending for mediocre play thus far.

    This CBA is CLEARLY designed to prevent buying a title.

    LA has plenty of drawing power but it needs a full rebuild if DH leaves and really even if he stays.
  19. jterrell

    jterrell Penguinite

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    Also as an added note many tenets of the new CBA didn't kick in until now or even next year.
    The cap penalties were specifically set to get more onerous.

    21. What is the "luxury tax?" Why does it exist? How is it determined? Who pays it?
    The luxury tax is a mechanism that helps control team spending. While it is commonly referred to as a "luxury tax," the CBA simply calls it a "tax" or a "team payment." It is paid by high spending teams -- those with a team salary exceeding a predetermined tax level. These teams pay a penalty for each dollar their team salary (with a few exceptions, see below) exceeds the tax level. The tax level is determined prior to the season, and is computed as follows:

    • For 2011-12 the league and players association agreed to use a figure of $70.307 million for the tax level.
    • In 2012-13 the tax level was determined by taking 53.51% of projected BRI (see question number 13), subtracting projected benefits, and dividing by the number of teams in the league1. For 2012-13 the tax level was guaranteed to be no less than $70.307 million.
    • Starting in 2013-14 they apply the same formula as 2012-13, except there is no guaranteed minimum.
    Starting in 2012-13, the tax level may be adjusted based on what happened during the previous season:

    • If the league didn't pay the players enough the previous season, i.e., if they had to cut the players a supplemental check to make their guarantee, then the shortfall, divided by the number of teams in the league1, is added to the tax level. For example, if the players are paid $15 million less in 2012-13 than they are guaranteed, then the 2013-14 tax level is adjusted upward by $500,000.
    • If there is an overage -- i.e., if the players were paid more (pre-escrow) than their guaranteed share in the previous season -- and the system is getting close to exceeding what the league can get back through the escrow system, then the tax level (and salary cap) may be reduced in order to put on the brakes (see question number 20 for more information).
    The amount of tax a team pays depends on the season, the team salary as of the team's last regular season game, and whether the team is a "repeat offender":

    • For 2011-12 and 2012-13, teams pay $1 for every $1 their team salary exceeds the tax level. There is no repeater rate.
    • For 2013-14 teams pay an incremental rate based on their team salary. There is no repeater rate.
    • For 2014-15 teams pay an incremental rate based on their team salary. They pay the repeater rate if they also were taxpayers in all of the previous three seasons.
    • For 2015-16 and all subsequent seasons, teams pay an incremental rate based on their team salary. They pay the repeater rate if they were taxpayers in at least three of the four previous seasons.
    Here are the tax rates beginning 2013-14:

    Team salary above tax level Non-repeater Repeater
    Lower Upper Tax rate Incremental maximum Tax rate Incremental maximum
    $0 $4,999,999 $1.50 $7.5 million $2.50 $12.5 million
    $5,000,000 $9,999,999 $1.75 $8.75 million $2.75 $13.75 million
    $10,000,000 $14,999,999 $2.50 $12.5 million $3.50 $17.5 million
    $15,000,000 $19,999,999 $3.25 $16.25 million $4.25 $21.25 million
    $20,000,000 N/A $3.75, and increasing $.50 for
    each additional $5 million. N/A $4.75, and increasing $.50 for
    each additional $5 million. N/A
    For example:

    • A team with a team salary $12 million over the tax level in 2011-12 pays a tax of $12 million.
    • A team with a team salary $12 million over the tax level in 2013-14 pays a tax of $21.25 million (the incremental maximum of $7.5 million for $0 to $4,999,999, plus the incremental maximum of $8.75 million for $5 million to $9,999,999, plus $2 million times the incremental rate of $2.50 for $10 million to $14,999,999).
    • A team with a team salary $4 million over the tax level in 2015-16 pays a tax of $10 million ($4 million times the repeater rate of $2.50 for $0 to $4,999,999) if they also were taxpayers in three of the previous four seasons, or pays a tax of $6 million ($4 million times the non-repeater rate of $1.50 for $0 to $4,999,999) if they were not taxpayers in at least three of the previous four seasons.
    When determining the amount of tax a team owes, the league uses its team salary (see question number 14) on the date of its last regular season game (i.e., if a player is traded away before the end of the season, then none of his salary is taxed), with the following adjustments:

    • Cap holds and exceptions are ignored.
    • Any "unlikely bonuses" (see question number 72) that were actually earned are added to the team salary.
    • Any "likely bonuses" (see question number 72) that were not earned are subtracted from the team salary.
    • Any trade bonuses (see question number 96) for players received in trade after the last regular season game are added to the team salary. This amount may be pro-rated -- see question number 97 for details.
    • Any amounts from settlements of grievances are added to the team salary.
    • For players who signed as free agents (i.e., not draft picks) under the current CBA, and make less than the two-year minimum salary, the minimum salary for a two-year veteran is used in place of their actual salary.
    • For minimum salary players whose salary is partially paid by the league (see question number 16) only the amount paid by the team (the two-year minimum salary) is taxed.
    • The salaries of players waived via the Amnesty provision (see question number 67) are exempt from the luxury tax.
    Here are the tax levels in each season, and the teams that paid the tax:

    Season Tax Level Taxpaying Teams (amount paid in $millions)
    2011-12 $70.307 million Lakers ($12.6), Celtics ($7.4), Heat ($6.1), Mavericks ($2.7), Spurs ($2.5), Hawks ($0.7)
    2012-13 $70.307 million
    In addition to the financial penalties, a number of restrictions are placed on taxpaying teams, which are described in question number 23.

    Where does the tax money go? This is described in question number 22.

    1 All formulas that divide by the number of teams in the NBA (currently 30) ignore any expansion teams in their first two seasons in the league.
  20. ABQCOWBOY

    ABQCOWBOY Moderator Staff Member

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    You said the Lakers can't make a trade with DH. I said that's not true because it's not. True or false, up to July 1st, the Lakers still hold the right to DH?

    Let me answer that for you. It's true.

    Why would Howard agree to a sign and trade? He would agree because he doesn't want to just sign with any team. Howard is not going to play for the Pelicans simply because they can afford him. Wake up. He want's to go to some very specific teams, of which, none have the cap to sign him outright. What does that mean? That means that in order to sign him, players must be traded in order to create space. That's what it means to sign Dwight Howard and that's why it would be smart of him to stay with L.A.


    Now, I know that in your head, you like to believe that the Lakers are pretty much screwed but as I've explained many times over, that's simply not the case.

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